Innovindil Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 5 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said: How about this line of yours? 'Muh chlorine chickens brah. If they're good enough for tens of millions of muricans, they're good enough for me' Are you being sarcastic or what? Because thats the only way I may have misunderstood You seem to be saying that because these practises are common then they are fine by definition False, I am saying that because these practises are fine for millions of Americans, they are fine for ME. I don't particularly give a **** if they're fine for you or not. If they aren't, don't buy them.
Fox Ulike Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 3 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said: Thats funny, i've just quoted him saying that as further evidence that he chooses to ignore the issue and you're using it somehow to suggest he is keen to criticise the methods of farming You're doing it to me now. I've said no such thing!! You should use "quotes" to highlight the points of people's posts that you want to talk about. Using phrases like "you seem to be saying" and "you're using it to suggest" does nothing but enable you to put your own spin on whatever is actually said.
Guest MattP Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 10 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said: How about this line of yours? 'Muh chlorine chickens brah. If they're good enough for tens of millions of muricans, they're good enough for me' Are you being sarcastic or what? Because thats the only way I may have misunderstood You seem to be saying that because these practises are common then they are fine by definition You've even read it and you still can't understand what he has actually said.
Guest Foxin_mad Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 8 minutes ago, Fox Ulike said: Not at all I'm just reacting to the only example I've been given. Chick-chick-chick-chick chicken. Please tell me there's another reason we're leaving the EU? I can understand why some people may wish to leave the EU. I may not agree but I fully understand their distrust and concerns. It has many faults and is seemingly unwilling to change the status quo and continues to proceed down a path towards a federal Europe. Personally I would have preferred us to stay in a reformed EU. I do think that as an institution it may well reach braking point in the next few years, because those in charge refuse to except there is an issue. There is already much discontent amongst the Eastern block countries, who ironically cause the issues with free movement due to massively disproportionate living standards to Western Europe. There are huge fundamental issues that someone needs to address but I think they are burying their heads in the sand a little.
AlloverthefloorYesNdidi Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 2 minutes ago, Fox Ulike said: You're doing it to me now. I've said no such thing!! You should use "quotes" to highlight the points of people's posts that you want to talk about. Using phrases like "you seem to be saying" and "you're using it to suggest" does nothing but enable you to put your own spin on whatever is actually said. 'To be fair what he said was that if it's good enough for the 300m people of American, then it should be good enough for over here.' I realise you are talking about Brexit specifically and not farming. but when you bring up a subject that is crucial and contentious, simply because its secondary to your main topic doesnt mean you can be frivolous about it The above quote is the basic concept of his that i had issue with. He did speak about eating food anecdotally as an analysis of its quality. That isnt my spin! The above quote of yours is saying how he has said if its good enough for them its good enough for me. There is no spin on that, its just a strange way to decide policy, doing something because someone else does it.
AlloverthefloorYesNdidi Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 2 minutes ago, MattP said: You've even read it and you still can't understand what he has actually said. Yes, I see that you are talking about it from a consumer point of view, as in, dont buy it if you dont want it He also literally said that he ate chicken and he is still alive, which therefore means its ok. If you dont have a problém with that statement then fair enough. A bat shit crazy statement sits in the middle of an argument and it doesnt bother you because of some wider political context of the discussion is your issue
David Guiza Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 14 minutes ago, Foxin_mad said: Thing that makes me laugh is that the hard core remainers act like the EU is some kind of animal rights championing high quality food organisation. In fact this is not true, remember how we got served, horse and various other animals as a result of EU regulation? Remember Fipronil in EU Eggs, they are doing a damn fine job it seems. The reality is perhaps both need improvement, except the hard core remainers would never ever pick fault with the EU. As champions of the poor, the cheaper food with less animal welfare applied to it (not saying this is correct by any means) will enable them to have a better diet and reduce the cost of living, surely this is a good thing? We cant have it all ways? Well, something like 80% of the entirety of UK animal welfare legislation has origins from the EU. As for your last sentence, I don't even know where to begin, I somehow don't think that feeding 'the poor' discounted meat will 'enable them to have a better diet'. It may kill them off though, so there's a bonus for some I guess. I didn't realise it was a case of Sophie's choice between animal welfare and feeding the poor, can't we have both? 2
Innovindil Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 2 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said: Yes, I see that you are talking about it from a consumer point of view, as in, dont buy it if you dont want it He also literally said that he ate chicken and he is still alive, which therefore means its ok. If you dont have a problém with that statement then fair enough. A bat shit crazy statement sits in the middle of an argument and it doesnt bother you because of some wider political context of the discussion is your issue Never seen anyone so triggered over so little before. This is brilliant.
