FIFA Ban Poppy on England Shirt

[AyewJoking]

I'd say the poppy is better off out of it. If the players dont show the 3 lions the commitment it deserves, let alone a poppy they can use to wipe their noses with.

[Trav Le Bleu]

i agree, its the same rules for everyone and not a case of picking on England.

Yes and by putting it on the shirt that's cheapening it isn't it? Because it's not a personal statement anymore, it's almost obligatory. I mean, does it make any difference at the end of the day - will any of the players have less respect or more respect for the armed forces; will anyone watching the match be affected?

No.

[Zingari]

How about each player gets a temporary poppy tattoo on their forehead?

the referee might keep mistaking them for blood wounds and keep sending them off for treatment .

how would it look if we had 11 players all off at the same time nursing non existent blood injuries ?

[Guest MattP]

Jack Wilshere on Twitter

The "tradition" of wearing poppies on shirts is all of EIGHT years old. We know because our club kicked it off.

I'm sure his club and manager are proud of his hashtag too..

What's wrong with being English and proud?

[The Doctor]

the referee might keep mistaking them for blood wounds and keep sending them off for treatment .

how would it look if we had 11 players all off at the same time nursing non existent blood injuries ?

pretty bad, although you could probably lose by less than you would usually, just leave a keeper on without a tattoo, every time the ball crossed the half way line it would be offside.

[Koke]

FIFA are doing this to avoid the floodgates being opened. If FIFA lets this one slide, then some other country want to have the same privileges, and then it gets political. And once politics is mixed with football is when it'll turn ugly.

[NGoloMode]

If FIFA say yes to England then they have to say yes to everyone and we'll have all kinds of shit on football shirts.

Rules are rules.

[Bert]

People are going a bit over the top. Yes we know FIFA hate England but they have a clear rule set in place.... Defying them would only give them more ammo.

Stick to what we're going to do, we'll still be paying our respects.

[lcfcadam]

I'm not gonna lie, I've realised that after thinking it through I'm actually firmly in the camp that agrees with the FIFA ruling - so much grey area comes into it if one thing is allowed and something else isn't; all political hell could easily break loose if a blanket ban isn't established, and it would be very, very wrong to make a single exception to a blanket ban...

[Guest MattP]

No one has yet explained why this is "political", it isn't.

It's no more political than a black armband is.

[lcfcadam]

I don't know of any myself, but there must be similar symbols from other cultures that the British / Americans would be offended by but would be considered entirely normal and a sign of respect in their own countries? Symbols that are not overtly political or religious or whatever, but could be seen as offensive to people here?

[lcfcadam]

Oh and also MattP I know what you're saying, but there are many in FIFA nations who would consider the poppy very political.

[m00nie]

thought they said it wasnt political but could leave others wanting the same which are politacly tied..

so , no rule brike but others may break the rule and say we did it with a poppy..

[Koke]

No one has yet explained why this is "political", it isn't.

It's no more political than a black armband is.

What is the poppy a symbol of?

[lcfcadam]

thought they said it wasnt political but could leave others wanting the same which are politacly tied..

so , no rule brike but others may break the rule and say we did it with a poppy..

Well this is kind of what I'm saying - it's entirely impractical for FIFA to judge on a case-by-case basis whether something other than the usual decals on the shirt is acceptable or not so much easier for them to just apply one rule across the board and avoid the potential problem entirely. I mean really, ask yourselves, is it desecrating the memories of war heroes that much if poppies aren't displayed on shirts in one football match? I think it's really quite obvious that the respect and remembrance is there amongst 99% of people (including, much as I despise them, those in charge at FIFA)

[Guest MattP]

What is the poppy a symbol of?

In its purest form, paying respect to people who died in a war.

I can't think of a similar situation where any other country has or would do something similar except maybe the US on veterans day and they would never even consider being told what to do by a vile organisation like FIFA.

I couldnt care less if countries made political statements anywhere, why not? Where has everyone bollocks gone in the world today?

[lcfcadam]

I couldnt care less if countries made political statements anywhere, why not? Where has everyone bollocks gone in the world today?

This is going to sound absolutely ridiculous, and of course it's a hugely exaggerated and unlikely example, but I think it illustrates the sort of hole that FIFA want to avoid:

Say the Saudi Arabia football team (fully recognised by FIFA and eligible to qualify for the World Cup as they did in 2002) decided they wanted to display a logo of a woman being stoned to death on their shirts, for whatever reason. Well, it's all written in to their laws in that country and considered entirely normal there so why not? If there wasn't a blanket rule against all non-authorised symbols then FIFA would have a difficult time justifying a ban such a thing.

