General News Thread

[DennisNedry]

On 06/09/2026 at 09:31, Finnegan said:

 

Ah here we go. I was waiting for "both sides are just the same" etc. 

 

There are very obviously people that go to pretty much any demonstration, whatever their politics, and cover their face because they either think they're looking edgy or cool or because they fear the legal backlash from an authoritarian state. 

 

There are also dick heads that go to literally any public gathering or demonstration to cause violence or problems because they're just nobs, whatever they believe in. Sure. 

 

But there's a big difference between some people in a crowd wrapping a bandana on their face or putting on a covid mask and a large organised mob turning up in a fascist coded uniform that completely involves covering their face. 

 

I mean, one of these things is not like the others, right? 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Any comment on these? 

[Finnegan]

32 minutes ago, DennisNedry said:

Any comment on these? 

 

Which do you want me to look at, the ultra conservative thugs in full black gear and face coverings that nicely prove my point? (You... you are aware that militant Islamists calling for a caliphate are also far right conservative extremists, yeah? You don't have to be a white person to be a fascist?) 

 

Or did you want me to comment on the people literally doing fascist salutes? Like, literally people deliberately copying the Nazis? 

 

Or was your point "here's some brave people doing a Nazi salute NOT covering their faces, eat your words, Finners, Neo Nazis can be brave too!" 

 

I mean. To be fair in that last case, you know what, you got me man yeah. Well done. 

 

[Noahfence]

2 hours ago, Jon the Hat said:

There is, we can deport them to an island somewhere.  It would save a fortune on the welfare bill.  Mind you it would have to be somewhere relatively cold - too warm and their shitty all black tracksuits and balaclavas would go to waste, and they would get sunburnt.  So not Australia.

For what it’s worth whilst I’m deeply uncomfortable with thousands of undocumented men entering the country I absolutely don’t agree with the scenes in Dover & Portsmouth.
 

Because no good will come from it and I don’t think you should be able to cover your face in public. 

 

Anyway, the earth will have cooked us all in the not so distance future so we won’t have to worry this tedious subject anymore 

[leicsmac]

4 minutes ago, Noahfence said:

For what it’s worth whilst I’m deeply uncomfortable with thousands of undocumented men entering the country I absolutely don’t agree with the scenes in Dover & Portsmouth.
 

Because no good will come from it and I don’t think you should be able to cover your face in public. 

 

Anyway, the earth will have cooked us all in the not so distance future so we won’t have to worry this tedious subject anymore 

And the awful thing about the Earth cooking us all is as it does so, this matter will become more and more significant as vast tracts of land become functionally uninhabitable due to food and potable water becoming practically impossible to source to a necessary degree. 

[Noahfence]

4 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

And the awful thing about the Earth cooking us all is as it does so, this matter will become more and more significant as vast tracts of land become functionally uninhabitable due to food and potable water becoming practically impossible to source to a necessary degree. 

I don’t know about you and this might sound morbid but I quite like knowing that the planet can humble us quite easily. Just a gentle reminder that we aren’t in charge.

 

Throw in the rise of AI and a good percentage of young people who have basically given up on life I reckon the next few decades will be really fun.  
 

 

[leicsmac]

5 minutes ago, Noahfence said:

I don’t know about you and this might sound morbid but I quite like knowing that the planet can humble us quite easily. Just a gentle reminder that we aren’t in charge.

 

Throw in the rise of AI and a good percentage of young people who have basically given up on life I reckon the next few decades will be really fun.  
 

 

I wouldn't say that I like it per se, but I do simply know it to be true in the same way gravity is. 

 

We certainly aren't in charge, and it would be nice if our species in general both acknowledged that and also did what we could to not make things worse for each other. Goodness knows the natural world can and will give us enough headaches. 

[Lionator]

19 hours ago, Vacamion said:

 

Saxony Anhalt is in the news because the far right AfD party seems to have won a State election there (it's in Germany).

 

I lived in Saxony Anhalt for a year when I was a student, just after reunification at the start of the 1990s.

 

There were many hangovers from the Communist days during my time there - Russian Army soldiers were still stationed at the edge of the town, I got lodgings with a family of "red socks" who (I was later told by others) were suspected of having informed on friends and neighbours for the Stasi. 

