Technology, Science and the Environment.

[leicsmac]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c93qvqx5y01o

 

Dr Goodall not pulling her punches then.

 

There is such a disconnect between what people who know lots about the topic say need to be done and government policymaking on the matter - the difference is huge, it's costly and if something isn't done about it then the cost will veer towards the absolute.

Edited 17 November 2024 by leicsmac

[SpacedX]

Starship Flight 6 launch window opens at 5.00pm EST, 10.00pm GMT tonight. 

[leicsmac]

52 minutes ago, SpacedX said:

Starship Flight 6 launch window opens at 5.00pm EST, 10.00pm GMT tonight. 

Wonder if they'll be able to recover the upper stage this time?

[The Bear]

2 hours ago, SpacedX said:

Starship Flight 6 launch window opens at 5.00pm EST, 10.00pm GMT tonight. 

Just happened to see this is live now. 

 

30 mins to launch. 

 

https://www.youtube.com/live/dtmvbQDou4I?si=4rT2WRZjBl08pDBW

[leicsmac]

Cleared tower and away, good stage separation!

[leicsmac]

Lower stage diverted into the sea, soft landing followed by going full Kerbal. Shame, but let's see if they can recover the upper stage.

[Lionator]

That was amazing to see, fair play Mr. Musk. 

[SpacedX]

The fact that they removed 2,000 tiles to evaluate tolerances during reentry is not only astonishing from an engineering standpoint, but hugely significant in terms of potential payload weight gain. 

[leicsmac]

1 minute ago, SpacedX said:

The fact that they removed 2,000 tiles to evaluate tolerances during reentry is not only astonishing from an engineering standpoint, but hugely significant in terms of potential payload weight gain. 

Mass budget is huge, as you say. And every launch they're learning more.

 

Hopefully they'll be in a position where they have all or most of the information they need in time for the next Mars Hohmann transfer window.

[leicsmac]

Artemis timeline slips by another six months, due to additional crew capsule concerns.

 

Guess it could have been worse.

[blabyboy]

ULA and Blue Origin really looking bad compared to SpaceX atm. Need to get Vulcan performing really well if they're going to even keep pace with the Chinese.

 

All hail our coming taiko overlords

[leicsmac]

RFK looking to bring back belief in the "research" of "Doctor" Wakefield, then.

 

Measles epidemic in the US, anyone?

[leicsmac]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cjdne9ke0m1o

 

Burning wood at home produces more pollution than road traffic, according to new research.

The findings, from the University of Birmingham, show a quarter of harmful particles in the air, known as PM2.5s, come from domestic fires while traffic is responsible for 22%.

Wood-burning stoves have risen in popularity in the UK with an estimated 1.9m homes now having one, according to the Stove Industry Alliance.

One campaigner from Birmingham said she was worried the effect they were having on children and others with health issues.

 

Rather dark props to the guys who managed to market these as "clean" or whatever; a truly majestic falsehood to sell.

[leicsmac]

And in transatlantic science news, more than 75 Nobel laureates in the hard sciences have taken the unprecedented step of writing a letter to Congress urging them not to confirm RFK Jr. as the DoH head.

 

The Trump team response?

 

“Americans are sick and tired of the elites telling them what to do and how to do it. Our health care system in this country is broken, Mr. Kennedy will enact President Trump's agenda to restore the integrity of our health care and Make America Healthy Again.”

 

Nothing says owning the "elites" like the freedom to choose suffering and death (and crushing medical debt because, you know, this is the US) in spite of the most exacting scientific evidence and expertise, not only for yourself but for everyone else, right?

[worth_the_wait]

I notice that over the last hour or so, 68% of the UK's electricity generation is from Gas.    As high as I've seen it in the last couple of years

Wind had been producing a good % of power over most of the previous week, but is down to 6% at the moment. 

Solar obviously 0% at the moment, and pretty much negligible for the whole of December.

 

How's this all going to work with an increasing population, electric cars, heat pumps, railway electrification, etc ?

 

<<< Edited: Attached a picture I was having trouble with earlier! >>>

 

Edited 12 December 2024 by worth_the_wait

[Grebfromgrebland]

16 minutes ago, worth_the_wait said:

I notice that over the last hour or so, 68% of the UK's electricity generation is from Gas.    As high as I've seen it in the last couple of years

Wind had been producing a good % of power over most of the previous week, but is down to 6% at the moment. 

Solar obviously 0% at the moment, and pretty much negligible for the whole of December.

 

How's this all going to work with an increasing population, electric cars, heat pumps, railway electrification, etc ?

 

 

Our wind turbines have actually produced more than ever but we don't have the necessary wiring to use all the energy they produce. Underinvestment in infrastructure just like with our water holds is back immensely.

