ta-fc Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Lets examine the evidence.... England 1) gifted with a crop of exceptional talent. 2) massive expectation 3) has too many similar midfielders in Gerrard, Scholes and Lampard 4) tactically inept trying to fit in his superstars when we know he should be playing a defensive midfielder Leicester 1) Buys himself a crop of the divisions stand out performers 2) massive expectation due to money spent 3) has too many midfielders who performed last year or who he's brought in to compete for places. 4) adjusts formation to accommodate the above and looks tactically inept. I like Sven and was hugely surprised by his signings but rather than reshape a side completely he should be looking to build on last season, serious bids for the Yak, Mee, Vitor and one or two others would have enabled continuity then look to supplement with a couple of signings like Kasper, Peltier, Mills, Danns and Nugent. The aboves all hypothetical now as were beginning again from square one, listening to Svens comments on the radio he seems to think we played well... From my recollection we had three chances to there eight, were too easy to break down and don't have enough going forward... Last season his tinkering with the defence cost us a place in the Play offs and again he doesn't seem to have learned his lesson... Mills (to date) doesn't seem captain material as the Reading fans got under his skin too easily. So what's the solution... Sven has to bite the bullet and play 4.4.2 @ home and 4.5.1 away, this will mean dropping some of his superstars and going against his natural reaction to try and keep everyone happy but whoever said football management was easy!
tomtom Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Is that the Sven who is Englands 2nd most successful manager of all time? (On win ratio-fact) Some fair points about his time here but leave England out of it
Guest Bilo Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Sven's time with England: P67 W40 D17 L10 Win percentage 59.7% I bloody wish it felt like that.
ta-fc Posted 18 August 2011 Author Posted 18 August 2011 Both totally valid points... I think the Mclaren debacle when Sven left highlighted the job he did I'm referring more to the big matches when tactics play a key role in winning... Sorry should have pointed that out...
tomtom Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 We're all a bit miserable this morning so no worries mate,...it was the title of the thread I was aiming at really!
Babylon Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 It's stinks of a team who for the last two seasons has had major surgery on it.
Tielemans63 Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 When all's said and done, Sven won bugger all with that England team. I know it'll take time for the new players to bed in but I have been shocked at just how poor we've been in the two home games. I don't think people would be as livid if the team were really trying to play football and build something. My concern is that for all Sven's qualities (and he is a good manager) the team has that disinterested / disorganised malaise that Sousa's team had this time last season - that's what scares me.
somebum Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Lets get Sven's time with England into perspective. His win-ratio is inflated due to qualification group seedings where England only had to play one decent side in the group and the rest were made up with number makers like Faroe Islands and Northern Ireland. When England did play a decent side - in the major tournaments - they failed. Sure he had one lucky Gerrard/Owen run night in Germany and he lived off that for years. But let us not forget that time after time his tactics were called into question as were his motivational skills; who could forget Gareth's Southgate's expose' of Sven when he said that during half time of the England/Brazil game 'we needed Winston Churchill but we got Ian Duncan Smith'. So putting this into perspective, whenever England met above decent opposition, they lost every time. The bum teams were easy to roll over.
eye666 Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Lets get Sven's time with England into perspective. His win-ratio is inflated due to qualification group seedings where England only had to play one decent side in the group and the rest were made up with number makers like Faroe Islands and Northern Ireland. When England did play a decent side - in the major tournaments - they failed. Sure he had one lucky Gerrard/Owen run night in Germany and he lived off that for years. But let us not forget that time after time his tactics were called into question as were his motivational skills; who could forget Gareth's Southgate's expose' of Sven when he said that during half time of the England/Brazil game 'we needed Winston Churchill but we got Ian Duncan Smith'. So putting this into perspective, whenever England met above decent opposition, they lost every time. The bum teams were easy to roll over. We were done when another England keeper had a howler. We were on top in that match till then. Individual mistakes cannot be attributed to the manager, especially goalie clangers. In hindsight, Sven has been the best England manager since I've been following footy. Cut the guy some slack and let him do his thing. It's glaringly obvious we need at least one striker and a winger. I'm confident he'll bring some quality in before the window shuts and then use the loan market to top it off. Patience - the season is a marathon, not a sprint and we have a large squad to choose from in those winter months when injuries hit every club. Stop with the knee-jerk reactions and get behind the team FFS. :sge:
Jace Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Lets get Sven's time with England into perspective. His win-ratio is inflated due to qualification group seedings where England only had to play one decent side in the group and the rest were made up with number makers like Faroe Islands and Northern Ireland. When England did play a decent side - in the major tournaments - they failed. Sure he had one lucky Gerrard/Owen run night in Germany and he lived off that for years. But let us not forget that time after time his tactics were called into question as were his motivational skills; who could forget Gareth's Southgate's expose' of Sven when he said that during half time of the England/Brazil game 'we needed Winston Churchill but we got Ian Duncan Smith'. So putting this into perspective, whenever England met above decent opposition, they lost every time. The bum teams were easy to roll over. but he still had the 2nd best win ratio in comparison to other england managers, other england managers had qualifying games against smaller countries too
leicesterseddon Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Last two home games the tactics have been all over the place. Both Reading and Bristol (and, let's face it, most teams in the second half of last season) have set up in exactly the same way: putting men behind the ball and nipping it on the counter-attack. Last season we managed to score plenty at home, but in the two home games so far we haven't looked close to breaking the oppp down. We need much more movement, we need people to run at players to break up the formation. And, I have to say, I think we need to start playing 4-4-2...