 

Cars seen around town were mostly Trabants, Ladas and Wartburgs, not Western cars.

 

Infrastructure creaked, however.

 

Many I spoke with said it hadn't *all* been bad in the past and many were upset that everything (even some good stuff) had been swept away, in order to unite the two halves of the country.

 

They've had it fairly rough in Saxony Anhalt over the last 35 years.

 

Westerners swooped in and bought up, asset-stripped and closed down businesses in the State and unemployment was rife.

 

Then they've had a massive brain drain, because there were so few good jobs locally.  

 

It's been fertile ground for misinformation.   

 

Compared to Western States of Germany, Saxony Anhalt has absorbed relatively few immigrants, but Social Media algos tell the poor people that the foreigners are after their biscuits (if you recognise the meme), and the AfD has cashed in, exploiting people's fears.

 

I think that it is regrettable that the AfD appears to have won there tonight.

 

However, there still remains a massive anti right wing sentiment in Saxony Anhalt,, which is not always as widely reported in the UK.

 

I'm hopeful that the AfD only only got the largest party, rather than an absolute majority, and that too much damage isn't done by this result.

 

 

Merz is an appalling politician, and there are some really bad ones in Europe at the moment. Meloni and Sanchez are the only thriving leaders imo. Now he’s just going to swing further to the right. Getting his arse handed to him is what he deserves.

 

Though what is funny is that Russians complain Germany is returning to the days of ‘fascism’ while simultaneously supporting the AfD lol. Almost like they’re idiots. 

[st albans fox]

4 hours ago, Lionator said:

Merz is an appalling politician, and there are some really bad ones in Europe at the moment. Meloni and Sanchez are the only thriving leaders imo. Now he’s just going to swing further to the right. Getting his arse handed to him is what he deserves.

 

Though what is funny is that Russians complain Germany is returning to the days of ‘fascism’ while simultaneously supporting the AfD lol. Almost like they’re idiots. 

Would Sanchez win an election held today ?  Not according to current polling 

 

just cos we may like a politician doesn’t make them popular in their own country 

 

gonna be an interesting day tomorrow - will wait for the policy detail but I would be amazed if no 10 don’t make a pigs ear of the settlement trading sanctions, 

[leicsmac]

7 hours ago, st albans fox said:

Would Sanchez win an election held today ?  Not according to current polling 

 

just cos we may like a politician doesn’t make them popular in their own country 

 

gonna be an interesting day tomorrow - will wait for the policy detail but I would be amazed if no 10 don’t make a pigs ear of the settlement trading sanctions, 

It's an interesting one in Spain by the looks of it - Sanchez is about on a par with other leaders there in terms of straight popularity, but Feijoo's party itself is polling much better. Thankfully Feijoo himself appears to be a moderate who would have a similar stance on a fair few international issues as Sanchez does.

 

WRT the settlement trading sanctions, it baffles me how the UK is even trading in items produced there anyway given the obvious moral and legal dubiousness of the existence of such settlements in the first place.

 

 

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

 

WRT the settlement trading sanctions, it baffles me how the UK is even trading in items produced there anyway given the obvious moral and legal dubiousness of the existence of such settlements in the first place.

 

 

As I understand it, EU countries (and i assume the U.K. is included) have had a defacto ban since 2005 by removing tarrif advantages for goods produced in those areas. 
but it’s lazily enforced and open to abuse. Several EU countries have recently brought in more stringent rules whereby they insist on postal codes being listed on import docs and apply serious penalties to those attempting to defraud the system. 
 

my assumption is that on many products (which could be produced in WB or Golan) that can be sourced in other countries, buyers will avoid purchasing from isr completely to avoid any risk.  There is no chance that the isr govt would ensure that their supply chain becomes more transparent to assist exporters not involved. 
So it will become a de facto ban on isr imports across a range of items.
This is probably where the basis for the policy lies - if you want to keep trading then stop building illegal settlements.  We know that won’t happen . 

Will isr respond by cutting supply on other exports like military equipment that is actually important for our defence. 
and the USA are unlikely to get seriously involved beyond some angry statements - they haven’t with the other nations that have invoked this policy. 

