Joey wants to leave AZ

[securedfox]

It's inexplicable that we've never bothered to find out.

All season I've never seen why Dodds has not been on the bench at the very least. We've scored 26 goals in 27 matches for Heaven's sake and the only striker who's found the net consistently, at least until recently is Hume.

Neither Fryatt - because he's rarely been/looked fit either through injury or whatever - nor Hammond because his returns have been no more than ordinary - have justified keeping Dodds out permanently.

So finding space on the bench and giving the lad some time should never have been a problem - IF the club had kept him fit which didn't lookm the case to me.

Sending Dodds to Northwich was a waste of time as it turned out.

Even against Fulham, Dodds could have had some time. Fryatt might have done a bit better in some ways but he never looked like scoring and I still cannot see why people rate him so highly.

To me he's not big enough to be a traditional striker, not fast enough to be an impish striker and neither strong enough nor fast enough to be a dribbler. He doesn't score from outside the box anyway so altogether he has important limitations.

Yes he's got ability but for me he looks too easily marked, he's never looked especially fit this season until the last match and he doesn't bring others into play as well as I'd like.

Fryatt to me stands or falls is an out and out striker. And if he's not scoring I can't see why you wouldn't try someone else.

I know there is a lot of talk about Fryatt as to whether he deserves a place in the team and if not who should play instead, but it seems to me that if Dodds is as good as you say he is, i can't imagine why he has'nt been given a chance by RK.

I don't get to see the lads play first hand and i have never seen anything of dodds at all, so i will bow to your knowledge of him.

My guess is though it may be some time before we get the chance to see what he can do.

[Flynny]

Fryatt didn't look far off form to me against Fulham, personally. But still, don't see why a prospect can't have 30 minutes with the dross we have up front at the moment.

[Thracian]

I know there is a lot of talk about Fryatt as to whether he deserves a place in the team and if not who should play instead, but it seems to me that if Dodds is as good as you say he is, i can't imagine why he has'nt been given a chance by RK.

I don't get to see the lads play first hand and i have never seen anything of dodds at all, so i will bow to your knowledge of him.

My guess is though it may be some time before we get the chance to see what he can do.

Why would any striker described as the club's best natural finisher not get a chance when alternative striker's are scoring at the rate of two goals in 15 games?

I wonder how Kelly would feel as an ex-player - to be treated like that.

Especially considering what Dodds has already done during his time at the club.

I wondered if it was not his striking ability but his general support play that was the problem - after all Kelly does seem to like jack-of-all-trade types to bolster his defensive capabilities.

But although he doesn't catch the eye, I think Dodds links in quite well with his team-mates, and certainly as well as Fryatt who seems to do his own thing.

Hammond works hard whether he's scoring or not and Hume is the same but to me the first priority from striker's is goals and for a month or so now, even Hume's not been scoring and we've had four misfiring strikers if you count the presently unfit O'Grady.

[securedfox]

Why would any striker described as the club's best natural finisher not get a chance when alternative striker's are scoring at the rate of two goals in 15 games?

I wonder how Kelly would feel as an ex-player - to be treated like that.

Especially considering what Dodds has already done during his time at the club.

I wondered if it was not his striking ability but his general support play that was the problem - after all Kelly does seem to like jack-of-all-trade types to bolster his defensive capabilities.

But although he doesn't catch the eye, I think Dodds links in quite well with his team-mates, and certainly as well as Fryatt who seems to do his own thing.

Hammond works hard whether he's scoring or not and Hume is the same but to me the first priority from striker's is goals and for a month or so now, even Hume's not been scoring and we've had four misfiring strikers if you count the presently unfit O'Grady.

I'm with you in wanting to give the lad a try.

But it's one thing to score at lesser levels of football and then to expect Dodds to do it in the championsip.

When the team are misfiring then you have to look at all your options of course, and Dodds sounds like he's the obvious one.

