Dr The Singh Posted 8 February 2006 Posted 8 February 2006 good points there i think like yourself that this problem may take atleast a few hundred years to go away it may even never go away. it is sad to say but these 'radicals' are part and parcel of life they had them in the time of the crusades etc so it is not a modern disease and until they invent a solution that will make everyone happy then we are forced to take abuse from these people. Your probably right, I suppose there will always be those that have an extreme agenda compared to the norm. At this moment and time, the extremist whether it be bnp, HUT, hamza etc have been allowed with no intervention for many years preach there hatred, the government only now began to think about the issue. It has had a bad effect on race relations and perception, i'm not a muslim and I get brushed with the same stroke as those that are extreme, and that is very sad, especially after all the years of good work done in the 80's and 90's in building good race relations!!! Time is a good healer, something has to be done to stop the spread of this preach of hate!
Head Honcho Posted 8 February 2006 Posted 8 February 2006 I'm not that up on religion, but just to clarify... Cartoon = Bad Crack Dealing = Good I think that just about sums it up
moseeds Posted 8 February 2006 Posted 8 February 2006 http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,20...25511_1,00.html I think this article sums up pretty well why the cartoons were NOT a good idea.
Lemon Harpic Posted 8 February 2006 Posted 8 February 2006 http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,20...25511_1,00.html I think this article sums up pretty well why the cartoons were NOT a good idea. You've got to love The Times. What started off as an article about freedom of speech in society descended by the end into attacking New Labour as 'Stalinists'. I think what the article said was pretty absurd. Perhaps we should also avoid lampooning Hitler for fear of upsetting Nazis? Why is it okay to attack the beliefs of one anti-semitic, homophobic minority of fascists but not okay to attack the beliefs of Muslims? I don't agree that we should avoid causing offence for the sake of a more harmonious environment. The cartoons may be seen as unnecessarily offensive, but they've raised a lot of important issues about how society functions both in the West and in the Islamic world. It may seem unnecessarily offensive to suggest that we abolish religion, but it's critically important that we are allowed to say things that upset people. The reason for that is that throughout history religion has held humanity back, from Muslims destroying the Great Library of Alexandria, to the Vatican condemning Galileo Galilei, to Christian attempts to suppress Charles Darwin's evolutionary theory. It would be very dangerous to avoid debating religion just because some people get offended when you suggest that the Earth isn't flat.
Lemon Harpic Posted 8 February 2006 Posted 8 February 2006 Thinking about it though, Urs Meier had a good game in Portugal 2004, but the English were the only ones to disagree Wait, I get it ... You're testing the limits of free speech, aren't you? I was just a little slow to pick that up!
shen Posted 8 February 2006 Author Posted 8 February 2006 Alle except for dissalowing sol's goal he might have had a good match but he screwed up on a hugely important decision... It was a correct decision!
moseeds Posted 8 February 2006 Posted 8 February 2006 In todays Mercury, the opinion column makes a va;id point - that when the Catholic church peadophile scandal was all the rage, no one depicted the Pope in cartoons or even Jesus as a peadophile (God forbid).
TrickyTrev Posted 8 February 2006 Posted 8 February 2006 In todays Mercury, the opinion column makes a va;id point - that when the Catholic church peadophile scandal was all the rage, no one depicted the Pope in cartoons or even Jesus as a peadophile (God forbid). I bet they did. Even if they haven't he has been labelled a Nazi by just about every media source in Western Europe. One publication decided to show cartoons of Anne Frank and Hitler in bed together in order to show that the European claim that nothing is above sataire is bollocks.
Lemon Harpic Posted 9 February 2006 Posted 9 February 2006 I bet they did. Even if they haven't he has been labelled a Nazi by just about every media source in Western Europe. One publication decided to show cartoons of Anne Frank and Hitler in bed together in order to show that the European claim that nothing is above sataire is bollocks. An Iranian newspaper is offering a prize for the best cartoon about the holocaust "to test the boundaries of free speech". The whole thing is turning into an absurd, petty contest between different groups to produce the most offensive cartoon EVER. And I for one love it. I'm working on a cartoon where a black drug-dealing Jesus with big lips is raping Mohammed (a filipino rent-boy), while a nearby big-nosed covetous Jew fakes the holocaust to make money. I reckon newspaper editors will be falling over each other to publish it!