[leicsmac]

3 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

As I understand it, EU countries (and i assume the U.K. is included) have had a defacto ban since 2005 by removing tarrif advantages for goods produced in those areas. 
but it’s lazily enforced and open to abuse. Several EU countries have recently brought in more stringent rules whereby they insist on postal codes being listed on import docs and apply serious penalties to those attempting to defraud the system. 
 

my assumption is that on many products (which could be produced in WB or Golan) that can be sourced in other countries, buyers will avoid purchasing from isr completely to avoid any risk.  There is no chance that the isr govt would ensure that their supply chain becomes more transparent to assist exporters not involved. 
So it will become a de facto ban on isr imports across a range of items.
This is probably where the basis for the policy lies - if you want to keep trading then stop building illegal settlements.  We know that won’t happen . 

Will isr respond by cutting supply on other exports like military equipment that is actually important for our defence. 
and the USA are unlikely to get seriously involved beyond some angry statements - they haven’t with the other nations that have invoked this policy. 

Appreciate the further information. IMO the UK really should show solidarity with the EU nations on refusing such trade, no matter the product. I'm sure the UK can source its killing toys from elsewhere of decent quality. 

 

It's just unfortunate that everyone concerned is either too toothless or actively encouraging the reasonably blatant illegality that's happening there. 

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

Appreciate the further information. IMO the UK really should show solidarity with the EU nations on refusing such trade, no matter the product. I'm sure the UK can source its killing toys from elsewhere of decent quality. 

 

It's just unfortunate that everyone concerned is either too toothless or actively encouraging the reasonably blatant illegality that's happening there. 

some of the killing toys aren’t easily sourced elsewhere 

 

as an example, Sanchez has had to buy a system from Germany (which they’re buyingfrom isr and’ relabelling’) to get around his sanctions. so it’s possible but will cost more. (As is the case with all sanctions ).  
 

something which has just popped up re the USA is that there are laws in some states there that prohibit trade with countries that have sanctions on isr. I guess they don’t enforce as I’ve not read anything about Spain/belgium/netherlands/ireland Norway having any problems.  But it does highlight the risk of unintended consequences.  Whilst I’m not particularly against the policy (if it could actually be enforced as intended), I do think the timing is crap. The general election is end October and I can’t see how this will do anything other than embolden the incumbent administration.  
 

the justification for the timing recognising Palstne last year (whilst hostages were still held) was to put pressure on isr to protect the two state solution. is there any evidence whatsoever that this has been effective?   None whatsoever and if anything it could be argued that it has caused the govt there to double down on their plans re E1.  If I was a conspiracy theorist I’d say that the actions of this govt seem to be weighted to ensure that BN continues as PM, rather than is replaced via the ballot box. 

Edited 8 September by st albans fox

[leicsmac]

32 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

some of the killing toys aren’t easily sourced elsewhere 

 

as an example, Sanchez has had to buy a system from Germany (which they’re buyingfrom isr and’ relabelling’) to get around his sanctions. so it’s possible but will cost more. (As is the case with all sanctions ).  
 

something which has just popped up re the USA is that there are laws in some states there that prohibit trade with countries that have sanctions on isr. I guess they don’t enforce as I’ve not read anything about Spain/belgium/netherlands/ireland Norway having any problems.  But it does highlight the risk of unintended consequences.  Whilst I’m not particularly against the policy (if it could actually be enforced as intended), I do think the timing is crap. The general election is end October and I can’t see how this will do anything other than embolden the incumbent administration.  
 

the justification for the timing recognising Palstne last year (whilst hostages were still held) was to put pressure on isr to protect the two state solution. is there any evidence whatsoever that this has been effective?   None whatsoever and if anything it could be argued that it has caused the govt there to double down on their plans re E1.  If I was a conspiracy theorist I’d say that the actions of this govt seem to be weighted to ensure that BN continues as PM, rather than is replaced via the ballot box. 

You have a point about the lack of effectiveness of the measures being taken right now. 

 

That, however, suggests a different method to curb the worst excesses of that government need to be considered, rather than treating them with kid gloves.  

[Trav Le Bleu]

1 minute ago, leicsmac said:

You have a point about the lack of effectiveness of the measures being taken right now. 

 

That, however, suggests a different method to curb the worst excesses of that government need to be considered, rather than treating them with kid gloves.  

