MC Prussian Posted 22 October 2011 Posted 22 October 2011 Well explain what you meant by that post then, because it looked like yet another desperate attempt to defend him. Can't you understand that expectations are rightly much higher than under Levein, Kelly or Holloway? That being the case success is relative. whilst midtable would have been OK for them, it's not nearly OK for Sven. In fact I'd argue Sven is doing worse than those 3 considering his resources. You're really clutching at straws. Can we come back to this at the end of the season? Because I don't think I'm clutching at straws at all. I'm as frustrated about our recent "results" like everybody else - however, this frustration manifests itself differently. I'm looking for explanations - whilst others try to justify their prejudices.
Kitchandro Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Can we come back to this at the end of the season? Because I don't think I'm clutching at straws at all. I'm as frustrated about our recent "results" like everybody else - however, this frustration manifests itself differently. I'm looking for explanations - whilst others try to justify their prejudices. Don't be ridiculous, it is you who has the blinkered view. What are these prejudices? Stop being so childish, everyone wants Leicester to succeed, that's the most important thing, though apparently you get more annoyed when the manager is slated than when we are being embarrassed or are failing. Yeh, we'll come back to this at the end of the season, I've no problem with that, if you want to do that. However if we don't go up I won't be petty enough to bring it up myself.
MC Prussian Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Don't be ridiculous, it is you who has the blinkered view. What are these prejudices? Stop being so childish, everyone wants Leicester to succeed, that's the most important thing, though apparently you get more annoyed when the manager is slated than when we are being embarrassed or are failing. Yeh, we'll come back to this at the end of the season, I've no problem with that, if you want to do that. However if we don't go up I won't be petty enough to bring it up myself. Correct. Everyone wants Leicester to succeed. You, me, your mates, the fans around you at the KP, Sven, the players, the Raksiaksorns, etc. I'm simply annoyed when certain people opt for the easy exit by putting the blame on the manager solely instead of looking at the different bits and pieces that make up this football club. It's a dish in which the players, the board, the chairman, the fans and the press play as big a part as the manager. And I've clearly voiced my anger at the team in yesterday's Match Thread. Sad to see this part of my criticism hasn't found its way into your argumentation.
Dan Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 How can people call it prejudice. It's simple as owt - we are an ordinary side who even by our mind-numbingly ordinary (this season) standards were below par. The buck stops with the boss. He's had it easier than any manager in this league, or even the rest of the FL, I challenge anyone to find someone who's had it easier this season than Sven. "We're not good enough" - why? There's no excuse. We've spent MILLIONS. I don't want to hear this "money doesn't always buy you success" line from a single person. That's a cop-out, an embarrassing way of looking at it. The only times money doesn't buy you success is when it's completely fvcking mis-used, and that's exactly what we're doing. It's not the money's fault there's no success, it's the ones who are spending it. Kitchandro is absolutely spot on with every single thing he says for me. These "off-days", they are too regular to be considered off days. The more they occur, the less they be considered off-days. That performance was basically everything wrong with our season. Failure to create much, no enthusiasm, poor reaction to going a goal down, a plan B that made us look even worse, looking clueless against a side who've been god-awful, seriously, I was fvcking embarrassed. The players are guilty, but ultimately I blame the one leading them, guiding them, telling them how to play, what to do, where to run. "You'd all moan if we lost and he picked a different team", when will people start realising it's not JUST down our XI? It's the attitude and the mentality too. The mentality we displayed out there, awful, no determination, nothing. For me - Sven out. I'm tired of the excuses. There's obvious re-percussions but lets be honest here, these players are better than the ones who went down, I'd be absolutely stunned if we went down this year, I think things can't actually get much worse than today and the fact this kind of crap, covered up by stats of how we're not conceding etc... is not doing us any favours. Pathetic display, pathetic season. Not going up - take a gamble, get rid and see if someone else can do it, because Sven, if anyone seriously thinks this man is taking us to the Premier, then they're far too optimistic for their own goods, anyone who disagrees, stick it in your sig. We'll see. Hope I'm wrong, but today was just everything bad about this season and more. Pathetic, I'm ****ing appalled.
Guest DavidJCW Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Wow... just read through a few of the comments on here and low and behold, Leicester-fan-syndrome has well and truly kicked in. From how poor we were yesterday, to calling for Sven's head, to possible relegation! It's staggering! Take a step back and realise that we're still only 2 points off the play-offs and 5 off the automatic spots. Yes, we're not playing well enough at the moment but honestly, does a bad couple of performances really warrant this kind of over-reaction? Give Sven 'till Christmas, if things haven't picked up by then and a concerted effort at the top spots put in then sure, look at a change, until then, just fecking support the team!!!