But after saying that, i still don't understand why RK does'nt go for it.

[Anish]

Is it just me or is anyone else not bothering to read every other post.

Spot on.

[DanTheFoxBhoy]

Especially considering what Dodds has already done during his time at the club.

If Dodds is as well 'ard as you think then surely he would have been given a run, much like Odhiambo did.

Haven't we learned from Josh Low that players that seem to perform well at their levels fall apart when up against Championship defence?

[Geo V]

I wouldnt beat up on the likes of Fryatt just yet, especially as we have to look atthe facts that he has stepped up a division, he is young, is at a new side and has suffered from injury too. Im not making excuses for him but I reckon we wont see the best of him until next season.

I agree that we should try he youngsters but the timing must be right. Maybe if we are guaranteed Championship status with 4 or 5 games left, we could try a youngster or 3???

[lookwhaticando]

I wouldnt beat up on the likes of Fryatt just yet, especially as we have to look atthe facts that he has stepped up a division, he is young, is at a new side and has suffered from injury too. Im not making excuses for him but I reckon we wont see the best of him until next season.

I agree that we should try he youngsters but the timing must be right. Maybe if we are guaranteed Championship status with 4 or 5 games left, we could try a youngster or 3???

We may not see the best of him til next season.... but recently he hasn't even looked half as good as he did last season.

Supposedly.

[Manwell Pablo]

We may not see the best of him til next season.... but recently he hasn't even looked half as good as he did last season.

Supposedly.

He looked good on Saturday, very busy good passing and took up good positions.

He just doesn't look like scoring.

[Thracian]

I wouldnt beat up on the likes of Fryatt just yet, especially as we have to look atthe facts that he has stepped up a division, he is young, is at a new side and has suffered from injury too. Im not making excuses for him but I reckon we wont see the best of him until next season.

I agree that we should try he youngsters but the timing must be right. Maybe if we are guaranteed Championship status with 4 or 5 games left, we could try a youngster or 3???

The idea of using someone different is not to wait until it's too late or to make things worse it is to try to make things better. It is now that we're not scoring any goals via our strikers - and via Fryatt in particular.

No-one's even saying don't use Fryatt. That would be senseless now he's apparently close to fitness again. I am saying its ridiculous not to involve a natural scorer, Dodds, during a scoring crisis and can only imagine it's because he too, like O'Grady the other week, is not match fit.

[Ric Flair]

I disagree that he was superb last season. Superb in patches. Awful in others.

Name a player at LCFC in the past 4 or 5 years that has been Superb all the time. He's better than any midfielder we've currently got. Wesolowski is still quite some way from being relied upon. Hopefully the MM deal will enable us to get some decent players in and Joey might not be an option but we could do worse than to bring him back.

[The People's Hero]

Name a player at LCFC in the past 4 or 5 years that has been Superb all the time. He's better than any midfielder we've currently got. Wesolowski is still quite some way from being relied upon. Hopefully the MM deal will enable us to get some decent players in and Joey might not be an option but we could do worse than to bring him back.

I agree with that part in the bold.

The way some people are going on though, you'd think he was the saviour of this club.

I just want a bit of perspective here, that's all, because people seem to forget he played a lot of games and was a large part of a side which flirted with relegation.

He scored some great goals, yes. He made some goals, yes.... but the amount of times he should have played it simple and didn't, turning over possession, or got robbed in his own half trying to be too clever... well, he's a talented player but a very frustrating one.

If it was up to me, I wouldn't pursue the option of getting him in. We want to build something here and at the end of the day, he'd only be back in until his agent smelt some cash elsewhere.

[Ric Flair]

I agree with that part in the bold.

The way some people are going on though, you'd think he was the saviour of this club.

I just want a bit of perspective here, that's all, because people seem to forget he played a lot of games and was a large part of a side which flirted with relegation.