For a second I thought I was reading something from the football section of the forum.

[st albans fox]

1 hour ago, leicsmac said:

You have a point about the lack of effectiveness of the measures being taken right now. 

 

That, however, suggests a different method to curb the worst excesses of that government need to be considered, rather than treating them with kid gloves.  

the policy announcement (and I wouldn’t be surprised to see Canada and France follow this week) is timed.  I can’t only think that it’s trying to say to the isr electorate that supporting BN and his coalition parties end October is a route to international isolation. I know a lot of people there and there is not a lot of love for the govt. But if they feel vulnerable then they will be more likely to drift towards the men who claim to offer protection rather than those who can be painted as being more lax on security.  Giving the administration the gift of ‘they all hate us, we must stick together’  message is a high risk strategy.  Leaving this policy announcement until early November when the election is finished would make no discernible difference.  if BN now wins from a position where he currently sits just behind then fingers could be pointed at Miliband and burnham. I actually think that trump would privately welcome a change in isr govt. 
 

the more I think about the more I am annoyed that burnham is taking this risk with affecting the upcoming vote there. I wonder if we’ll see the opposition making promises about settler expansion/legality that they weren’t previously doing in order to try and take some wind out of BN’s response. 

 

 

[DennisNedry]

21 hours ago, Finnegan said:

 

Which do you want me to look at, the ultra conservative thugs in full black gear and face coverings that nicely prove my point? (You... you are aware that militant Islamists calling for a caliphate are also far right conservative extremists, yeah? You don't have to be a white person to be a fascist?) 

 

Or did you want me to comment on the people literally doing fascist salutes? Like, literally people deliberately copying the Nazis? 

 

Or was your point "here's some brave people doing a Nazi salute NOT covering their faces, eat your words, Finners, Neo Nazis can be brave too!" 

 

I mean. To be fair in that last case, you know what, you got me man yeah. Well done. 

 

Fair enough. I wouldn't have thought you'd have characterised fascist white supremacist groups (not saying the blokes in Portsmouth are this) and protestors in support of Palestine or a extremist Islamic Caliphate as "the same side". 

Edited 8 September by DennisNedry

[Finnegan]

47 minutes ago, DennisNedry said:

Fair enough. I wouldn't have thought you'd have characterised fascist white supremacist groups (not saying the blokes in Portsmouth are this) and protestors in support of Palestine or a extremist Islamic Caliphate as "the same side". 

 

I'd really strongly recommend "Them!" by Jon Ronson. I mean, in fairness, I'd recommend anything by Jon Ronson he's one of my favourite writers. 

 

If you're not familiar with his work, he's similar to Louis Theroux in that he likes to spend time with all sorts of niche groups and explore what makes them tick. 

 

In Them! he spends time with several extremist groups and finds a very similar running thread of conspiracy theory narrative going through them. 

 

He spends time with Omar Bakri (yes, that Omar Bakri) pre-9/11 before the world was taking islamists as seriously and a KKK leader and concludes that there's a surprising amount of crossover in their beliefs. Not least a deep rooted anti-semetic belief that secret Jewish cabals are running the earth. 

 

But stepping away from that, it doesn't take a genius to look at something like the MAGA cult and then look at an extremist Islamist group and see that ideologically they're essentially the same thing. 

 

They both claim (dubiously) to be extremely conservative followers of their respective Abrahamic religion, they're both highly intolerant of other faiths beside, they both look to severely control and possess women, they both persecute homosexuals, they both use religious dogma to do it, they both advocate for political violence, they both organise in uniformed paramilitary groups, they both advocate for strongly authoritarian leaders that are looking to reduce civil rights, human rights and freedoms. They're both extremely conservative, politically and socially far-right groups. 

 

I have no love for either, I obviously don't love Islamic fundamentalists. They're just a different flavour of fascist. But the difference between myself and Stephen Yaxley-Lennon is that I don't think all Muslims are Islamic fundamentalists, I don't think all critics of Israel are anti-semetic and the difference between myself and Omar Bakri is that I don't think all Jews are oppressive and violent Israeli zionists. 