Dan Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Wow... just read through a few of the comments on here and low and behold, Leicester-fan-syndrome has well and truly kicked in. From how poor we were yesterday, to calling for Sven's head, to possible relegation! It's staggering! Take a step back and realise that we're still only 2 points off the play-offs and 5 off the automatic spots. Yes, we're not playing well enough at the moment but honestly, does a bad couple of performances really warrant this kind of over-reaction? Give Sven 'till Christmas, if things haven't picked up by then and a concerted effort at the top spots put in then sure, look at a change, until then, just fecking support the team!!! If that bit in bold was aimed at me - then that's not what I reckon. Basically, I think these particular players are better than the ones who went down, as proven in the past it's not an impossibility and I think based on the fact we do occasionally play like promotion material would keep us well afloat. That was more if we were to chop and change though. To be honest, what worse can a new manager do? Sven's basically working like a manager who's just inherited a bunch of randomers who he has no idea about, he's acting like a failing new manager, not one who's been here for a year and spent fvcking tonnes on his own choice of players. Midtable. No different to last year. And that for me is why he has to go.
SeattleShane Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Firstly, don't twist the man's words. He said we were not good enough in the first half of this one game, not that the squad are not good enough per se. Secondly, he doesn't fail to take responsibility: "we were not good enough", "we should blame ourselves". And he admits that he probably should have freshened things up after Wednesday. The basic argument is as follows: we weren't good enough today. This is because the players were tired. This is because it was the same starting 11 as on Wednesday evening and they were playing their second game in less than 3 days. The solution: squad rotation. Bring in Vassell, Gallagher, Fernandes, Danns for Beckford, King, Abe, Wellens, and the result may well have been very different. There is no fundamental problem in the quality of the first team or the depth of the squad. I'm as disappointed and angry about today's result as anyone, but we lost today's game based on, amittedly, a naive team selection, and as long as Sven doesn't try this kind of tactic again, I won't overreact. A little perspective, please, people. P.S. Peterborough Fox - the large number of centre mids and lack of wide midfielders/wingers is simply a refletion of Sven's 4-4-2 diamond formation - the same 4-4-2 diamond he used with England. With two quick, attacking full-backs, this can be very effective. The problem we have with this system is Paul Konchesky, who is just too slow and about as much use as a short-sighted, three-legged racehorse. It's the full-back who's the problem, not the midfield. But my dislike of Paul Konchesky is a topic for another time... boo Hoo, ive just finished 60 hours this week.
lcfc_sam_p Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 So when we win the players get the praise, but when we lose sven gets the blame? So if we win 3 on the bounce and climb up the table should sven still be sacked? Vassell was crap when he came on. Fernandes only passed sidewards or backwards. The defence were poor, and we didn't create anything going forward. I can't see how all this can be down to sven.
Thracian Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Four big differences Derby------Millwall Mills-----------St Ledger Fernandes--Johnson Danns--------Wellens Vassell-------Beckford I thought the four on the left were four of the highest performers against Derby. The four on the right all seem to have been picked out for their lack of positive contribution today. Mills, alongside Bamba, dominated the Derby defence. Fernandes, I felt, was the glue that held the midfield together. Fantastic work rate and quick, simple passing (together with a peach of a ball over the top to Nugent for the opener.) Danns was full of energy, and was constantly looking to drive forward. Vassell's trickery caused the Derby defence all sorts of problems and he was constantly looking to make things happen. Same team played against Birmingham, too, and looked easily in control until the penalty. With the possible exception of Konchesky, who looked vulnerable up against Beasejour all game. Interesting observation. Controversial but mostly true. Danns and Fernandes have the energy to allow King to attack more. We need Schlupp, Howard or another striker alongside Nugent and we need Dyer and/or Vassell out wide. St Leger looks a liability and Johnson looks unfit. Millwall found holes too easily in the centre of our defence.
Head Honcho Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/15416348.stm Do you have to practice at being a complete tool or does it come naturally?
Guest Col city fan Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 So when we win the players get the praise, but when we lose sven gets the blame? So if we win 3 on the bounce and climb up the table should sven still be sacked? Vassell was crap when he came on. Fernandes only passed sidewards or backwards. The defence were poor, and we didn't create anything going forward. I can't see how all this can be down to sven. Sam, this IS down to the manager.... Unless you are implying that our players are crap, it's the job of the manager to get them to perform to the best of their ability. This is the raison d'être of management. If they are not trained correctly, know what their roles are, motivated and disciplined then they won't perform to the best of their ability.. All of the above is what management is about... You can have eleven world beaters on the pitch... It's then what the manager does with them that makes them play like world beaters or not... If this is not true then why bother having a manager at all?