Dr The Singh Posted 9 February 2006 Posted 9 February 2006 An Iranian newspaper is offering a prize for the best cartoon about the holocaust "to test the boundaries of free speech". The whole thing is turning into an absurd, petty contest between different groups to produce the most offensive cartoon EVER. And I for one love it. I'm working on a cartoon where a black drug-dealing Jesus with big lips is raping Mohammed (a filipino rent-boy), while a nearby big-nosed covetous Jew fakes the holocaust to make money. I reckon newspaper editors will be falling over each other to publish it! I hope your joking!!! I think the whole matter is getting out of hand, unneccesary offence is simply stupid, there's nothing funny in insulting one's feeling!! On the point of religion being a bearer on mankind, i think in modern day society religion only plays a very small part and it is a personal thing rather than a social norm, in the east and other countries religion still plays a major part and is part and parcel of life, so much so that there whole constitution is based around it. For me this reduction in releigious belief is due to the advancement of science and mankind, mankind is no longer reliant on religion for all life's answer, science gives us objective thoughts on many of life's problems!!!
Random Burglar Posted 9 February 2006 Posted 9 February 2006 I hope your joking!!! I think the whole matter is getting out of hand, unneccesary offence is simply stupid, there's nothing funny in insulting one's feeling!! On the point of religion being a bearer on mankind, i think in modern day society religion only plays a very small part and it is a personal thing rather than a social norm, in the east and other countries religion still plays a major part and is part and parcel of life, so much so that there whole constitution is based around it. For me this reduction in releigious belief is due to the advancement of science and mankind, mankind is no longer reliant on religion for all life's answer, science gives us objective thoughts on many of life's problems!!! I am an athiest through and through...the point you make about science is an extremely valid one. I have not for one moment believed there could be a being totally seperate to this world that could create the world we live in. (Christian View) Science has too many answers that backs up its claims of the 'big bang theory'
Chimp Posted 9 February 2006 Posted 9 February 2006 In todays Mercury, the opinion column makes a va;id point - that when the Catholic church peadophile scandal was all the rage, no one depicted the Pope in cartoons or even Jesus as a peadophile (God forbid). And in a news story I saw the other day an analyst (who was Muslim btw) also made a valid point - that when the Christian faith(s) have been lampooned via the likes of films such as Monty Python's Holy Grail, The Passion of Christ and the recent 'Jerry Springer' stage show none of the offended organised religious bodies have responded by calling for violence. The issue is not that Muslims are offended by the cartoon but that certain sections of the Muslim community seem to think that violence is a valid response. It seems to me that when an organised religion cannot withstand questioning of it's faith then that organisation is more concerned with power and control than with offering spiritual guidance to it's followers.
Dr The Singh Posted 9 February 2006 Posted 9 February 2006 And in a news story I saw the other day an analyst (who was Muslim btw) also made a valid point - that when the Christian faith(s) have been lampooned via the likes of films such as Monty Python's Holy Grail, The Passion of Christ and the recent 'Jerry Springer' stage show none of the offended organised religious bodies have responded by calling for violence. The issue is not that Muslims are offended by the cartoon but that certain sections of the Muslim community seem to think that violence is a valid response. It seems to me that when an organised religion cannot withstand questioning of it's faith then that organisation is more concerned with power and control than with offering spiritual guidance to it's followers. Agreed!! There is a right way of protesting, violence shouldn't be a means of protesting!! I think religious leaders in the muslim world could do a lot in guiding there people, rather than provoking them to violence!! Power and control are the basis of most faiths, otherwise the flock would stray, people forget that all religions infact are business and without the customers they will seize to exist. People like dramtics and drama and it's a crisis that brings the people together, religions play on that and use it as a tool. Mere spiritual guidance will not bring the flock together!!!
Random Burglar Posted 9 February 2006 Posted 9 February 2006 Agreed!! There is a right way of protesting, violence shouldn't be a means of protesting!! I think religious leaders in the muslim world could do a lot in guiding there people, rather than provoking them to violence!! Power and control are the basis of most faiths, otherwise the flock would stray, people forget that all religions infact are business and without the customers they will seize to exist. People like dramtics and drama and it's a crisis that brings the people together, religions play on that and use it as a tool. Mere spiritual guidance will not bring the flock together!!! People are going to do whatever their leaders tell them the right thing to do is...like sheep if you want to put it that way...its the attitudes and reactions that need to be changed
moseeds Posted 10 February 2006 Posted 10 February 2006 And in a news story I saw the other day an analyst (who was Muslim btw) also made a valid point - that when the Christian faith(s) have been lampooned via the likes of films such as Monty Python's Holy Grail, The Passion of Christ and the recent 'Jerry Springer' stage show none of the offended organised religious bodies have responded by calling for violence. The issue is not that Muslims are offended by the cartoon but that certain sections of the Muslim community seem to think that violence is a valid response. It seems to me that when an organised religion cannot withstand questioning of it's faith then that organisation is more concerned with power and control than with offering spiritual guidance to it's followers. Hi, I agree with you regarding the violence. That is something I don't agree with, because it's misdirected and pointless. I think the demonstrations seen in many other countries was quite obviously motivated by political gains. For example, I heard on Newsnight last night that the cartoons were published in an Egyptian newspaper many months ago and there was a reaction but not violent. It was only when Danish flags were imported and someone decided to make a loud noise about it the situation blew up.