He scored some great goals, yes. He made some goals, yes.... but the amount of times he should have played it simple and didn't, turning over possession, or got robbed in his own half trying to be too clever... well, he's a talented player but a very frustrating one.

If it was up to me, I wouldn't pursue the option of getting him in. We want to build something here and at the end of the day, he'd only be back in until his agent smelt some cash elsewhere.

Your absolutely right in what your saying, last season we nearly got relegated with Joey in our team and our teams hasn't changed much since he left. So even if he came in, we'd still probably only be in and around mid table like we have been. One player won't change this team that much how ever good that player is. I would like to think the future under MM will be a lot brighter and we'll get a manager and players to give us the opportunity of becoming a force in this league. I rated Joey last season, the season before that I thought he was utter garbage. Therefore, if there are better options out there than him, then get them in. If he's the best we could get, then i'd snap him up as he is a box to box midfielder.

[Sooper Steve's shin]

I think Gudjonsson's ability is overrated thanks to the number and quality of goals he scored last season. I don't recall him being particularly good the year before.

As for blooding youngsters like Dodds, any time you do that it comes at the expense of giving a more senior player (e.g. Fryatt) valuable game time. If Fryatt gets hauled off after 60-70 mins every game to give a youth team prospect a run-out, he has far less chance of recapturing his form of the end of last year. Otherwise, you are expecting him to do the business with two-thirds of the playing time.

[Thracian]

I think Gudjonsson's ability is overrated thanks to the number and quality of goals he scored last season. I don't recall him being particularly good the year before.

As for blooding youngsters like Dodds, any time you do that it comes at the expense of giving a more senior player (e.g. Fryatt) valuable game time. If Fryatt gets hauled off after 60-70 mins every game to give a youth team prospect a run-out, he has far less chance of recapturing his form of the end of last year. Otherwise, you are expecting him to do the business with two-thirds of the playing time.

So just out of curiosity what's your argument for Fryatt getting all these chances to get himself right while Dodds gets none?

Fryatt only scored six goals in his purple patch last season. Pleasing but it was no big deal for a striker. Kisnorbo's matched that!

Take your time. I understand you'll probably be speaking for the vast majority of City fans.

[Sooper Steve's shin]

So just out of curiosity what's your argument for Fryatt getting all these chances to get himself right while Dodds gets none?

Fryatt only scored six goals in his purple patch last season. Pleasing but it was no big deal for a striker. Kisnorbo's matched that!

Take your time. I understand you'll probably be speaking for the vast majority of City fans.

Fryatt is the more senior player - signed to play as our main striker, experienced at the professional level, reasonably credible record in the Championship (last season) - so I think that justifies him getting the opportunities over an untested youth player. I will hold my hands up and say I have never seen Dodds play, but even you must accept that to give him games in the Championship would be a gamble. I would love to see him come off the bench, score, stay in the team and keep scoring - it's just a question of him taking the chance when it happens to come along.

I have no problem with Dodds being on the bench ready to step in if injuries or the flow of the game dictates. I think that chance will come. But, if you were Rob Kelly (or any manager) with a club's future and thousands or even millions at stake on every major decision you make, would you really take the gamble on starting him on the basis that he just might be better than what we have? Let's say he brings Louis in and he fails to score in three, four or five games - what then? We have one less option and are no better off. Yes, he might be the next Rooney or Owen, but unfortunately we don't have the chance to test him in a reserve league this season and see what he's made of.

I know there comes a point when sometimes you have to take the plunge, but at the moment I think we'd be better off trying to get a (reasonably) tried and tested striker back to scoring goals rather than chopping and changing between two of them. It's about what is best from the team - at the Fulham game, you could see the odd interchange between Fryatt and Hume that showed they are getting things back together. A loan spell at a League 1 or 2 club would be the best bet for both Dodds and LCFC in my opinion.