[davieG]

On 10/12/2024 at 19:41, leicsmac said:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cjdne9ke0m1o

 

Burning wood at home produces more pollution than road traffic, according to new research.

The findings, from the University of Birmingham, show a quarter of harmful particles in the air, known as PM2.5s, come from domestic fires while traffic is responsible for 22%.

Wood-burning stoves have risen in popularity in the UK with an estimated 1.9m homes now having one, according to the Stove Industry Alliance.

One campaigner from Birmingham said she was worried the effect they were having on children and others with health issues.

 

Rather dark props to the guys who managed to market these as "clean" or whatever; a truly majestic falsehood to sell.

These stoves have always puzzled me in how they are allowed. I can't imagine any smoke created from burning stuff is clean.

[leicsmac]

27 minutes ago, davieG said:

These stoves have always puzzled me in how they are allowed. I can't imagine any smoke created from burning stuff is clean.

Another case of marketing and selling moving faster than legislation, I think.

 

Unless you're using proper grade filters, no smoke created from burning anything other than gas is clean in terms of particulate matter. And that's saying nothing of carbon monoxide/dioxide.

[jgtuk]

2 hours ago, leicsmac said:

Another case of marketing and selling moving faster than legislation, I think.

 

Unless you're using proper grade filters, no smoke created from burning anything other than gas is clean in terms of particulate matter. And that's saying nothing of carbon monoxide/dioxide.

And necessity, many people have no access to a gas supply and wood burners offer an affordable alternative to LPG, oil or electric heating which are all far more expensive. 

I've viewed lot's of properties here in rural Wales that rely solely on open fires or wood stoves with or without back boiler for their heating needs. 

[leicsmac]

15 minutes ago, jgtuk said:

And necessity, many people have no access to a gas supply and wood burners offer an affordable alternative to LPG, oil or electric heating which are all far more expensive. 

I've viewed lot's of properties here in rural Wales that rely solely on open fires or wood stoves with or without back boiler for their heating needs. 

I've no doubt that a lot of people both in the UK and around the world use open fires or stoves as a matter of necessity.

 

However, there are those that don't and unfortunately the necessity of use has no effect on the short and long term consequences of use. It's clearly an issue that requires intervention and help for those users to solve.

[worth_the_wait]

20 hours ago, Grebfromgrebland said:

Our wind turbines have actually produced more than ever but we don't have the necessary wiring to use all the energy they produce. Underinvestment in infrastructure just like with our water holds is back immensely.

When you say "use all the energy they produce", what do you actually mean?   
 
You could increase wind power 10-fold from our current level, but that's still not going to help you when there isn't much wind around.  The last 2 days have  seen wind power electricity generation at about 3% during the evening peak requirements (approx 45 Gigawatts).   Multiply that by 10, and you're still nowhere near half our requirements.
 
Bear in mind, that you can't really store electricity as such.  You need to generate electricity at the time you need it.  So even if we dramatically expand wind electricity generation, what are we going to do with the excess?
 
We can export it to other countries via the Interconnectors, in the hope that they will export their surplus to us when we need it.  But there's absolutely no guarantee they would have a surplus when we need it.
 
The only other thing we can do with our excess wind-generated electricity, is convert it into some other energy ... and indeed there are quite a few options.  eg Pumped Storage Hydro, liquid air energy storage, spinning wheels rotational energy, or recharging batteries.   But do any of these realistically scale up anywhere near to providing 30-45 Gigawatts of electricity, for several days or longer if a nice big High pressure system plonks itself over us?    
 
If we're talking about "storing" electricity, we're not just talking about a "underinvestment in infrastructure" ... we're talking about a quantum leap of process, and of technology scaled-up to unimaginable levels.   The cost of which would be eye watering.   Not just for domestic users, but also business and industry (the consequences of which are frightening).
 
My initial question stands ... how is this all going to work, if the plan is to try and rely on renewables such as wind and solar?
 

[The Bear]

I guess one solution is that more and more people get solar panels and have battery storage on their homes. That can be pumped back into the grid as and when needed. 

 

Whether it's scalable or the numbers needed are viable I have no idea, but we are only a small nation so should be able to make something work with the amount of coastal wind we have available too. 

Edited 12 December 2024 by The Bear

[leicsmac]

1 hour ago, worth_the_wait said:

When you say "use all the energy they produce", what do you actually mean?   
 
You could increase wind power 10-fold from our current level, but that's still not going to help you when there isn't much wind around.  The last 2 days have  seen wind power electricity generation at about 3% during the evening peak requirements (approx 45 Gigawatts).   Multiply that by 10, and you're still nowhere near half our requirements.
 
