LCFCJohn

It’s the old ‘teams that can’t catch up’ or this season and last, ‘teams we can’t catch’. Realistically, the highest we will finish would be 21st and that depends on Oxford and Portsmouth doing next to nothing. We have won 17 out of the last 79 league games (21.5%). I really don’t know where people have this bizarre belief we will suddenly win 3 from the last 5 (60%). We don’t have to worry about Rotherham by the way! Not until 2027/2028 in League 2 anyway

Agreed. I think if you had given Rowett James in the side and removed James from the number of games he has missed for Rowett, from Cifuentes during his time, Rowett’s results would be much better. Not that it is a defence of Rowett as you can’t rely on one player. But if people are using PPG to defend Cifuentes over Rowett, James and his availability for both managers is literally the difference. Under Cifuentes, there was barely a game I thought we deserved anything from. We were regularly out of games by half time, it was embarrassing and awful. Under Rowett, the stats are much stronger, chance creation and xG (even though I’m not a massive fan of it). Obviously it’s about results and he is not getting them but let’s not rewrite history where Cifuentes is concerned.

Exactly, this would only happen in exception circumstances, namely the club being run terribly. Why the obedient followers can’t just admit this! Trophies tell you so much. But patterns of league finishes also do. Our standard is lower top tier and top of the second tier. This is proven by 146 years of evidence and data.

But these people actually turn up and watch this. Surely if you were watching Phantom on the West End every week, you’d become clued up enough to write an accurate review so what is these people’s excuse As I say, on account of age, I only have memories from about 2002 onwards. Still a timeframe that captures our lowest points of administration and relegation to the 3rd tier. But as well as people with their heads switched on, who were around in 1991 and even further back backing up that they haven’t seen worse, there is zero evidence of this. Like you say, even though the 2008 team was bargain bin, and really limited, they had the second best defence and got 52 points. This team will likely have the second worst defensive record and not even be able to say they’d have got 52 points if not for the deduction! Interestingly, I looked at goal conceded and QPR have also conceded 63 and only scored 4 more than us (which we have helped them out with) yet sit on 57 points.

Of course they are not mathematically safe yet but they are picking up points and approaching 50 points. We are unlikely to even reach their current points totals come the end of the season, let alone factor in further points they will gain. It all rides on Portsmouth and Oxford.

West Brom and Blackburn are safe. It’s been 2 from 3 for the past few games.

How does 11 years from PL winners to L2 sound?

Yep. When people say ‘we’ve seen worse before’. When and what are they actually referring to? This is loads worse than 2008. It’s worse than the build up to that. I wasn’t actually quite born in 1991 (just after) but like you say, the club hadn’t had the resources available that it has in recent years and hasn’t been at the level we have dropped from.

Not out the question they go up and are above us. I work with a Stockport season ticket holder though and she said she has a holiday booked when the Play off final is and doesn’t think it is going to cause a scheduling conflict Obviously these Stockport, Wrexham, Lincoln and even Harborough as @The Doctormentions, are as much down to their own rises through the league but our fall is massive. All normal and expected as far as the loyalists are concerned though.

Oh wow. Yeah so they will be in the National League North/South (guess geographically borderline). Amazing Which season will we be in the same league do we think?

The comparisons of x club were here when we were winning the league or FA Cup are getting a bit tiresome in some ways but the examples of endless. Winning the league whilst they were in L1 and about to be relegated to L2 to being 2 leagues behind them… Wrexham and Stockport battling it out in non-league whilst we were winning the FA Cup 5 years ago to being 1, maybe 2 leagues behind Wrexham and either in the same league or a league below Stockport. Lincoln being non-league when we won the league and being in the league below them….