 

Israel vs Palestine is just yet another issue that has nothing to do with Left vs Right politics that has been tiringly turned in to a culture war and for some stupid reason split down those sides. Yes, I believe in and support the Palestinian people's right to self determination just as I support any people's right to self determination. Yes, I fully acknowledge that the Israeli government has committed war crimes, is illegally occupying and settling Gaza and the West Bank and is undertaking a genocide of the Palestinian people. But I believe and accept these things because I'm a normal, sane human being with eyes and I don't like the mass murder of civilians - especially children. It's got nothing to do with the fact I also happen to be a very left wing economic socialist. 

 

And before you ask, yes, that obviously means I hate Hamas - a far right, religiously conservative, authoritarian organisation - and completely denounce their murder of Israeli civilians. It's not a gotcha to point out there are war crimes being committed by both the IDF and Hamas. 

 

But these things should upset everyone. Anyone pretending there isn't a genocide in Palestine because they're right wing and they want to argue with "the libs" online is deranged. Equally, anyone that argues there are no Islamic terrorists in the Palestine independence movement purely because they identify as left wing and think that's the stance they're meant to take is also an idiot. Though, for what it's worth, I find there's way more of the former than the latter out there. 

 

TLDR: believe it or not, yes, I dislike all pro-authoritarian, ultra-conservative, far-right organisations. And if it's news to you that Reform and it's most ideological followers have a shit load of overlapping beliefs to a lot of Islamic extremists (if you just swap the colour palette of the skin tones involved) then you probably need to give your world view a bit of a think. 

 

Edit: fixed some amusing typos. 

 

Edited 8 September by Finnegan

[SemperEadem]

My Mrs works for the RNLI, they have been told to exercise caution wearing branded uniform in public due to the abuse staff and crew have been receiving. Absolutely sickening really.  

[Finnegan]

1 minute ago, SemperEadem said:

My Mrs works for the RNLI, they have been told to exercise caution wearing branded uniform in public due to the abuse staff and crew have been receiving. Absolutely sickening really.  

 

That is absolutely ****ing insane. 

 

[leicsmac]

8 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

I'd really strongly recommend "Them!" by Jon Ronson. I mean, in fairness, I'd recommend anything by Jon Ronson he's one of my favourite writers. 

 

If you're not familiar with his work, he's similar to Louis Theroux in that he likes to spend time with all sorts of niche groups and explore what makes them tick. 

 

In Them! he spends time with several extremist groups and finds a very similar running thread of conspiracy theory narrative going through them. 

 

He spends time with Omar Bakri (yes, that Omar Bakri) pre-9/11 before the world was taking islamists as seriously and a KKK leader and concludes that there's a surprising amount of crossover in their beliefs. Not least a deep rooted anti-semetic belief that secret Jewish cabals are running the earth. 

 

But stepping away from that, it doesn't take a genius to look at something like the MAGA cult and then look at an extremist Islamist group and see that ideologically they're essentially the same thing. 

 

They both claim (dubiously) to be extremely conservative followers of their respective Abrahamic religion, they're both highly intolerant of other faiths beside, they both look to severely control and possess women, they both persecute homosexuals, they both use religious dogma to do it, they both advocate for political violence, they both organise in uniformed paramilitary groups, they both advocate for strongly authoritarian leaders that are looking to reduce civil rights, human rights and freedoms. They're both extremely conservative, politically and socially far-right groups. 

 

I have no love for either, I obviously don't love Islamic fundamentalists. They're just a different flavour of fascist. But the difference between myself and Stephen Yaxley-Lennon is that I don't think all Muslims are Islamic fundamentalists, I don't think all critics of Israel are anti-semetic and the difference between myself and Omar Bakri is that I don't think all Jews are oppressive and violent Israeli zionists. 

 

Israel vs Palestine is just yet another issue that has nothing to do with Left vs Right politics that has been tiringly turned in to a culture war and for some stupid reason split down those sides. Yes, I believe in and support the Palestinian people's right to self determination just as I support any people's right to self determination. Yes, I fully acknowledge that the Israeli government has committed war crimes, is illegally occupying and settling Gaza and the West Bank and is undertaking a genocide of the Israeli people. But I believe and accept these things because I'm a normal, sane human being with eyes and I don't like the mass murder of civilians - especially children. It's got nothing to do with the fact they also happen to be an economic socialist. 

