shen Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Where there's a will there's a way. DB11 has a will to defend the officials, He'll come up with some way of supporting the referee. I mentioned that strictly speaking, the ref could justify his decisions with help from the rule book. It wasn't sensible refereeing, it was wrongly perceived, but the rules are open to subjective interpretation, which is the crux of the issue in this instance.
ScouseFox Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 I'm a referee and that referee is a nob. And he was stupid. So suck on that DB11.
Sparky Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 DB11, few serious questions. Are the Forest players well within to charge in to the net to get the ball ? Schmeical's throw has got the ball back towards the half way line far quicker than if the Forest lad had ran it back. And if were sticking to the letter of the law should the Forest lad be booked unsporting conduct for insisting on Kasper being sent off ?
Sparky Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 1 more. Do refs only take up reffing because A) They were shit at Football or B) They were bullied at school and it's a chance to get their own back on the cool kids
ScouseFox Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 I just do it so I have enough money to go out of a night. Good pay and it's quite fun to know you're always right, even when you're wrong, you're the referee so you're right. Great.
anotherharboroughfox Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Well no, because Kasper prevented the Forest players from retrieving the ball If you were at the game, this is assuming you weren't, it went straight to there centre back on the halfway line. Anyone see Lee Camp turn around to us and show 2-2 on his fingers, does that warrant any kind of reprimand?
DB11 Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 DB11 - Do you think that was a penalty yesterday? Because I can't see a way that any sane person could look at what happened and think that Mills deliberately handled the ball. I dunno I haven't seen any video of it. You're certainly living up to your reputation of defending the indefensible when it comes to referees. There's another poster on here who's a qualified referee, and he talks sense. He admits that you're mainly twats who can't do your job properly, as yesterday once again proved. And I'm sure he's the sort of referee that gives a free kick for a player shouting "my ball" or "leave it". He probably took the course for some money, and only referees kids football? But hey, he's qualified and has the same opinion of yourself, therefore he must be right. Where there's a will there's a way. DB11 has a will to defend the officials, He'll come up with some way of supporting the referee. Time and time again you are saying the same things. Only yesterday I mentioned this. I don't care if you abuse the referee, I don't care if you think he's right or wrong or biased against Leicester. Why should I care? All I do, is try to offer the alternative point of view as to why the referee may have done what he did, from my experience of being in the middle. I might not be right, but I'm just trying to help people understand what the referee may have been thinking, and why he may have made the decisions he did. How is throwing the ball towards the centre circle, getting it there quicker than any Forest player running back with the ball, delaying the restart? I haven't even seen the incident, but the referee may have felt that Kasper was kicking the ball away from the Forest players who were trying to get it, thereby delaying them from getting the ball. DB11 is having an absolute mare on this thread. I have respect for you lad for giving balance on referees because some of the attacks are just silly, but I honestly cannot see how that referee can be defended for the way in which he totally perverted the outcome of the game through not one but two appalling decisions in the space of 60 seconds. Take your head out of the sand because Moss was terrible yesterday. For giving my opinion? Then so be it. I'm not too bothered I'm not giving my opinion on whether Moss was good, bad or indifferent. I'm giving my opinion on why he may have made the decisions that he did. I'm a referee and that referee is a nob. And he was stupid. So suck on that DB11. Congratulations. DB11, few serious questions. Are the Forest players well within to charge in to the net to get the ball ? Schmeical's throw has got the ball back towards the half way line far quicker than if the Forest lad had ran it back. And if were sticking to the letter of the law should the Forest lad be booked unsporting conduct for insisting on Kasper being sent off ? The Forest players are entitled to retrieve the ball if they want. Kasper is not entitled to prevent them from doing so. Letter of the law? If, in the opinion of the referee, a player commits an act of unsporting behaviour, then it is a caution. Maybe the referee finds it unsporting, maybe he doesn't. This means he cannot possibly make a 'wrong' decision. 1 more. Do refs only take up reffing because A) They were shit at Football or B) They were bullied at school and it's a chance to get their own back on the cool kids I took up refereeing because when I was younger and watched my brother play football, I thought that looks good. I then took up playing (admittedly in goal) and was never really that good When we moved house, I left my old team and never really went to another one. I then carried on watching my brother, and I thought that it looked good to be in charge, so I asked a few questions and then began learning to referee. I believe referees in general take up football because they have a passion for it and want to be as involved as possible. If you're not playing, then the next best thing in terms of being directly involved on the pitch is refereeing. I think I've answered all the questions or posts aimed at me. If I haven't I'm not avoiding it I just haven't seen it
DB11 Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 If you were at the game, this is assuming you weren't, it went straight to there centre back on the halfway line. Anyone see Lee Camp turn around to us and show 2-2 on his fingers, does that warrant any kind of reprimand? I haven't seen it, no. I'm only going on what people are saying here (dead reliable then, I know ). However, this is also something we are taught... a controversial goal has just been scored and players from both teams are in a tight space (the goal net). There is the potential for something to flare up, so the referee's are told to be aware and cautious. Whenever a goal has been scored after a penalty late in the game, you always see the goalkeeper try holding onto the ball and the attackers trying to get it. This could be the spark that causes a mass confrontation, so the referee has to get in there quick and caution the goalkeeper for delaying the restart in play. Attackers are happy, as they have the ball back and so the situation diffuses. Maybe it was this, maybe the referee thought it was this... or just maybe, as I said earlier, Kasper had pushed the referee too far before the penalty was taken, and this was the slightest excuse the referee needed to punish Kasper.