Carl the Llama Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 There is too much chicken chat by far in this here pigeons and doves thread, sort yourselves out lads.
Fox Ulike Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 12 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said: 'To be fair what he said was that if it's good enough for the 300m people of American, then it should be good enough for over here.' I realise you are talking about Brexit specifically and not farming. but when you bring up a subject that is crucial and contentious, simply because its secondary to your main topic doesnt mean you can be frivolous about it The above quote is the basic concept of his that i had issue with. He did speak about eating food anecdotally as an analysis of its quality. That isnt my spin! The above quote of yours is saying how he has said if its good enough for them its good enough for me. There is no spin on that, its just a strange way to decide policy, doing something because someone else does it. OK it's not spin in that instance. It's cherry-picking. Yes he said that he ate chicken and didn't die. And, if that was all he said then you would have a point. But he also made the point that millions of Americans eat chlorinated chicken, and they don't die from it either.
Strokes Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 I don’t get why people care about the animals welfare before they kill and eat it, sure you want the animal to be healthy but what else?
Strokes Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 6 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said: There is too much chicken chat by far in this here pigeons and doves thread, sort yourselves out lads. I’d try chlorinated pigeon if it was cheaper.
AlloverthefloorYesNdidi Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 1 minute ago, Fox Ulike said: OK it's not spin in that instance. It's cherry-picking. Yes he said that he ate chicken and didn't die. And, if that was all he said then you would have a point. But he also made the point that millions of Americans eat chlorinated chicken, and they don't die from it either. Tbf I think this got out of hand when i rhetorically used the phrase about him not wanting to question farming methods My basic point was that personal anecdotal evidence is not really useful in this instance Millions of Americans not dying is in my book about as valid an argument. There are tons of documentaries demonstrating the long term and wide spread issues with our current food practises, to be even more cavalier about them than we already are doesnt sound good to me
Guest MattP Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 Food does trigger people these days, I told a Vegan they looked like an unhealthy twig on Saturday and they went mental at me, then two hours later they came back to me after I'd forgotten all about it and started showing me a table of how they actually get more protein than I do. Really was weird.
Innovindil Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 3 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said: Tbf I think this got out of hand when i rhetorically used the phrase about him not wanting to question farming methods My basic point was that personal anecdotal evidence is not really useful in this instance Millions of Americans not dying is in my book about as valid an argument. There are tons of documentaries demonstrating the long term and wide spread issues with our current food practises, to be even more cavalier about them than we already are doesnt sound good to me That's great. It doesn't sound good to you. So we should all bow to your power and not have our own opinions, right? I know I'm misinterpreting your post, but really, who gives a **** about something like that.
Fox Ulike Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 19 minutes ago, Foxin_mad said: I can understand why some people may wish to leave the EU. I may not agree but I fully understand their distrust and concerns. It has many faults and is seemingly unwilling to change the status quo and continues to proceed down a path towards a federal Europe. Personally I would have preferred us to stay in a reformed EU. I do think that as an institution it may well reach braking point in the next few years, because those in charge refuse to except there is an issue. There is already much discontent amongst the Eastern block countries, who ironically cause the issues with free movement due to massively disproportionate living standards to Western Europe. There are huge fundamental issues that someone needs to address but I think they are burying their heads in the sand a little. Absolutely. I agree with every word. I think the EU has been completely in denial over Brexit. They have never questioned why Britain wanted to leave; or taken any steps to suggest that they may need some level of reform to either prevent Brexit, or to prevent further countries following suit. However, you do have to remember that the EU isn't a political entity in the same way that Britain or France is. It really is just an out-sourcing organisation for trade and standards. It doesn't have a Government to lead it to the reform that it needs. It has 28 Governments. So it's a bit of a catch-22. The EU can't change until it is a federal Union with a decision-making Government at its head, but it can't become a federal Union without major change!