Heart-Shaped Fox Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 When all's said and done, Sven won bugger all with that England team. I know it'll take time for the new players to bed in but I have been shocked at just how poor we've been in the two home games. I don't think people would be as livid if the team were really trying to play football and build something. My concern is that for all Sven's qualities (and he is a good manager) the team has that disinterested / disorganised malaise that Sousa's team had this time last season - that's what scares me. Lets get Sven's time with England into perspective. His win-ratio is inflated due to qualification group seedings where England only had to play one decent side in the group and the rest were made up with number makers like Faroe Islands and Northern Ireland. When England did play a decent side - in the major tournaments - they failed. Sure he had one lucky Gerrard/Owen run night in Germany and he lived off that for years. But let us not forget that time after time his tactics were called into question as were his motivational skills; who could forget Gareth's Southgate's expose' of Sven when he said that during half time of the England/Brazil game 'we needed Winston Churchill but we got Ian Duncan Smith'. So putting this into perspective, whenever England met above decent opposition, they lost every time. The bum teams were easy to roll over. These are spot on. Sven neever won, and never came near to winning anything with England. People seem to be happy with the fct we got to just a quarter final at best despite having the best squad of players for years under him. He is tactially inpet, tries to accomodate his favourites or players who cant all be on the pitch at the same time. As mentioned that was the case with Gerrard and Lampard and is happening right now but with even more midfielders. We lost against the better opposition everytime because when it really matters Sven doesnt deliver. The same happened last season. Everytime we played a better team away from home last season when we had a chance to prove ourselve we lost. This was shown at Cardiff, Forest, QPR, Reading and Swansea. And Norwich at home as well.
somebum Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 We were done when another England keeper had a howler. We were on top in that match till then. Individual mistakes cannot be attributed to the manager, especially goalie clangers. In hindsight, Sven has been the best England manager since I've been following footy. Cut the guy some slack and let him do his thing. It's glaringly obvious we need at least one striker and a winger. I'm confident he'll bring some quality in before the window shuts and then use the loan market to top it off. Patience - the season is a marathon, not a sprint and we have a large squad to choose from in those winter months when injuries hit every club. Stop with the knee-jerk reactions and get behind the team FFS. :sge: I disagree. Brazil were down to 10 men for the last 30 minutes and Sven failed to exploit a naturally poor defensive side's weaknesses by making any credible changes to the system. Ronaldinho scored in the 50th minute leaving us 40 minutes to get back into it. Either you were born in 2000AD or just just dont remember Bobby Robson. Please get this knee jerk reaction thing out of your head. Sven had most of last season as well; this is just a continuation of his ineptitude from last season. I am behind the team but lack confidence in this clown of a manager.
Bugg Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 I read the Sun once and it said Sven was crap, that must be true.
Heart-Shaped Fox Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 I disagree. Brazil were down to 10 men for the last 30 minutes and Sven failed to exploit a naturally poor defensive side's weaknesses by making any credible changes to the system. Ronaldinho scored in the 50th minute leaving us 40 minutes to get back into it. Either you were born in 2000AD or just just dont remember Bobby Robson. Please get this knee jerk reaction thing out of your head. Sven had most of last season as well; this is just a continuation of his ineptitude from last season. I am behind the team but lack confidence in this clown of a manager. Another good point, showing how poor Sven is tactically. He never ever seems to have a plan B hasnt had one with us, I read on a Man City forum the same and it was similar with England. Thats why last season teams began to know how to play against us and Sven did nothing to change this. The same happened under NP but he changed the tactics and it worked. More and more it becomes harder to defend Sven, and his lack of tactical knowledge begins to shine through.