Decent shout. Good football family (Howard Wilkinson) and I actually like his playing career was in lower leagues rather than someone who had it comfortable at the top level. Good coaching pedigree at Man City, good opportunity for loans and being at Man City now, hopefully he and McCarron are over the version of ‘playing like Man City’ that Aiyawatt and Rudkin are obsessed with and maybe we could evolve like they have…

Just to be clear, the players with us now and those in your list deserve criticism for how they performed with us (Vardy aside). But this is why I roll my eyes when I read posts basically calling them shit, pub players, Anstey Nomads etc etc without the context and nuance. Some of those like Soumare getting minutes for a team in Qatar is a bit of a stretch and BEK I think we knew there was a player in there. The ones I really think illustrate the point very well are Faes (self explanatory), Justin (looked absolutely done) and Edouard for the reasons you say. Literally it shows how this club is just a cesspit for players. This is why I do expect a Edouard type bounce back from Daka. And Nelson and Stolarcryk I think will flourish once they get out this summer. Others like Ricardo, Ayew, BDR and Vestergaard are just at the end of their careers so I don’t expect them to go and do well elsewhere but yeah, Daka I think will and I feel Nelson and Stolarcryk will be playing at a higher level than us next season.

Dare I say it could probably be a lot worse than Selles. It didn’t work at Sheff Utd but any manager without a Yorkshire accent is destined to fail there. Same happened to Jokanovic. Not sure really but just wouldn’t judge him on the Sheff Utd job.

Have you just identified where the Southampton obsession started

Literally the same point I made recently. We have been League 1 the same number of times as not just winning the top flight, but the FA Cup and Champions League appearances, could even say quarter final. Why is League 1 therefore seen as something we should expect and accept? @OntarioFox backs this up with the data about this only being the third time we’ll have been in the bottom 3 of the second tier. We have also finished 2nd and 3rd in the top tier, so again, it’s not even like a close shave to being relegated to the third tier is more likely than a close shave to winning the top flight. Could point to 4 FA Cup finals before we won it as well. Not to mention 3 League Cups and the 5th place finishes (now gets you in the CL by the way). Far more evidence to suggest this underachievement is even more of an outlier than our best achievements.

If we were going to win another game, the chance came and went this weekend gone. I don’t think we’ll suddenly lose the lot but we have become draw specialists. Swansea - draw Portsmouth - loss - they will want it more Hull - draw Millwall - loss Blackburn - draw

Agree with most of this. Assuming you have mentioned Winks as you expect him to leave even though it has been said his contract isn’t actually up? And hopefully we will keep Page but agree Monga will go as well as Nelson and Fatawu. Signings will need to be well thought out (ha). For example, the right back. Let’s get a solid pro with a good attitude but also not a kid as we have Aluko so you want that balance. Someone he can learn from. Same with centre backs. A mix of younger and an older (not over the hill but just experienced) pros. Like when we have signed players like Morgan. As you say, character and attitude need to be spot on. But I don’t trust the club to do that.

Does it even count as a points total if it’s below 0

His uncle did post on here a while back but I forget the posters name. Certainly nothing like Tommy G though

Different types of player. Fatawu is obviously more flashy on the eyes but Barnes was damn effective. The numbers he put up were very impressive. It will be interesting to see what happens with Fatawu as he obviously missed most of our dismal PL campaign. I wonder if he has the mentality to succeed to the level where he’d exceed Barnes.

Bristol City winning as many games over the weekend just gone as we have in the whole of 2026 so far is quite impressive given we are in April..

They should absolutely not reverse or change at all for that matter, the deduction. It would make an absolute farce of the competition.

That Julie is a right piece of work. So abusive to anybody who doesn’t share her opinion. And when questioned just comes out with doesn’t have to answer herself, I.e don’t have any logically reason to support what she is saying.

I think saying ‘we will never ever get promoted to the PL again’ would of course be daft. My point was more I cannot see any scenario where this ownership turns things around now to make us a serious football club again. If we were to pull a couple of results out the bag and stumble over the line and stay up, look at the league next season; Burnley - always a force in this league Wolves - done what we should have. Accepted they were going to come down and built some momentum according under the new manager. West Ham/Spurs - either of these should have the resources to dominate. Plus other sides who miss out this year. Norwich will be strong. Sheffield United likely stronger although they have trailed off again. We would be nowhere near that end of the league. I wouldn’t put timeframes on it as it does depend on the ownership situation. I think 12 is the longest we have spent outside the top flight for consecutive seasons (post WW1 anyway). Right now, I would say we are at the start of a period in which we will look back on as our new record longest run outside. But KP/Aiyawatt could sell next a year and we could as easily have a Sunderland type revival if the new owner was clued up. My only personal certainty is it won’t happen again under this ownership. I understand others will disagree.