flowwolf Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Excuse after excuse. I would have been more respectful if Sven had said "I" as the manager and my squad were not good enough today. And the excuse that the players were tired was really taking the piss. they are supposed to be professional footballers for gods sake how do the prem clubs manage to play in Europe as well cup competitions and the league without saying " the players were tired" I thought that was the idea of having a good back up squad plus we are only into October for christ sake! One thing is crystal clear any team who looses at home three nil to a near bottom side has major problems. It is hard to admit but with the players we have and Svens tactics we deserve to be exactly where we are now in the table and unless something changes that's exactly where we will be at the end of the season. For all the optimists I would say sorry but the bottle is not half full it's bloody empty. We have via Sven paid out a fortune for players who have turned out no better than we had originally , Our keeper being the exception. Non but the most optimistic of us who saw that display yesterday could honestly say that they think we will still get promoted. And even if we did how long in the prem do you think we would last with this squad of players? I know I will get some stick for this post but as a true supporter I can't shy away from the truth as I see it . I just hope I get it thrown back at me come the end of the season but I doubt it .
Libertine Dream Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 So when we win the players get the praise, but when we lose sven gets the blame? So if we win 3 on the bounce and climb up the table should sven still be sacked? Vassell was crap when he came on. Fernandes only passed sidewards or backwards. The defence were poor, and we didn't create anything going forward. I can't see how all this can be down to sven. Who sets the team up? Who has had weeks on the training ground to ensure this doesn't happen? Who picks the team? Who made the signings? Whilst I understand when the players cross that white line its down to them but Svenn should have them prepared correctly for this point. Fernandes only passed sideways because they were his only options, due to lack of movement, pace, width and he had wellens next to him that couldn't give a toss. We did look tired but sven should know this would happen, you never see SAF keep the same team every game, always a few tweaks to freshen it up without causing upheaval and changing it massively. It was clear on wednesday Abe was knackered after playing 2 games in four days and having flown back from japan. He's been around the block enough times to know this and sort it out. Not creating anything is again his fault. Its how he sets his team up and how he wants them playing. They obviously work on attacking movement during training so the faults from Cardiff, Boro, Barnsley, Brum, Watford should be removed and our attacking play improved and increased. Sven and Faz are both defensive minded people that either need help with someone coming in or getting rid of altogether. All derby succeeded in doing was covering the cracks up which will again be covered if we win next week. Somebody ahould be brave and just sack the man.
accessory Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Excuse after excuse. I would have been more respectful if Sven had said "I" as the manager and my squad were not good enough today. And the excuse that the players were tired was really taking the piss. they are supposed to be professional footballers for gods sake how do the prem clubs manage to play in Europe as well cup competitions and the league without saying " the players were tired" I thought that was the idea of having a good back up squad plus we are only into October for christ sake! One thing is crystal clear any team who looses at home three nil to a near bottom side has major problems. It is hard to admit but with the players we have and Svens tactics we deserve to be exactly where we are now in the table and unless something changes that's exactly where we will be at the end of the season. For all the optimists I would say sorry but the bottle is not half full it's bloody empty. We have via Sven paid out a fortune for players who have turned out no better than we had originally , Our keeper being the exception. None but the most optimistic of us who saw that display yesterday could honestly say that they think we will still get promoted. And even if we did how long in the prem do you think we would last with this squad of players? I know I will get some stick for this post but as a true supporter I can't shy away from the truth as I see it . I just hope I get it thrown back at me come the end of the season but I doubt it . Absolutely spot on. If it wasn't for Schmeichel we'd be in the bottom 6, no better off than we were this time last season. The time for excuses has passed. The flirtation with celebrity should now cease.
lcfc_sam_p Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 But its the same management team and setup for the derby game, where we hammered an in form team? The same team where we outclassed southampton for a half and brighton for 90 minutes who were both unbeaten. The players have to be at fault sometimes. The players were easily good enough to beat that millwall team, but they didn't perform. You think sven has told them not to mark at corners? Or do you think he has told vassell not to make runs and stand flat footed in and around the penalty area? Or to tell king to disappear for 90 minutes?
flowwolf Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 But its the same management team and setup for the derby game, where we hammered an in form team? The same team where we outclassed southampton for a half and brighton for 90 minutes who were both unbeaten. The players have to be at fault sometimes. The players were easily good enough to beat that millwall team, but they didn't perform. You think sven has told them not to mark at corners? Or do you think he has told vassell not to make runs and stand flat footed in and around the penalty area? Or to tell king to disappear for 90 minutes? Never the less Sven picks the players. King has repeatedly been absent but still gets picked while the likes of Dyer gets ignored. Dyer at least looked like he wanted to play. Who's fault is that if not the manager?
lcfc_sam_p Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Dyer looked like he wanted to play yesterday but in the past when he's had his chance he has been poor. Even yesterday his crossing was poor after he got past a defender, which has always been the case. He only has one foot, but still tends to cut onto his non-existant right foot. My point is whatever players he picked, from our squad, are good enough to beat the likes of millwall. Yesterdays result was down to the players IMO. They just didn't turn up. Sven can only do so much, once they get over that white line its down to them.
