The Isometric PC CRPG Thread.

[Guest]

Bit of a bump but Pillars of Eternity 2's getting a turn-based combat mode on Thursday via a free update (https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2019-01-22-pillars-of-eternity-2-deadfire-getting-a-full-on-turn-based-mode-this-week). Judging by comments on Reddit and elsewhere there's a lot of people like me who loved a lot of things about it but bounced pretty hard off the combat system. Looking forward to giving it a try personally.

[Carl the Llama]

12 hours ago, Guest said:

Bit of a bump but Pillars of Eternity 2's getting a turn-based combat mode on Thursday via a free update (https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2019-01-22-pillars-of-eternity-2-deadfire-getting-a-full-on-turn-based-mode-this-week). Judging by comments on Reddit and elsewhere there's a lot of people like me who loved a lot of things about it but bounced pretty hard off the combat system. Looking forward to giving it a try personally.

Haven't had the chance to play Pillars 2 so I'm not familiar with its individual quirks but this sounds like potentially a good idea purely from the point of view that crpgs' biggest weakness for me is they can often become a monotonous slog of battles where you're constantly pausing, directing, playing, giving it a few seconds to see the outcome, pausing, directing, etc. Some games offer an auto-play feature and let you tweak individual characters' tactics but I don't think I've ever played one where you can fully trust the AI to not make daft decisions that get the party wiped. I think an Xcom style move and take actions approach is the ideal compromise - like in the Shadowrun games. 

[Guest]

12 hours ago, Carl the Llama said:

Haven't had the chance to play Pillars 2 so I'm not familiar with its individual quirks but this sounds like potentially a good idea purely from the point of view that crpgs' biggest weakness for me is they can often become a monotonous slog of battles where you're constantly pausing, directing, playing, giving it a few seconds to see the outcome, pausing, directing, etc. Some games offer an auto-play feature and let you tweak individual characters' tactics but I don't think I've ever played one where you can fully trust the AI to not make daft decisions that get the party wiped. I think an Xcom style move and take actions approach is the ideal compromise - like in the Shadowrun games. 

To be fair Pillars 2 does allow you to set up pretty complex scripts for the AI but I was too lazy to either do it properly or micromanage fights so ended up just putting it to one side. I'm an absolute novice to the genre and Divinity Original Sin 2 was my way in so hopefully a combat system more reminiscent of that will help me get into Pillars. If it's implemented well then I can see myself really enjoying it as I was taken in by pretty much everything about it except the combat.

[Nick]

WTF is going on in here?

 

All of you must go out and get girlfriends before any of this gets any worse.

[Finnegan]

4 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said:

WTF is going on in here?

 

All of you must go out and get girlfriends before any of this gets any worse.

 

Mrs Finners is the reason I spend so much time playing steam games. Got to have something to do when she's watching the Hollyoaks omnibus and awful E4 dramas. 

[Carl the Llama]

On 23/01/2019 at 23:04, Guest said:

To be fair Pillars 2 does allow you to set up pretty complex scripts for the AI but I was too lazy to either do it properly or micromanage fights so ended up just putting it to one side. I'm an absolute novice to the genre and Divinity Original Sin 2 was my way in so hopefully a combat system more reminiscent of that will help me get into Pillars. If it's implemented well then I can see myself really enjoying it as I was taken in by pretty much everything about it except the combat.

Divinity 2 is a humdinger of a game to get started on.

[Finnegan]

... So.... 

 

 

Larian Studios have just dropped this:

 

 

Everyone's first glance assumption was, naturally, Divinity Original Sin 3.

 

Until some clever nerd realised their file name for the logo was Baldur's Gate 3.

 

Hyperventilation in 3, 2, 1...

[Uranyl Yellow]

2 hours ago, Finnegan said:

... So.... 

 

 

Larian Studios have just dropped this:

 

 

Everyone's first glance assumption was, naturally, Divinity Original Sin 3.

 

Until some clever nerd realised their file name for the logo was Baldur's Gate 3.

 

Hyperventilation in 3, 2, 1...

 

To be honest, they're both decent games so I'm not sure I would class Original Sin 3 to be any less worthy than the prospect of Baldur's Gate 3 (though I suppose Baldur's Gate was the trailblazer series as far as isometric RPGs are concerned). If it is the case, then at least Baldur's Gate 3 is the hands of seasoned developers with a good track record of games in that genre.