Corky Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 The Forest players are entitled to retrieve the ball if they want. Kasper is not entitled to prevent them from doing so. Letter of the law? If, in the opinion of the referee, a player commits an act of unsporting behaviour, then it is a caution. Maybe the referee finds it unsporting, maybe he doesn't. This means he cannot possibly make a 'wrong' decision. What if Kasper had held on to the ball?
Jimothy Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 I dunno I haven't seen any video of it. And I'm sure he's the sort of referee that gives a free kick for a player shouting "my ball" or "leave it". He probably took the course for some money, and only referees kids football? But hey, he's qualified and has the same opinion of yourself, therefore he must be right. Time and time again you are saying the same things. Only yesterday I mentioned this. I don't care if you abuse the referee, I don't care if you think he's right or wrong or biased against Leicester. Why should I care? All I do, is try to offer the alternative point of view as to why the referee may have done what he did, from my experience of being in the middle. I might not be right, but I'm just trying to help people understand what the referee may have been thinking, and why he may have made the decisions he did. I haven't even seen the incident, but the referee may have felt that Kasper was kicking the ball away from the Forest players who were trying to get it, thereby delaying them from getting the ball. For giving my opinion? Then so be it. I'm not too bothered I'm not giving my opinion on whether Moss was good, bad or indifferent. I'm giving my opinion on why he may have made the decisions that he did. Congratulations. The Forest players are entitled to retrieve the ball if they want. Kasper is not entitled to prevent them from doing so. Letter of the law? If, in the opinion of the referee, a player commits an act of unsporting behaviour, then it is a caution. Maybe the referee finds it unsporting, maybe he doesn't. This means he cannot possibly make a 'wrong' decision. I took up refereeing because when I was younger and watched my brother play football, I thought that looks good. I then took up playing (admittedly in goal) and was never really that good When we moved house, I left my old team and never really went to another one. I then carried on watching my brother, and I thought that it looked good to be in charge, so I asked a few questions and then began learning to referee. I believe referees in general take up football because they have a passion for it and want to be as involved as possible. If you're not playing, then the next best thing in terms of being directly involved on the pitch is refereeing. I think I've answered all the questions or posts aimed at me. If I haven't I'm not avoiding it I just haven't seen it Stopped reading half of this when you said you hadn't watched the video yet. How can you offer any view point either way if you haven't bothered watching? How can you offer an opinion on what the referee might have thought, when you haven't seen what he was making a judgement on? The video is on here about 50 times, go watch one, plus the one from behind the goal showing where Kasper threw the ball then come back and give us you opinion as a ref on what you would have done or why Moss might be justified in doing what he did. Until you've done that, qualified ref or not, you opinion isn't valid.
Matt Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 You're starting to sound like Arsene Wenger DB11 'I didn't see it', have you not seen the incidents as an excuse of not to have a 'full' opinion on the incidents and therefore support the referee? Anyway, Here you go; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EPswZX1Av1c&feature=player_embedded#!
DB11 Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Ok I've just watched the Kasper video of him throwing the ball away and that is pure stupidity. He's trying to throw the ball away he has not intention of throwing it back to the centre spot, the wind just blows it The referee doesn't need to look at where it's ended up how anyone can say that is not a caution is ridiculous. He's blatantly threw it away when the Forest players were approaching him to get it. If people are arguing that that was not a yellow card then I doubt I even need to see the video of the first one (which, btw, is buffering)
marko Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Ok I've just watched the Kasper video of him throwing the ball away and that is pure stupidity. He's trying to throw the ball away he has not intention of throwing it back to the centre spot, the wind just blows it The referee doesn't need to look at where it's ended up how anyone can say that is not a caution is ridiculous. He's blatantly threw it away when the Forest players were approaching him to get it. If people are arguing that that was not a yellow card then I doubt I even need to see the video of the first one (which, btw, is buffering) The wind - spare me. What I don't understand is why the Forest players are entitled to get the ball? We're kicking off so it's up to us to retrieve the ball and restart play in reasonable time.