Now of course I'm fully aware that this is not a comparable situation to displaying a poppy, but it takes to the fullest extent the can of worms that FIFA open themselves up to if they start making exceptions to their rule (and remember in this world, many situations are taken to their fullest, most ridiculous extent).

I may well be only making sense to myself in which case I apologise, but I really can't see too much flaw in my thinking. It would be lovely to be able to rely fully on common sense (in which case the display of a poppy would probably be considered fine), but the world doesn't share a "common" common sense...

[Koke]

In its purest form, paying respect to people who died in a war.

I can't think of a similar situation where any other country has or would do something similar except maybe the US on veterans day and they would never even consider being told what to do by a vile organisation like FIFA.

I couldnt care less if countries made political statements anywhere, why not? Where has everyone bollocks gone in the world today?

That the point, its a blanket no exceptions rule, if they make one they'll have to make more, precedents are set. This is the same reason taking off shirts after a goal is a bookable offence because players would have a political message under their shirt, and FIFA are desperate to keep politics & football as far away from each other as possible. Which is ironic given how they have awarded Qatar the WC. But I digress.

I agree with you in principle. I do see an inherent flaw in the entire argument in that national sides are sponsored by bureaucrats and private corporations, private corporations are funded by private capital and that same private capital is utilised in many cases for political ends. I bet if i spent an hour or two looking into it, I could trace the money and connect money sponsoring national sides to e.g. arms dealing.

[Finnegan]

I understand why people think it's silly to ban it, but astonished that some people don't understand why it could possibly portray a political message - bit worrying.

This, exactly this.

And it's not like they're specifically banning this and only this, there's a pre-existing rule disqualifying the change of an official shirt - right?

This is literally just our tabloid media intentionally evoking the emotions of a few knuckle-dragging jingoists for the sakes of selling their papers and keeping up a sense of "patriotism." It's a complete nothing story.

If the players were that bothered by it they could set a much, much better example by donating healthily and publicly to the RBL or Help For Heroes and setting a REAL example to follow instead of just being made to wear a generic bit of red cloth on a kit.

[Guest MattP]

Lcfcadam - If Saudi Arabia wanted to do that, they should be able too. They would then have to take the backlash of the rest of the civilised world refusing to play them after they had done

This is literally just our tabloid media intentionally evoking the emotions of a few knuckle-dragging jingoists for the sakes of selling their papers and keeping up a sense of "patriotism." It's a complete nothing story.

If the players were that bothered by it they could set a much, much better example by donating healthily and publicly to the RBL or Help For Heroes and setting a REAL example to follow instead of just being made to wear a generic bit of red cloth on a kit.

Think the top bit is harsh, I've read columns in the times and the independent condemning this in the last two days, hardly the literacy choice of your English football following knuckle dragger in my expierience. It's not just England either, the Welsh FA and a few of there players have expressed their dissapointment.

I fully agree on the last point mind.

[Guest MattP]

Scotland have also requested to FIFA now as well......

[21st Century Fox]

The Iranian womens team were banned for wearing the full body kit, because theres one rule for everyone regardless of tradition.

If they were to set a precedent for one country they're opening themselves up to potential chaos in international fixtures with one country not wanting to play another because of a perceived political message because of a symbol adorned on their shirts.

FIFA are actually acting in the best interest of the sport (for once) and we shouldn't think we have the right to be the exception to the rule. I agree with Raj, the players or the F.A. donating playing fees would make a much bigger statement and hold up the 'role models' argument alot better.

[Guest MattP]

The Iranian womens team were banned for wearing the full body kit, because theres one rule for everyone regardless of tradition.

If they were to set a precedent for one country they're opening themselves up to potential chaos in international fixtures with one country not wanting to play another because of a perceived political message because of a symbol adorned on their shirts.

FIFA are actually acting in the best interest of the sport (for once) and we shouldn't think we have the right to be the exception to the rule. I agree with Raj, the players or the F.A. donating playing fees would make a much bigger statement and hold up the 'role models' argument alot better.

When??

I have seen them wearing it at the under 18 championships last year and at the Olympics. Thats also because its part of a perverse religious ideology, quite different to wearing a poppy.

(edit: I realise Olympics is different but I think FIFA still have some say over the rules and regs)

[21st Century Fox]

Its a political message none the less, without distinction...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/8558159/Iran-to-complain-to-Fifa-after-womens-team-banned-for-Islamic-kit.html

[Guest MattP]

Its a political message none the less, without distinction...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/8558159/Iran-to-complain-to-Fifa-after-womens-team-banned-for-Islamic-kit.html

Absolutely outrageous, who the fcuk do FIFA think they are?

You want to watch them play in it as well, awful.