Club Statement on Ownership

[seenitall]

Only if you actually know of something to be concerned about, otherwise it is pointless worrying over nothing, these things happen in business all the time, normally for some tax reason, which is completely above board and legal. If anything it will bring more transparency of the ownership of the club.

Bless you, isn't blind acceptance what they are hoping for?

[davieG]

I thought around 2001/02 we were operating at a loss of around £60 million before the Stadium was sold and the club wrote off approx £30 million in adminstration?

The debts banded around during our admin included all the money we owed to every player for the length of their contract and the outstanding debt on the stadium if I remember the worst figures quoted were £60- £70m, that's not to say it was true.

If you include and add those figures to the current £57m being quoted we'd be well in excess of that figure now, we still owe most of the stadium loan as it was well quoted at the time that the only way we could actually earn enough to start paying it off was to be in the PL and we haven't been there since 2004.

[flowwolf]

I think they have taken advice on all things concerning money matters from Harry Redknapp, probably part of his contract before he joins us.

[Babylon]

The secret investor was Harry's dog... she's loaded.

[Jace]

The debts banded around during our admin included all the money we owed to every player for the length of their contract and the outstanding debt on the stadium if I remember the worst figures quoted were £60- £70m, that's not to say it was true.

If you include and add those figures to the current £57m being quoted we'd be well in excess of that figure now, we still owe most of the stadium loan as it was well quoted at the time that the only way we could actually earn enough to start paying it off was to be in the PL and we haven't been there since 2004.

Very true Davie lets all not forget though the difference in revenue between the Premiership and the 1st Division 10 years ago might of been between £30 and £40 million extra income per season? I think from next year it will be at an estimated £100+ million when the new tv rights kick in? Its no wonder why teams in the Championship looking for Premiership status get themselves in such a mess

[Col city fan]

Very true Davie lets all not forget though the difference in revenue between the Premiership and the 1st Division 10 years ago might of been between £30 and £40 million extra income per season? I think from next year it will be at an estimated £100+ million when the new tv rights kick in? Its no wonder why teams in the Championship looking for Premiership status get themselves in such a mess

Or reap a MASSIVE reward if they get it right?...

Eg. West Ham

[5waller5]

Maybe they can use our losses to write down their overall profits and save tax that way?

I don't see this as a bad move though, I think it's good actually, shows they are still in it for the long haul.

I was once told that people in Asia think decades in advance when they make investments, where as us Westerners think at most years, or some on here, minutes. Seems to me that this might be true.

That's exactly what I thought .... KP is hugely profitable so sticking a loss making machine like a football club in would be a sensible tax planning move. especially as they have sponsorship etc that they can put notional values on.

[5waller5]

I don't think the operating loss was ever reported, I dont remember if it was, we had debts of 30million though.

http://news.bbc.co.u...ess/2349397.stm

We have an official debt of £57million now (and that's with accounts filed before the Beckford and Mills deals and interest at 8%) and what that figure will be on the next set of accounts I have no idea.

And nor will anyone .... one of the reasons to bring it into the group would be to surely avoid reporting on the football club as a seperate company to company's house and to the football league presumably the figures will be less accessible as part of a group.

[Guest MattP]

And nor will anyone .... one of the reasons to bring it into the group would be to surely avoid reporting on the football club as a seperate company to company's house and to the football league presumably the figures will be less accessible as part of a group.

You still have to report the clubs accounts separate, football league rules wouldn't allow our acconts to be be shifted into King Power's.

[5waller5]

You still have to report the clubs accounts separate, football league rules wouldn't allow our acconts to be be shifted into King Power's.

Yeah ... But .... it's a hell of alot easier to purchase stuff from the group, make loans from the group etc that are easier to blurr than if they are in one company that owns the whole of a football club and nothing else.

On a really daft and inconsequential example .... for instance, the " football consultant" that gives the group advice, not the operating subsidiary.

[Guest MattP]

Yeah ... But .... it's a hell of alot easier to purchase stuff from the group, make loans from the group etc that are easier to blurr than if they are in one company that owns the whole of a football club and nothing else.

On a really daft and inconsequential example .... for instance, the " football consultant" that gives the group advice, not the operating subsidiary.

Yeah I realise that, it really doesn't fill me with confidence though we are effetively going to be fiddling out finances in order to make them look better than they are though.

[5waller5]

Yeah I realise that, it really doesn't fill me with confidence though we are effetively going to be fiddling out finances in order to make them look better than they are though.

I don't know much about FFP .... but if it is as strict as people on here seem fear then to coin a phrase, every little helps!!!

Let's face it - fiddling?? / I'd say adjusting financial statements for the good of the club is no bad thing .... and this gives us a better vehicle to be more flexible with the financial reporting!!

[Guest MattP]

I don't know much about FFP .... but if it is as strict as people on here seem fear then to coin a phrase, every little helps!!!

Let's face it - fiddling?? / I'd say adjusting financial statements for the good of the club is no bad thing .... and this gives us a better vehicle to be more flexible with the financial reporting!!