Fox Ulike Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 (edited) 13 minutes ago, AlloverthefloorYesNdidi said: Tbf I think this got out of hand when i rhetorically used the phrase about him not wanting to question farming methods My basic point was that personal anecdotal evidence is not really useful in this instance Millions of Americans not dying is in my book about as valid an argument. There are tons of documentaries demonstrating the long term and wide spread issues with our current food practises, to be even more cavalier about them than we already are doesnt sound good to me Fair play. And I agree with that. 24 minutes ago, Carl the Llama said: There is too much chicken chat by far in this here pigeons and doves thread, sort yourselves out lads. Unfortunately, despite giving them several opportunities, none of the Leave mob on here have come up with any other reason to leave the EU. Which is why we're still on chickens. Chickens should have to live their short lives knee-deep in shit and piss. It's unfair to us poor humans to have to fork out an extra 90p for a chicken burger so that some la-di-da chicken can live in the luxury of a shit-free cage. That's why we're leaving the EU. Edited 15 February 2018 by Fox Ulike
AlloverthefloorYesNdidi Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 7 minutes ago, Innovindil said: That's great. It doesn't sound good to you. So we should all bow to your power and not have our own opinions, right? I know I'm misinterpreting your post, but really, who gives a **** about something like that. Sorry if i've done that bru 1
Guest MattP Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 4 minutes ago, Fox Ulike said: Fair play. And I agree with that. Unfortunately, despite giving them several opportunities, none of the Leave mob on here have come up with any other reason to leave the EU. Which is why we're still on chickens. Chickens should have to live their short lives knee-deep in shit and piss. It's unfair to us poor humans to have to fork out an extra 90p for a chicken burger so that some la-di-da chicken can live in the luxury of a shit-free cage. That's why we're leaving the EU. Despite the fact that leave mob have continually given you reasons for leaving that vary from no jurisdiction of the ECJ over British courts to being able to conduct independent trade deals to removing tariffs from non-EU imports to full border control. But no, it's all about the chickens, blue passports and singng Rule Britannia of course.
David Guiza Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 12 minutes ago, Strokes said: I don’t get why people care about the animals welfare before they kill and eat it, sure you want the animal to be healthy but what else? Well I've been veggie for about 4 years so even if the animal is wined and dined and then treated to a blow job before it was slaughtered I'd still feel sorry for the poor cow (pun very much intended). 6 minutes ago, MattP said: Food does trigger people these days, I told a Vegan they looked like an unhealthy twig on Saturday and they went mental at me, then two hours later they came back to me after I'd forgotten all about it and started showing me a table of how they actually get more protein than I do. Really was weird. I don't get it either, and It happens in the reverse too. My dietary choices are mentioned by my friends, family and colleagues infinitely more than I ever do; to the point that it's like being at a very underwhelming Q&A when eating out with them.
Fox Ulike Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 1 minute ago, MattP said: Despite the fact that leave mob have continually given you reasons for leaving that vary from no jurisdiction of the ECJ over British courts to being able to conduct independent trade deals to removing tariffs from non-EU imports to full border control. But no, it's all about the chickens, blue passports and singng Rule Britannia of course. OK. So we want no jurisdiction of the ECJ (so that we can treat our chickens how we please). We want independent trade deals and the removal of tariffs (so we can import and buy US chickens). That is literally all that has been posited on this board. I'm not even joking. What other benefits will these things bring to Britain that don't involve a chicken?
Innovindil Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 1 minute ago, Fox Ulike said: OK. So we want no jurisdiction of the ECJ (so that we can treat our chickens how we please). We want independent trade deals and the removal of tariffs (so we can import and buy US chickens). That is literally all that has been posited on this board. I'm not even joking. What other benefits will these things bring to Britain that don't involve a chicken? Probably get lamb cheaper too tbf.
Fox Ulike Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 Just now, Innovindil said: Probably get lamb cheaper too tbf. OK. Well that is something. I like lamb, and I'm tight. Anything away from the whole meat arena? So some food will be cheaper? That's good. Wait a minute though. @MattPwas saying yesterday about how the EU's trade deals with African farmers are unfair. So presumably these will be renegotiated in favour of the East African farmers? So some food will be more expensive. That's bad. 1
Guest MattP Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 3 minutes ago, Fox Ulike said: OK. So we want no jurisdiction of the ECJ (so that we can treat our chickens how we please). We want independent trade deals and the removal of tariffs (so we can import and buy US chickens). That is literally all that has been posited on this board. I'm not even joking. What other benefits will these things bring to Britain that don't involve a chicken? I think you are trolling bit I'll answer anyway breifly. No jurisdiction of the ECJ gives a sovereign nation full control of it's courts, something every country should aspire to as to set out the boundaries and rules of its society, let alone the birthpace of Magna Carta and Habeas Corpus. Independent trade is just that, our government can be responsible for it and we can then judge them accordingly, if they fcuk it up on them, I'd much rather that than be veteod by Wallonia as the Canadian deal was. Removal of tariffs should be obvious, it helps the poorest in our society and the poorest in others, I have no interest in making those at the bottom pay more for their goods to protect people in richer nations. But yeah, chickens, bluey and Rule Britannia innit.
Guest MattP Posted 15 February 2018 Posted 15 February 2018 6 minutes ago, Fox Ulike said: Wait a minute though. @MattPwas saying yesterday about how the EU's trade deals with African farmers are unfair. So presumably these will be renegotiated in favour of the East African farmers? The Tariffs are unfair, we don't have trade deals with African farmers. Do you think it's fair we are forced to put tariffs on those farmers to protect wealthier Europeans?
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