5 points from 18?

[Nick]

Pointless rationale but if SGE had still been here, I honestly believe we would be in the top six. And Sven deserved a full season. Pearson does too (though it pains me to say it and if he doesn't sell the old guard and change the midfield lack of creativity in the summer he should be shot) but if he doesn't get it right next year, he should go.

[ian the fox]

clearly the problem is on the pitch not the dugout , uncommitted players with attitude , sven created that ,

[Cecchini1976]

No, all I do is insult people who a) make things up (as you have done) b) start threads without researching their information (as you have done) c) continuously post incorrect information (as you have done).

You can trust me, that the feeling is very mutual.

I know you on here, and you keep posting stuff that isn't true. So you aren't leaving me with much choice in the way I view you.

Well perhaps Sven should have tried to buy some players in January then. People keep saying Pearson has had time in January to shape the team, Sven should have started that process then shouldn't he. Rather than leaving it to the summer and expecting a dozen players to bed in instantly.

2 and in 14th place... if he kept up his ppg ratio we'd be in pretty much an identical position as we are now.

The point thing was wrong my bag but got the info from the LCFC football league app, still 8 from 21. So If Sven stayed we would be in the same position on a points to games ratio?? Is that how it works then?? What have I made up?????? Anyway forget this don't need to have a keyboard argument, easy to talk shit to people via Internet. If you don't like what others think maybe you should not be on a forum, disagreeing is fine, insulting is just childish

[Cecchini1976]

Pointless rationale but if SGE had still been here, I honestly believe we would be in the top six. And Sven deserved a full season. Pearson does too (though it pains me to say it and if he doesn't sell the old guard and change the midfield lack of creativity in the summer he should be shot) but if he doesn't get it right next year, he should go.

Agree with all of the above, really want Pearson to prove me wrong

[cc_star]

Think everyone including NP himself expected the form to have improved so that we were in the mix.

So NP has fallen short of expectations, but reasons for that are many, including last seasons transfer policy which led to us signing a whole new team in the summer, a team of talented players with collectively a weak attitude & questionable ability to make a team out of the individuals.

Current manager has had one third of the time of the previous manager who many people say didn't have long enough, so... WTF?

And that's not taking into account spending & the all important summer when you create the team spirit (there hasn't really been any amongst the newer guys) & mold the players into a team... there was so many failings its unbelievable.

I find it odd that people shouting loudest for NP's head are exactly the same people who wanted the reason for the season's under-achievement to be given more time. Bizarre.

I don't know whether NP will be a success in the long term, but I believe the absolute earliest we can take stock is the international break that both Sousa & Sven were sacked in.

[Trav Le Bleu]

So you are happy with our season then?? I don't care what other teams do, just Leicester. Imagine how bad the table would look if the teams you mentioned did not perform badly in this time. Oh and most of the teams you have mentioned are in the play off shake up

The point that Babs is making is that ALL teams drop points and that currently everyone is taking points of everyone else. Until yesterday we were third in the form table based on the last eight matches. You may only care about what City do, but you can only judge them against what OTHER teams teams are also doing. This is called PERSPECTIVE. I suggest you look it up in the dictionary.

[Guest]

No, people won't quit using that fact. Having a difficult January window is nothing like having a summer. People will keep mentioning until people start taking on board that this is mostly someone elses team. Whether he knew the squad or not has nothing to do with it. We thought we knew the squad, the bookies thought they knew the squad and everyone has been massively wrong.

No;

It's the team he chose to manage.

I don't see why an intelligent guy like yourself can't see that.

There is no reason that he SHOULD have money to spend in the summer.

He has a team and he has to get the best out of them - which he isn't consistently - or sell them for what he can and hope he gets given the money.

He was given more money in th January window than many managers get in the off-season.

Finally I like the argument given by someone earlier. When you - not a footie manager - agree to work for a company - not a footie team - you inherit a team of people and you have to do the best you can with them and make them as efficient as possible. In a normal management situation you can't sell or fire your employees because they are not the ones you brought in. Saying that NP can't win because he hasn't brought the players in himself is a puerile argument. I'm sure that he told th owners he could make a good go of it this season (probably that he saw promotion as a strong probability).

Do you think if he was given chelsea or Manure's squad and told to get promotion to the premier league he'd say well you'll have to wait until I've brought in Matty Fryatt and Jack hobbs?

Enough with this argument - he knew the squad when he accepted the big pay rise and he will have made positive sounds to the owners. He HAS failed. I'm not advocating that he is sacked but I am saying he has failed and his position should not be guaranteed if a better prospect is available in May.

[Guest]

Pointless rationale but if SGE had still been here, I honestly believe we would be in the top six. And Sven deserved a full season. Pearson does too (though it pains me to say it and if he doesn't sell the old guard and change the midfield lack of creativity in the summer he should be shot) but if he doesn't get it right next year, he should go.

This

[Guest]

The point that Babs is making is that ALL teams drop points and that currently everyone is taking points of everyone else. Until yesterday we were third in the form table based on the last eight matches. You may only care about what City do, but you can only judge them against what OTHER teams teams are also doing. This is called PERSPECTIVE. I suggest you look it up in the dictionary.

well we're now down to 11th in the"Form" table. that seems realistic and it isn't good enough for promotion is it?

Also 6 of the 10 with better form are above us which if things carried on as they have in the last 8 means we'd drop further behind the playoff zone.

[Cecchini1976]

The point that Babs is making is that ALL teams drop points and that currently everyone is taking points of everyone else. Until yesterday we were third in the form table based on the last eight matches. You may only care about what City do, but you can only judge them against what OTHER teams teams are also doing. This is called PERSPECTIVE. I suggest you look it up in the dictionary.