Fiddling is probably a bit strong, but we all know how things can end up when a company starts mixing its accounts with a football club, Gaydamek did the same with Devondale Investments and Portsmouth FC.

[Jace]

You still have to report the clubs accounts separate, football league rules wouldn't allow our acconts to be be shifted into King Power's.

Do we know this for sure Matt? Don't wanna sound like I'm criticising because I'm not I know you know what you are talking about but the whole idea of introducing FFP was to stop clubs spending money they haven't got and then unfairly writing off the debt. Most football clubs make losses except from the top clubs with major fan bases so as long as King Power is accounting for the loses and not risking administration is this a concern to the football league?

[Guest MattP]

Do we know this for sure Matt? Don't wanna sound like I'm criticising because I'm not I know you know what you are talking about but the whole idea of introducing FFP was to stop clubs spending money they haven't got and then unfairly writing off the debt. Most football clubs make losses except from the top clubs with major fan bases so as long as King Power is accounting for the loses and not risking administration is this a concern to the football league?

You have to produce accounts solely for the Football Club, I'm absolutely certain of that.

If you were allowed to hide it in a companies accounts no club would ever release a balance sheet.

[Jace]

You have to produce accounts solely for the Football Club, I'm absolutely certain of that.

If you were allowed to hide it in a companies accounts no club would ever release a balance sheet.

I'm sure with the new regulations the club will not be trying to hide the losses as it sounds too regulated now for that, the owners must be putting a huge liability on King Powers accounts with this change so we can only assume there must be some gain or reason as to why they are taking such a risk? I suppose the only way we will be able to tell for now is how the club spends for the remainder of the season

[Guest MattP]

I'm sure with the new regulations the club will not be trying to hide the losses as it sounds too regulated now for that, the owners must be putting a huge liability on King Powers accounts with this change so we can only assume there must be some gain or reason as to why they are taking such a risk

Well the most obvious scenario is the one a few have mentioned earlier, the investors from ASI have pulled out so the club now needs to fall back on King Power.

How that develops is anyone's guess, but I'd imagine we'll be seeing more and cutting in our spending, my only concern is how much this debt and and whether these guys will agree to write it off if it comes to it, I've tweeted Stringer or Rob Tanner loads of times to ask the question but neither have the bollocks to do so.

[Deucalion]

Fiddling is probably a bit strong, but we all know how things can end up when a company starts mixing its accounts with a football club, Gaydamek did the same with Devondale Investments and Portsmouth FC.

But wasn't Devondale Investments a holding company for Portsmouth FC? In other words, the same kind of thing AFI were. King Power is an established company with a turnover in the billions. LCFC will never bankrupt King Power.

[Guest MattP]

But wasn't Devondale Investments a holding company for Portsmouth FC? In other words, the same kind of thing AFI were. King Power is an established company with a turnover in the billions. LCFC will never bankrupt King Power.

Not comparing the two, just showing how you can run up a massive debt onto a "company" whilst actually destroying a football clubs finances.

[5waller5]

Fiddling is probably a bit strong, but we all know how things can end up when a company starts mixing its accounts with a football club, Gaydamek did the same with Devondale Investments and Portsmouth FC.

I don't know too much about that to be fair .... was it a profitable trading company like KP though or just a shell investment vehicle??

The other thing that spurng to mind apart from the tax advantages and possible blurring of who's the costs were, group or club, is that the borrowing power of KP would surely make a huge difference to the interest rates charged on debt if it is financed.... although i suppose it will be financed from working capital of KP - so may be a couple of £m saving on the club's books for FFP??

[Deucalion]

Not comparing the two, just showing how you can run up a massive debt onto a "company" whilst actually destroying a football clubs finances.

King Power buying LCFC is either to allow the club to continue operating with unsustainable debt which otherwise could lead to administration, or is to allow the Raksriaksorns to continue to invest/lend to the club to finance further player purchases.

Either way, the club is more secure, is it not?

[Jace]

King Power buying LCFC is either to allow the club to continue operating with unsustainable debt which otherwise could lead to administration, or is to allow the Raksriaksorns to continue to invest/lend to the club to finance further player purchases.

Either way, the club is more secure, is it not?

I can only see it as a good outcome for us regardless of how this will affect FFP

[Guest MattP]

King Power buying LCFC is either to allow the club to continue operating with unsustainable debt which otherwise could lead to administration, or is to allow the Raksriaksorns to continue to invest/lend to the club to finance further player purchases.

Either way, the club is more secure, is it not?

For the time being, like mentioned, it might have been put onto King Power's ownership due to the other investors dropping out, in which case we have no idea what the plan for the immediate or long term future is.

[5waller5]

For the time being, like mentioned, it might have been put onto King Power's ownership due to the other investors dropping out, in which case we have no idea what the plan for the immediate or long term future is.

Surely easier to sell if it's in a holding company?? I personally think that bringing it into KP signals their long term intent.

[me_plus_one]

Does this mean that the 8% interest we were suppose to be paying someone is effectively now cancelled? ... or is that being very nieve?