 

[Finnegan]

My problem with Divinity is that the lore and story are pretty much completely incomprehensible shit. 

 

My problem with Baldur's Gate is that once you've played the turn based beauty of DOS2, it's really hard to go back to "real time", pause based hack and slash. 

 

The idea of a Larian game based in the Forgotten Realms campaign setting is exciting af. 

Edited 31 May 2019 by Finnegan

[Uranyl Yellow]

Extended gameplay footage from Baldur's Gate 3

 

 

Seems to be coming together somewhat faster than I was expecting. Looks to borrow more from DOS that Baldur's Gate, but that's not too surprising given Larian is developing it, and probably isn't a bad thing anyway.

[Carl the Llama]

12 minutes ago, Uranyl Yellow said:

Extended gameplay footage from Baldur's Gate 3

 

 

Seems to be coming together somewhat faster than I was expecting. Looks to borrow more from DOS that Baldur's Gate, but that's not too surprising given Larian is developing it, and probably isn't a bad thing anyway.

I don't want gameplay footage, I want a release date!  And I want it to be tomorrow!

[Uranyl Yellow]

2 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

I don't want gameplay footage, I want a release date!  And I want it to be tomorrow!

Patience grasshopper. Considering that it was less than a year ago when they announced they had been given the rights to develop it, I'm amazed that they've got this far so quickly.

[Carl the Llama]

Btw the turn based style isn't because it's being made by Larian who used that style so successfully in the DOS games, it's that way because that's how 5e works whereas BG1&2 were based off 3.5e mechanics.  DOS took a lot of inspiration from the modern D&D ruleset so I think it's more the case that the franchise was given to Larian because they've already shown how good they are at making games in that style.

[Carl the Llama]

4 minutes ago, Uranyl Yellow said:

Patience grasshopper. Considering that it was less than a year ago when they announced they had been given the rights to develop it, I'm amazed that they've got this far so quickly.

I can't wait though, this is going to be the best D&D universe video game ever made.  Larian are literally the perfect studio for it.  I have a rule against buying video games at launch but this year is going to see me break that rule twice, first for Cyberpunk and then this.

[Uranyl Yellow]

9 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said:

Btw the turn based style isn't because it's being made by Larian who used that style so successfully in the DOS games, it's that way because that's how 5e works whereas BG1&2 were based off 3.5e mechanics.  DOS took a lot of inspiration from the modern D&D ruleset so I think it's more the case that the franchise was given to Larian because they've already shown how good they are at making games in that style.

Can't say that I'm overly bothered by the transition to a turn-based style rather than the real time with pause - though I was more talking about the additional use of tactical environmental effects, which they seem to have ramped up even more. The use of the height-based mechanics also looks interesting.

 

1 minute ago, Carl the Llama said:

I can't wait though, this is going to be the best D&D universe video game ever made.  Larian are literally the perfect studio for it.  I have a rule against buying video games at launch but this year is going to see me break that rule twice, first for Cyberpunk and then this.

To be honest I'm more looking forward to BG3 - Cyberpunk looks stunning and all, but I fear age has crept up on me and turn-based combat is all my reactions are good for nowadays.

[Carl the Llama]

17 minutes ago, Uranyl Yellow said:

Can't say that I'm overly bothered by the transition to a turn-based style rather than the real time with pause - though I was more talking about the additional use of tactical environmental effects, which they seem to have ramped up even more. The use of the height-based mechanics also looks interesting.

 

To be honest I'm more looking forward to BG3 - Cyberpunk looks stunning and all, but I fear age has crept up on me and turn-based combat is all my reactions are good for nowadays.

Oh yeah I'm 100% more eager for BG3, guarantee it gets more replay time for similar reasons to you, but these are probably my 2 favourite studios in terms of both what they've produced and how they've gone about their business.  And honestly Cyberpunk for me is going to be more about exploring the world CDPR have created with all its little details than the phrenetic gunplay which I'm sure I'll suck at.

[Finnegan]

Turn based has upset a few neckbeards that hate change and refuse to accept DOS is a good game but I'm pleased with the decision. 