 

And before you ask, yes, that obviously means I hate Hamas - a far right, religiously conservative, authoritarian organisation - and completely denounce their murder of Israeli civilians. It's not a gotcha to point out there are war crimes being committed by both the IDF and Hamas. 

 

But these things should upset everyone. Anyone pretending there isn't a genocide in Palestine because they're right wing and they want to argue with "the libs" online is deranged. Equally, anyone that argues there are no Islamic terrorists in the Palestine independence movement purely because they identify as left wing and think that's the stance they're meant to take is also an idiot. Though, for what it's worth, I find there's way more of the former than the latter out there. 

 

TLDR: believe it or not, yes, I dislike all pro-authoritarian, ultra-conservative, far-right organisations. And if it's news to you that Reform and it's most ideological followers have a shit load of overlapping beliefs to a lot of Islamic extremists (if you just swap the colour palette of the skin tones involved) then you probably need to give your world view a bit of a think. 

 

Is there a way to pin a post so it appears for everyone to read first up on this matter? A superb primer. 

 

4 minutes ago, SemperEadem said:

My Mrs works for the RNLI, they have been told to exercise caution wearing branded uniform in public due to the abuse staff and crew have been receiving. Absolutely sickening really.  

There should be criminal and civil sanctions for abuse of such staff in the same way there is for abuse of NHS staff. They're equally essential for saving lives. 

 

Someone, at least, needs to give those of a small minded and self interested disposition on this matter a serious lesson in manners, and that's where the state should step in.

Edited 8 September by leicsmac

[leicsmac]

3 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

That is absolutely ****ing insane. 

 

I wish I could say I was surprised, though. 

[kenny]

18 minutes ago, SemperEadem said:

My Mrs works for the RNLI, they have been told to exercise caution wearing branded uniform in public due to the abuse staff and crew have been receiving. Absolutely sickening really.  

The government shouldn't have been allowing the rnli to carry out this work. As the government knows that the boats are coming, border force should take up the brunt of this 'rescue' work.

 

It shouldn't be down to a charitable volunteer organisation designed to protect lives at sea.

[leicsmac]

6 minutes ago, kenny said:

The government shouldn't have been allowing the rnli to carry out this work. As the government knows that the boats are coming, border force should take up the brunt of this 'rescue' work.

 

It shouldn't be down to a charitable volunteer organisation designed to protect lives at sea.

Is there evidence that the RNLI are intervening with these boats in any capacity other than when they're in difficulty and human lives require to be saved?

[SpacedX]

27 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

 

 I mean,  

 

^

28 minutes ago, Finnegan said:

He spends time with Omar Bakri (yes, that Omar Bakri) pre-9/11 before the world was taking islamists as seriously and a KKK leader and concludes that there's a surprising amount of crossover in their beliefs. Not least a deep rooted anti-semetic belief that secret Jewish cabals are running the earth. 

 

Blimey, the guy that kept coins in one of these...

 

 

...a giant Coca Cola bottle to fund Jihad.

 

When I was at uni in the 90s Al Mujahiroun were on campus distributing anti semitic, homophobic and misogynistic literature. I informed the students union and I shit you not, they took my name and course, subsequently reporting me to faculty for racism.  

[Trav Le Bleu]

17 minutes ago, kenny said:

The government shouldn't have been allowing the rnli to carry out this work. As the government knows that the boats are coming, border force should take up the brunt of this 'rescue' work.

 

It shouldn't be down to a charitable volunteer organisation designed to protect lives at sea.

@leicsmac @SemperEadem from the RNLI website.

 

Why does the RNLI launch to small boats in the English Channel?

 

https://share.google/bDwnH7KJP0AmKCJD1

 

Quote,

 

‘One thing I would like people to understand is that these people genuinely need our help,’ says Dan Sinclair, a volunteer helm at Walmer Lifeboat Station. He recalls a rescue in the Channel that will stay with him forever: ‘We launched to an overcrowded, unseaworthy small boat that was taking on water. One particular family was so scared. They were screaming. Their boat was sinking in front of their eyes. It was a horrible, horrible situation.’

 

Border Force intercepts most of the boats though.

Edited 8 September by Trav Le Bleu