Bear in mind, that you can't really store electricity as such.  You need to generate electricity at the time you need it.  So even if we dramatically expand wind electricity generation, what are we going to do with the excess?
 
We can export it to other countries via the Interconnectors, in the hope that they will export their surplus to us when we need it.  But there's absolutely no guarantee they would have a surplus when we need it.
 
The only other thing we can do with our excess wind-generated electricity, is convert it into some other energy ... and indeed there are quite a few options.  eg Pumped Storage Hydro, liquid air energy storage, spinning wheels rotational energy, or recharging batteries.   But do any of these realistically scale up anywhere near to providing 30-45 Gigawatts of electricity, for several days or longer if a nice big High pressure system plonks itself over us?    
 
If we're talking about "storing" electricity, we're not just talking about a "underinvestment in infrastructure" ... we're talking about a quantum leap of process, and of technology scaled-up to unimaginable levels.   The cost of which would be eye watering.   Not just for domestic users, but also business and industry (the consequences of which are frightening).
 
My initial question stands ... how is this all going to work, if the plan is to try and rely on renewables such as wind and solar?
 

 

Just now, The Bear said:

I guess one solution is that more and more people get solar panels and have battery storage on their homes. That can be used back into the grid as and when needed. 

 

Whether it's scalable or the numbers needed viable I have no idea, but we are only a small nation so should be able to make something worknwith the amount of coastal wind we have available too. 

This.

 

Wind is merely one part of a suite of solutions, both generation and storage related, that need to be applied. Gen III/IV fission really should be in there too, to be honest.

 

But also honestly, such solutions need to be rolled out to the rest of the world to be truly effective in addressing the problems already making themselves manifest.

[Robo61]

1 hour ago, worth_the_wait said:

When you say "use all the energy they produce", what do you actually mean?   
 
You could increase wind power 10-fold from our current level, but that's still not going to help you when there isn't much wind around.  The last 2 days have  seen wind power electricity generation at about 3% during the evening peak requirements (approx 45 Gigawatts).   Multiply that by 10, and you're still nowhere near half our requirements.
 
Bear in mind, that you can't really store electricity as such.  You need to generate electricity at the time you need it.  So even if we dramatically expand wind electricity generation, what are we going to do with the excess?
 
We can export it to other countries via the Interconnectors, in the hope that they will export their surplus to us when we need it.  But there's absolutely no guarantee they would have a surplus when we need it.
 
The only other thing we can do with our excess wind-generated electricity, is convert it into some other energy ... and indeed there are quite a few options.  eg Pumped Storage Hydro, liquid air energy storage, spinning wheels rotational energy, or recharging batteries.   But do any of these realistically scale up anywhere near to providing 30-45 Gigawatts of electricity, for several days or longer if a nice big High pressure system plonks itself over us?    
 
If we're talking about "storing" electricity, we're not just talking about a "underinvestment in infrastructure" ... we're talking about a quantum leap of process, and of technology scaled-up to unimaginable levels.   The cost of which would be eye watering.   Not just for domestic users, but also business and industry (the consequences of which are frightening).
 
My initial question stands ... how is this all going to work, if the plan is to try and rely on renewables such as wind and solar?
 

What do you mean you can't really  of store electricity, where do you think your mobile phone is getting its power from.

Edited 12 December 2024 by Robo61

[worth_the_wait]

42 minutes ago, Robo61 said:

What do you mean you can't really  of store electricity, where do you think your mobile phone is getting its power from.

Sorry, I thought you understood what I meant by "you can't really store electricity as such."    
 
You can only "store electricity" in a capacitor, and you generally can't store that much of it in the real world.   Most electricity grids are based around generating it, when it is actually needed.  So for example, at half time of a big football match, when millions of people go and put the kettle on ... the authorities will bring onstream whatever they need to generate the corresponding electricity eg bring up a gas-fired power station, or bring wind farms online etc.
 
When you talk colloquially about "storing electricity", what you actually mean is a device that has energy stored in a form that can be converted back into electricity.   So in the case of a rechargeable battery ... you plug it into the mains, use electricity to make chemical changes to the battery ie store chemical energy ("charge it up").  Then at a future point in time, the battery can be used to generate an electrical current - for whatever you want to do.   But the battery isn't actually storing electricity.

 

In the same way, when you have excess electricity generated, you could use it to pump water up a mountain.   You are then storing gravitational energy.   When you need to generate electricity again, you can let the water run downhill and through a turbine.   But as per the example above with a battery, you're not actually storing electricity.   You are doing something that gives you the means to generate electricity as and when you need it.   That's what Pumped Storage Hydro (PSH) schemes are.

 

Hopefully that explains it a bit better.