[Ric Flair]

Fryatt is the more senior player - signed to play as our main striker, experienced at the professional level, reasonably credible record in the Championship (last season) - so I think that justifies him getting the opportunities over an untested youth player. I will hold my hands up and say I have never seen Dodds play, but even you must accept that to give him games in the Championship would be a gamble. I would love to see him come off the bench, score, stay in the team and keep scoring - it's just a question of him taking the chance when it happens to come along.

I have no problem with Dodds being on the bench ready to step in if injuries or the flow of the game dictates. I think that chance will come. But, if you were Rob Kelly (or any manager) with a club's future and thousands or even millions at stake on every major decision you make, would you really take the gamble on starting him on the basis that he just might be better than what we have? Let's say he brings Louis in and he fails to score in three, four or five games - what then? We have one less option and are no better off. Yes, he might be the next Rooney or Owen, but unfortunately we don't have the chance to test him in a reserve league this season and see what he's made of.

I know there comes a point when sometimes you have to take the plunge, but at the moment I think we'd be better off trying to get a (reasonably) tried and tested striker back to scoring goals rather than chopping and changing between two of them. It's about what is best from the team - at the Fulham game, you could see the odd interchange between Fryatt and Hume that showed they are getting things back together. A loan spell at a League 1 or 2 club would be the best bet for both Dodds and LCFC in my opinion.

I kind of know what your getting at, but I don't agree with some parts of your argument. Especially the part i've highlighted in bold. None of our strikers are scoring at present, so giving Dodds a chance with the chance of him not scoring, shouldn't be a reason for the manager no to try him. If our strikers were doing well and the manager was inclined to give Dodds a go, then the possibility of Dodds playing and not scoring would be more important as he'd be keeping out a striker who had previously been scoring. But that's not the case is it?

Also, you talk about the reserve team issue. In the past 3 seasons, Dodds has scored 65-70 goals at youth and reserve level. What more can the lad do, for him to get a chance?

I do however agree, that it's essential that Hume and Fryatt regain their partenership form from last season. I want to see both of them being given another good run of games together. Dodds would be my choice on the bench to come on and make an impact. If he then shows he's better than either or both, then i'd have no qualms about him being first choice. I also, wouldn't be disappointed if Dodds was to be given a starting place right now, as none of our strikers have been scoring regularly for quite some time bar Hume. But he hasn't scored since about the start of November.

[Sooper Steve's shin]

Mine were reasons why Dodds has not started so far, but if Kelly had the balls to throw him in then I would support him and would love to see the lad to do well.

[Ric Flair]

Mine were reasons why Dodds has not started so far, but if Kelly had the balls to throw him in then I would support him and would love to see the lad to do well.

It does seem strange why he's not been given a go. Kelly hasn't been afraid to play the youngsters. I'd say, it's because he doesn't think he's good enough. But why then come out and say he's the best finisher at the club and why re-call him from his loan spell early? I hope it's only a matter of time before he's given a chance.

[Thracian]

You can theorise all day about why Kelly doesn't play Dodds.

a) He doesn't come across as a supplementary midfielder like Hume or Hammond and Kelly does like his defensive insurance in every department.

b) Fryatt is, as has been mentioned, our "senior" striker, the guy signed for a fair chunk of money and who no-one wants to see failing.

c) Perhaps the manager has concerns about Dodds match fitness, because he, the manager, has seemingly not ensured he's had enough of the right sort of action this season.

Apart from those three basically piss-poor excuses (because they soon got over Fryatt's apparent fitness problem readily enough) I've still heard no case for Dodds not getting his chance.

People talk about Fryatt's goalscoring last season...brilliant. Six goals for the best part of half a season!.

I cannot imagine Louis Dodds playing at any level for anyone and scoring at a slower rate than that.

People talk about the risk of Dodds not coming off.

Well what about the risk of a striker continuing to score at the rate of two goals in 15 outings?

This is not a get at Fryatt. I stiill think he's got something when he applies himself properly.