Guest MattP Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Lets get Sven's time with England into perspective. His win-ratio is inflated due to qualification group seedings where England only had to play one decent side in the group and the rest were made up with number makers like Faroe Islands and Northern Ireland. When England did play a decent side - in the major tournaments - they failed. Sure he had one lucky Gerrard/Owen run night in Germany and he lived off that for years. But let us not forget that time after time his tactics were called into question as were his motivational skills; who could forget Gareth's Southgate's expose' of Sven when he said that during half time of the England/Brazil game 'we needed Winston Churchill but we got Ian Duncan Smith'. So putting this into perspective, whenever England met above decent opposition, they lost every time. The bum teams were easy to roll over. Absolutely correct. Another very important thing people forget when trying to glorify Sven's England record is that it was one of the poorest times for International football in my living memory. Greece won a European Championship One World Cup had Turkey and Senegal as semi-finalists That same world cup that god awful Germany side of Carsten Jancker etc got to the final. As per usual he fell into the correct job at the correct time, cocked it up and came out smelling of roses. He was tactically massacred twice by Scolari in managing to take his inferior Portugal side (midfielder aside, Helder Postiga up front ffs) to holding us over 240 mins of football to exploit our players mental weakness on penalties again.
B52 Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 who could forget Gareth's Southgate's expose' of Sven when he said that during half time of the England/Brazil game 'we needed Winston Churchill but we got Ian Duncan Smith'. A pity Sven had babies in the squad. I'm used to adult manners and responsibility. I'm wondering... Is the fans attacking their own players the same fans that want sven to shout at the players during matches?
topharry123 Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Sven lost 3 games in open play while managing England, all by 1 goal. In the 3 major tournaments we were in, he lost on penalties twice and once to the eventual winners. His record speaks for himself for England. He didn't win any majors for the above reasons but his record was decent. He's 3 game in this season give him a chance.
Leicester_Loyal Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 More doom and gloom merchants eh? What manager apart from Sir Alf has or will ever win anything with England? We're not a top footballing side, as we can see with our record after Sven has left.
accessory Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 A pity Sven had babies in the squad. I'm used to adult manners and responsibility. Who are you referring to as a baby? The same Southgate who managed Middlesbrough to an 8-1 win over Manchester City? Who was the visiting manager that day? His name escapes me at the moment...
B52 Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 ..to exploit our players mental weakness on penalties again. This is interesting, if you take both Southgates shit and what you wrote I see a pattern. English players needs to be shouted at because they can't think else. Fergie is a classic.... Sven should have bought a few eastern europeens. They don't take shit from anyone........
B52 Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Who are you referring to as a baby? The same Southgate who managed Middlesbrough to an 8-1 win over Manchester City? Who was the visiting manager that day? His name escapes me at the moment... He is a crybabie if he wanted Churchill to speak instead of giving himself a kick in the back. Southgate sulked, end of.... The 8-1 win for M'boro got Man City into Europe. I can refresh your memory. Dunne got a red card early and the rest of the game Man City couldn't tackle anybody wich meant M'boro had their own playground.......... If it wasn't for the fair play chane to play in euorope the match had been completely different.
Fjällräven Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 England 1) gifted with a crop of exceptional talent. 2) massive expectation 1) Very true! From an English perspective. 2) Also very true! From an English perspective. Which is why outsiders never seize to be amazed by England's futile hopes of winning a World Cup or European Cup. Diagnosis: A complete lack of realism and objectivity. English players are simply not good enough. Not as a team, and certainly not as individuals. Do these dilutions of grandeur apply to the average Leicester fan regarding their own club these days as well?
Guest MattP Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 He is a crybabie if he wanted Churchill to speak instead of giving himself a kick in the back. Southgate sulked, end of.... The 8-1 win for M'boro got Man City into Europe. I can refresh your memory. Dunne got a red card early and the rest of the game Man City couldn't tackle anybody wich meant M'boro had their own playground..........If it wasn't for the fair play chane to play in euorope the match had been completely different. http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/eng_prem/7381794.stm It wasn't, the place was pretty much already assured. Jihai was yellow carded after the red as well.
Heskey2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Posted 18 August 2011 Seriously name a previous Leicester manager that has won anything (cup wise) before coming to city, get yourselves in line, we are so lucky to have a manager of the calibre of Sven, he's worlds class, which has been proved by greater minds than ours picking him for their team over the last 20 years. This is typical Leicester, all our fans like doing is moaning, and it's killed bigger clubs than ours, what player in their right mind would want to come to us now after seeing us get booed off yesterday, most noise you made all game, kills me, i don't know why people do it we played ok, not brilliant but looked to me like they're just trying to get used to each other. There is no positives to come out of booing at full time (que "it's are right we pay the wages" blah blah etc) do you think sven thinks 1-2 at home is a good result and your boo's enlighten him that we should do better, all it does is separates the players and the fans and makes them feel shitter than they already do. Encouragement is the key, stick with the team, manager, club as a whole. We were in L1 two years ago remember, all of a sudden we're premier league ready, i don't think so, this will take time. Keep the faith - in Sven we trust.
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