Chairman of the Bored Posted 12 February 2006 Posted 12 February 2006 Religion is the root of all evils. There is no God or Gods. Go figure. The sooner the world wakes up to this fact the better. In the meantime, there are those from all religions who seek to use their 'faith' to manipulate and control. Those who follow religion are just blind fools who refuse to accept we are here by chance and when we're gone, we're gone.
Milky Posted 12 February 2006 Posted 12 February 2006 Religion is the root of all evils. There is no God or Gods. Go figure. The sooner the world wakes up to this fact the better. In the meantime, there are those from all religions who seek to use their 'faith' to manipulate and control. Those who follow religion are just blind fools who refuse to accept we are here by chance and when we're gone, we're gone. Religion does cause alot of trouble for sure. i agree with what you are saying.
The People's Hero Posted 12 February 2006 Posted 12 February 2006 Bluearmy5 - never has your signature had more resonance.
Milky Posted 12 February 2006 Posted 12 February 2006 Bluearmy5 - never has your signature had more resonance. makes you think doesn't it
The People's Hero Posted 12 February 2006 Posted 12 February 2006 Very little makes me think. Thinking is painful and rarely yields anything very productive.
Chairman of the Bored Posted 12 February 2006 Posted 12 February 2006 Interesting. Like the idea. So we have a village of 100 people. How many could play football? Lets say 33 for argument's sake. Which team would the remaining 67 support? Who would administer the league? How many referees would there be? Who would seek to control the misdeameours of the recreants? How many would set themselves up as having an expert opinion and foist that upon the onlookers from cosy TV studios? And on a more serious note...how long would it take for all the wrongs of mankind to be replicated once again....for example, how soon would it be before some in the village wanted to set up their own community becauase the views / believes / cooking methods of the majority were not to their liking? Which minority would seek to control the way the majority behaves? And what would be the name given to that system of control? Religion, politics? And most important of all...what time would the pubs open / close?
Babylon Posted 19 February 2006 Posted 19 February 2006 Nigeria Cartoon Riots Updated: 07:33, Sunday February 19, 2006 Rioters have killed at least 16 people in Nigeria during a demonstration against cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed. Thousands of Muslims attacked Christians and burned at least 15 churches in Maiduguri in the north east of the country. Witnesses said three children and a Catholic priest were among those killed. An Associated Press reporter told how mobs of Muslim protesters swarmed the city centre with machetes, sticks and iron rods. One group threw a tyre around a man, poured petrol on him and set him ablaze. The three-hour rampage was the first major protest to erupt over the issue in Africa's most populous nation. Advertisement Police reinforcements and troops were brought in to restore order. Christians and Muslims are roughly equal in number in Nigeria, but Christians are a minority in Maiduguri. Sectarian violence is not uncommon in the country and thousands of people have died there since 2000 in violence fuelled by the adoption of the strict Islamic Sharia law. The riots follow similar clashes over the caricatures in Libya, where demonstrators protested against the Italian Cabinet minister who wore a t-shirt depicting the cartoons. Roberto Calderoli, of the anti-immigrant Northern League party, has resigned after the Libyan clashes claimed 10 lives.
Knighton Matt Posted 19 February 2006 Posted 19 February 2006 Nigeria Cartoon Riots Updated: 07:33, Sunday February 19, 2006 Rioters have killed at least 16 people in Nigeria during a demonstration against cartoons of the Prophet Mohammed. Thousands of Muslims attacked Christians and burned at least 15 churches in Maiduguri in the north east of the country. Witnesses said three children and a Catholic priest were among those killed. An Associated Press reporter told how mobs of Muslim protesters swarmed the city centre with machetes, sticks and iron rods. One group threw a tyre around a man, poured petrol on him and set him ablaze. The three-hour rampage was the first major protest to erupt over the issue in Africa's most populous nation. Advertisement Police reinforcements and troops were brought in to restore order. Christians and Muslims are roughly equal in number in Nigeria, but Christians are a minority in Maiduguri. Sectarian violence is not uncommon in the country and thousands of people have died there since 2000 in violence fuelled by the adoption of the strict Islamic Sharia law. The riots follow similar clashes over the caricatures in Libya, where demonstrators protested against the Italian Cabinet minister who wore a t-shirt depicting the cartoons. Roberto Calderoli, of the anti-immigrant Northern League party, has resigned after the Libyan clashes claimed 10 lives. Shocking! They're absolutely wild... And if you see the in the BBC drama canned thread below 40% of UK muslims want Sharia Law adopted here!
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