But I also think he's let himself down by seemingly not being fit at the start of the season, his injury didn't help and he was clearly returned to the fray before he was fit - and that with Dodds back from Northwich, and as fit as he's been this season!.

The truth is, so far, that all the vidence suggests it is Fryatt not Dodds, who should be on the bench. Why that doesn't happen I fail to understand, though I have my thoughts and nothing would surprise me.

And when/if that happens. Dodds' biggest problem then will be getting a fair shout at the job with Kelly, the club and the fans mostly demonstrating, so far at least, that they'd probably rather have Fryatt whatever.

Why? No logical reason that I can see except that Fryatt's our "big signing" and Dodds came in as a kid from down the road.

One is glamourous, the other isn't. One cost a chunk. The other didn't.

Look at all the chances Akinbiyi got cos he cost so much. It didn't make any differnce though. He still didn't hack it as a striker at Leicester.

[Geo V]

The idea of using someone different is not to wait until it's too late or to make things worse it is to try to make things better. It is now that we're not scoring any goals via our strikers - and via Fryatt in particular.

No-one's even saying don't use Fryatt. That would be senseless now he's apparently close to fitness again. I am saying its ridiculous not to involve a natural scorer, Dodds, during a scoring crisis and can only imagine it's because he too, like O'Grady the other week, is not match fit.

Saying that Dodds is a natural goalscorer isnt that acurate, well not until he has done it at a good level. Yeah he has potential and I hope that he becomes to be the next Wayne Rooney but for now, lets hope that Fryatt clicks back into the form of last season and way beyond! I know he wont do that from the subs bench though....

[Manwell Pablo]

Saying that Dodds is a natural goalscorer isnt that acurate, well not until he has done it at a good level. Yeah he has potential and I hope that he becomes to be the next Wayne Rooney but for now, lets hope that Fryatt clicks back into the form of last season and way beyond! I know he wont do that from the subs bench though....

Your wasting your time arguing with him.

[Thracian]

Saying that Dodds is a natural goalscorer isnt that acurate, well not until he has done it at a good level. Yeah he has potential and I hope that he becomes to be the next Wayne Rooney but for now, lets hope that Fryatt clicks back into the form of last season and way beyond! I know he wont do that from the subs bench though....

I thought it was Kelly said he was the "most natural goalscorer" at the club.

And, like Porter, Logan or anyone else, he'll never demonstrate his ability at a higher level until someone has the confidence to give him the chance.

Fryatt, right now, isn't demonstrating much goalscoring ability at Championship level - and that's beyond question.

[Geo V]

I thought it was Kelly said he was the "most natural goalscorer" at the club.

And, like Porter, Logan or anyone else, he'll never demonstrate his ability at a higher level until someone has the confidence to give him the chance.

Fryatt, right now, isn't demonstrating much goalscoring ability at Championship level - and that's beyond question.

Pablo

The difference is Fryatt cost us money.

We have to see the real Fryatt before making hasty decisions or dropping him for one of the kids. Fryatt is young enough himself but at least the bloke has played in front of half decent crowds in the lower leagues and has gained experience.

I am also weary of throwing too many youngsters in as a panic measure. Lets nuture Dodds and get the best out of him instead of a knee-jerk reaction of slinging him in when our strikers fail to score in a few games. Finally on this one, is he getting the quality service (Fryatt) in the first place???

[Manwell Pablo]

Pablo

The difference is Fryatt cost us money.

We have to see the real Fryatt before making hasty decisions or dropping him for one of the kids. Fryatt is young enough himself but at least the bloke has played in front of half decent crowds in the lower leagues and has gained experience.

I am also weary of throwing too many youngsters in as a panic measure. Lets nuture Dodds and get the best out of him instead of a knee-jerk reaction of slinging him in when our strikers fail to score in a few games. Finally on this one, is he getting the quality service (Fryatt) in the first place???

Recently he should of scored a couple, he's overall game is getting much better it's just his sharpness in front of goal.