 

Pillars was a good game but it highlighted how hard it is to make a more sophisticated, tactical game when everyone's got loads of abilities in a RTWP. 

 

The perfect game would be the Baldur's Gate / Sword Coast universe and narrative with Larian combat so, boom, that's what we're getting. I'm enthusiastic. 

[Charl91]

12 hours ago, Finnegan said:

Turn based has upset a few neckbeards that hate change and refuse to accept DOS is a good game but I'm pleased with the decision. 

 

Pillars was a good game but it highlighted how hard it is to make a more sophisticated, tactical game when everyone's got loads of abilities in a RTWP. 

 

The perfect game would be the Baldur's Gate / Sword Coast universe and narrative with Larian combat so, boom, that's what we're getting. I'm enthusiastic. 

I'm one of the grumpy neckbeards who is absolutely fuming about the change.

 

I like DOS2, and put it as one of my choices in the top games of the last decade thread, but Baldur's Gate 2 is probably my favourite game of all time (only Dark Souls gives it a run for its money). I know the combat isn't for everyone, but I much prefer the real-time combat - especially after experiencing 45+minute fights against oil voidlings, where I'd sometimes have to wait minutes to be able to do anything while I waited for the enemy AI to make it's move. 

 

I'd be happy with another Divinity game, but I'd kill for a new Baldur's Gate. Sadly this seems more like the former  

Edited 3 March 2020 by Charl91

[Finnegan]

Hahahaha we all know exactly what oil voiding fight you mean. 

[Uranyl Yellow]

The worst thing about that fight wasn't so much the length of time, but trying to keep that idiot NPC with a deathwish alive.

[Finnegan]

17 hours ago, Uranyl Yellow said:

The worst thing about that fight wasn't so much the length of time, but trying to keep that idiot NPC with a deathwish alive.

 

I had a mod that allowed six person party size but to compensate I downloaded another mod which automatically increased the number of enemies in every encounter. 

 

That fight was interesting...... 

[Guest]

That fight was absolutely hellish. Think I ended up just repeatedly teleporting him away to relative safety while the rest of my party stood there trying to tank all the fire. Why is it whenever a game asks you to escort or protect an NPC they have to be either completely thick or borderline suicidal?

 

Very much looking forward to BG3 despite having no real knowledge of the originals. Think I read an interview the other day that suggested it'll be ready for early access within a couple of months. The part of me that knows it makes more sense to wait until the full release for a complete/fully functional experience is almost certainly going to be overruled by the inner child in me that wants everything right now.

[Uranyl Yellow]

3 hours ago, Guest said:

That fight was absolutely hellish. Think I ended up just repeatedly teleporting him away to relative safety while the rest of my party stood there trying to tank all the fire. Why is it whenever a game asks you to escort or protect an NPC they have to be either completely thick or borderline suicidal?

Yeh, though in terms of a pure wipefest I still found the Bishop Alexander/Drillworm fight in the harbour much more frustrating. I think on my first playthrough, I wiped so many times that I ended up dropping the difficulty down a level. I managed to do it on my normal difficulty setting on my second playthrough, though I did end up slightly cheating by pre-laying an oil slick that would have put the Exxon Valdez to shame.

[Carl the Llama]

Been taking advantage of all this spare time to delve back into the DOS games, I'm onto the 2nd one now.  I figured I'd give tactician a go but I made some bad decisions levelling up party members and allocating their abilities so combat became a proper slog.  I think my biggest problem was trying to make my main a pure metamorph to try something new, not a great plan as it turns out because he was easily the weakest of the bunch.

 

Anyway I've started a new campaign in classic to brush up on my skills, rolled an undead Dwarf summoner with just Fane and his wizarding skills tagging along so they can use the lone wolf perk - another feature I'd never really explored before - and what a difference it makes!  Probably the most fun I've had with a Divinity build, not least because the combination of summoner and lone wolf allows you to stack into constitution and not get squished at the slightest brush of a melee weapon early doors, I've never had such a beefy magic user before. 

[Guest]

BG3 early access coming in August "probably", depending on how quickly they can get back up to speed with stuff like motion capture. New gameplay/announcement/update trailer today:

Looks like they've been hard at work since the initial reveal.