DANGEROUS TIGER Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 I believe that Wellens, King, and Beckford, should be dropped to the bench at West Ham.
Kitchandro Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 But its the same management team and setup for the derby game, where we hammered an in form team? The same team where we outclassed southampton for a half and brighton for 90 minutes who were both unbeaten. The players have to be at fault sometimes. The players were easily good enough to beat that millwall team, but they didn't perform. You think sven has told them not to mark at corners? Or do you think he has told vassell not to make runs and stand flat footed in and around the penalty area? Or to tell king to disappear for 90 minutes? Exactly, the players have quality, the question is why are they so inconsistent? Why aren't they performing to their best most of the time? And no, obviously Sven hasn't told them to do those ridiculous things, but he's not done enough to make sure that they don't do those things. And one thing he has done is set them up with a lack of urgency, tempo and positivity in the majority of games. The Derby-type performance has rarely been seen before or since.
Kitchandro Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Dyer looked like he wanted to play yesterday but in the past when he's had his chance he has been poor. Even yesterday his crossing was poor after he got past a defender, which has always been the case. He only has one foot, but still tends to cut onto his non-existant right foot. My point is whatever players he picked, from our squad, are good enough to beat the likes of millwall. Yesterdays result was down to the players IMO. They just didn't turn up. Sven can only do so much, once they get over that white line its down to them. They didn't turn up against Birmingham either, or Cardiff, or Reading, or Bristol, or Barnsley, or the second halves against Southampton and Watford.
Trav Le Bleu Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Trev I don´t understand appologize but? explain if it is not true... :scarf: I was backing you up.
funkyrobot Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Interesting observation. Controversial but mostly true. Danns and Fernandes have the energy to allow King to attack more. We need Schlupp, Howard or another striker alongside Nugent and we need Dyer and/or Vassell out wide. St Leger looks a liability and Johnson looks unfit. Millwall found holes too easily in the centre of our defence. Johnson looks unfit? What about your mate kingy? he has no stamina and is the only player I've seen at city who actually purposefully hides during a game. Any footballer out there can spot when he hides, fair enough when you're a hungover Sunday league player, you can get away with it, but when you're a pro playing in front of 20k plus you can't!
Kitchandro Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Johnson looks unfit? What about your mate kingy? he has no stamina and is the only player I've seen at city who actually purposefully hides during a game. Any footballer out there can spot when he hides, fair enough when you're a hungover Sunday league player, you can get away with it, but when you're a pro playing in front of 20k plus you can't! I thought all our midfielders looked laboured/like they weren't trying.
flowwolf Posted 23 October 2011 Posted 23 October 2011 Well there you go - I totally agree. IF he's doing as bad as the others mentioned in your list. But in fact, ever since his appointment, the criticism was as strong (if not stronger) than when the others got dismissed. Which stinks of prejudice. And I don't really understand what point you're trying to make out of my last post, either. I never said Sven thinks we're shit (that'd be quite an insinuation) - only that he's probably as baffled as to why we're so inconsistent, as well. So we are paying this man God knows how much to be as probably baffled as to why we are so inconsistent in fact as baffled as we are.. Great That makes it all clear then. Try telling your boss when he asks you why you are so inept and why he should not sack you " well i'm as baffled as you boss" ! TAXI FOR ERICKSON :crylaugh: :crylaugh:
CountesthorpeFox Posted 24 October 2011 Posted 24 October 2011 Excuse after excuse. I would have been more respectful if Sven had said "I" as the manager and my squad were not good enough today. And the excuse that the players were tired was really taking the piss. they are supposed to be professional footballers for gods sake how do the prem clubs manage to play in Europe as well cup competitions and the league without saying " the players were tired" I thought that was the idea of having a good back up squad plus we are only into October for christ sake! One thing is crystal clear any team who looses at home three nil to a near bottom side has major problems. It is hard to admit but with the players we have and Svens tactics we deserve to be exactly where we are now in the table and unless something changes that's exactly where we will be at the end of the season. For all the optimists I would say sorry but the bottle is not half full it's bloody empty. We have via Sven paid out a fortune for players who have turned out no better than we had originally , Our keeper being the exception. Non but the most optimistic of us who saw that display yesterday could honestly say that they think we will still get promoted. And even if we did how long in the prem do you think we would last with this squad of players? I know I will get some stick for this post but as a true supporter I can't shy away from the truth as I see it . I just hope I get it thrown back at me come the end of the season but I doubt it . Actually it follows that european midweek games often have a negative effect on the teams performance at the weekend. Stoke were battered by Sunderland and lost to Arsenal yesterday after midweek games, while that was the first time in 11 months that Arsenal have won following a european game. I do basically agree with your point though. Its not like they flew out too the Ukraine or anything.
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