Jimothy Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Ok I've just watched the Kasper video of him throwing the ball away and that is pure stupidity. He's trying to throw the ball away he has not intention of throwing it back to the centre spot, the wind just blows it The referee doesn't need to look at where it's ended up how anyone can say that is not a caution is ridiculous. He's blatantly threw it away when the Forest players were approaching him to get it. If people are arguing that that was not a yellow card then I doubt I even need to see the video of the first one (which, btw, is buffering) Still wasn't wasting time, and surely any ref worth his salt would try and defuse a situation in a local derby, not inflame it. Anyway that's your opinion on the sending off now you've seen it. How about the penalty?
marko Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Ok I've just watched the Kasper video of him throwing the ball away and that is pure stupidity. He's trying to throw the ball away he has not intention of throwing it back to the centre spot, the wind just blows it The referee doesn't need to look at where it's ended up how anyone can say that is not a caution is ridiculous. He's blatantly threw it away when the Forest players were approaching him to get it. If people are arguing that that was not a yellow card then I doubt I even need to see the video of the first one (which, btw, is buffering) Also, what's the difference between what Morgan does and what Kasper does? If you're 100% that Kasper's was a yellow, surely Morgan's should be? Or was it just poor, inconsistent officiating?
Phube Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Well the peno was a bit harsh weren't it How about just say: Wrong!?
Phube Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Well the peno was a bit harsh weren't it How about just say: Wrong!?
Jimothy Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 How about just say: Wrong!? His computer blows up when hitting the keys W R O N G in that order in a refs thread.
DB11 Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 How about just say: Wrong!? Read my earlier response. IT wasn't 'wrong' because it's in the opinion of the referee. I don't think it was deliberate, so in my opinion it wasn't a penalty, but I wasn't the match referee. Why can't you people grasp that
Jimothy Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Read my earlier response. IT wasn't 'wrong' because it's in the opinion of the referee. I don't think it was deliberate, so in my opinion it wasn't a penalty, but I wasn't the match referee. Why can't you people grasp that Opinions are like nipples, everybody has them. Some have firm points, others are barely discernible through layers, and some are displayed at every opportunity regardless of whether the audience has stated "I am interested in your nipples" or not. They can also be wrong. Read half of the comments on here regarding race and the BNP etc from the likes of aaclooing. Everyone is entitled to opinions, but some opinions are just horseshit. If the referee actually saw what Mills did and still thought it was a penalty, then his opinion is just one of those horseshit opinions. You might as well say a ref can give a penalty for foul on the halfway line because in his opinion it was in the area.
Phube Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 Read my earlier response. IT wasn't 'wrong' because it's in the opinion of the referee. I don't think it was deliberate, so in my opinion it wasn't a penalty, but I wasn't the match referee. Why can't you people grasp that But as said above, a referee's opinion can be wrong! You can believe in creationism, but you'd be wrong!
Fenland-Fox Posted 21 August 2011 Posted 21 August 2011 The amount of douchebags on here is horrendous at times. Why can't people take the unbiased view sometimes? Yes, the penalty in my opinion was wrong. Mills was not aware of the ball and cannot be deemed to have handled it deliberately, however as DB11 said the ref gave it due to his opinion. I'm sure there will be worse penalty decisions given/not given throughout the season. Kasper however cannot be defended for his actions after the penalty. It was pure stupidity. He has clearly made a concerted effort to delay the restart of play, along with showing unsporting behaviour. Which are both cautionable offences. As for the argument of the ball landing near the centre circle it doesn't matter, as stated in the LAWS (not rules as many seem to think the case) most offences state: .... or ATTEMPTS to. This is a clear attempt. How many times do you all scream for a striker to get booked for kicking the ball away when given offside? In reality most areas of the pitch now have ball boys, ensuring that a restart of play in never more than a few seconds away. Yet people still get annoyed about it and call for blood when it's an opposition player committing the offence. Watch the fans view of the sending off. You can clearly see the referees position and what he is focused on. He sees the goal scored. Then three red shirts run towards Kasper. His first concern is to diffuse the situation. He sees Kasper throw the ball away. He doesn't stop and watch where the ball lands, he immediately sees it as an attempt to delay the restart of play and sanctions the correct action. If he had turned and watched the ball to see where it has landed, what happens if a Forest player hits Kasper or reacts in any other illegal manner. Where would you all stand then? The ref wouldn't have seen it. I'm sure then you would all seem aggrieved again by the referee. Sometimes I feel the referee can't win. We need accept some responsibility for the result as well. Maybe if we had played better in the lead up to the penalty the ball would not have been in the area and Mills would not have been in such an awkward position to start with? Maybe we should have defended the cross better that led to their equaliser? Maybe we could have scored some other chances to ensure that a second for them didn't matter?
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