No it's irrelevant what other teams do when you lose at Bristol, P'boro and draw at home to Forest. If we picked up 7 points from the mentioned games and hard a good run to the end of the season and finished outside of the play offs, we would not have people moaning about the manager or players attitude. I am looking at the situation we are in realistically. You can't say the teams above us are slipping up so its ok that we do. The fact of the matter is in March our home record is excellent one of a team chasing promotion, but the away form is the complete opposite. If we won our last 2 games and were still the same points of the play offs as this morning as the other teams won as well, nobody would be unhappy, as all a team can do is look after its own results,

[Trav Le Bleu]

well we're now down to 11th in the"Form" table. that seems realistic and it isn't good enough for promotion is it?

Also 6 of the 10 with better form are above us which if things carried on as they have in the last 8 means we'd drop further behind the playoff zone.

I wasn't talking about getting into the play-offs or promotion was I? Where did I mention the play-offs? Where did I mention promotion? Where did I say our form was good enough? I was talking about perspective and defending Babs post because he's one of the more sensible posters on here. Not that he needs me to do that for him.

[Guest]

I wasn't talking about getting into the play-offs or promotion was I? Where did I mention the play-offs? Where did I mention promotion? Where did I say our form was good enough? I was talking about perspective and defending Babs post because he's one of the more sensible posters on here. Not that he needs me to do that for him.

So you weren't actually addressing any of the issues. I'm sorry that I took you for a serious poster.

[Cecchini1976]

So to sum up this thread, I have been insulted, told I know shit, all because I think our recent form is not good enough. Yes the thread title should have been 8 points from 21 school boy error yes, need to be insulted no. If any fan is happy with our recent form( 3 rd best in division before Saturday) fair play, but I pay my money week in week out and expect better, is that such a crime.

[trabuch]

Marshall was a very good signing.

[Guest]

Marshall was a very good signing.

We've made at least half a dozen good signings in the last year and possibly double figure good signings. Sadly we are not getting the best out of our players.

[seenitall]

No, all I do is insult people who a) make things up (as you have done) b) start threads without researching their information (as you have done) c) continuously post incorrect information (as you have done).

You can trust me, that the feeling is very mutual.

I know you on here, and you keep posting stuff that isn't true. So you aren't leaving me with much choice in the way I view you.

Well perhaps Sven should have tried to buy some players in January then. People keep saying Pearson has had time in January to shape the team, Sven should have started that process then shouldn't he. Rather than leaving it to the summer and expecting a dozen players to bed in instantly.

2 and in 14th place... if he kept up his ppg ratio we'd be in pretty much an identical position as we are now.

Well done Nige then

[seenitall]

Think everyone including NP himself expected the form to have improved so that we were in the mix.

So NP has fallen short of expectations, but reasons for that are many, including last seasons transfer policy which led to us signing a whole new team in the summer, a team of talented players with collectively a weak attitude & questionable ability to make a team out of the individuals.

Current manager has had one third of the time of the previous manager who many people say didn't have long enough, so... WTF?

And that's not taking into account spending & the all important summer when you create the team spirit (there hasn't really been any amongst the newer guys) & mold the players into a team... there was so many failings its unbelievable.

I find it odd that people shouting loudest for NP's head are exactly the same people who wanted the reason for the season's under-achievement to be given more time. Bizarre.

I don't know whether NP will be a success in the long term, but I believe the absolute earliest we can take stock is the international break that both Sousa & Sven were sacked in.

21 games to Sven's 50 so nearly half

he has also had over half as many games again as Sven had with this squad so wrong again (21 to Sven's 13)

That he didn't buy some of them is true, but Di Matteo didn't buy any of the Chelsea team and they were playing gash before Villa Boas went, what's his excuse?

[Babylon]

So to sum up this thread, I have been insulted, told I know shit, all because I think our recent form is not good enough. Yes the thread title should have been 8 points from 21 school boy error yes, need to be insulted no. If any fan is happy with our recent form( 3 rd best in division before Saturday) fair play, but I pay my money week in week out and expect better, is that such a crime.

Deary me, you just don't get it do you.

I have been insulted, told I know shit, all because I think our recent form is not good enough.

You've been insulted for posting a load of old cods wallop. For instance...

"No 5, lost to P'boro, Bristol, Reading , drew with Forest & Blackpool and beat Hull"

Not bothering to do your research.

"Pearson done himself any favours with a shocking points return in a period we had to win games in?"

Before yesterday it was the third best points return over 8 games, today it's the 11th, with all the teams I listed in worse form. That's not shocking, it's average.

Constantly stating I and others are happy with how things are.

Nobody has ever said they are happy.

Stating I think it's Svens Fault.

When I clearly stated they both share the blame. Stop making things up!!!!

"I'm sure when Sven left we were in a better position to make the play offs"

Incorrect, currently higher in the league and his ppg ratio would see us pretty much where we are now had it carried on.

"and all your messiah had done is piss half the players off."

You mean he's decided to not play one player who has a track record of having a questionable personality?

For the last and final time, stop saying people are happy just because they don't think all the blame lays with Pearson. When someone actually states they are happy fine, but they haven't so stop saying it and using it in your arguments, it's nonsense.

[Babylon]

21 games to Sven's 50 so nearly half

He said time, not games.

That he didn't buy some of them is true, but Di Matteo didn't buy any of the Chelsea team and they were playing gash before Villa Boas went, what's his excuse?

Before Villas Boas joined Chelsea they were comfortably in the top couple of teams for gods knows how long, the team had a record of being good. Villas Boas had those players performing BELOW their usual standard.

The difference being that prior to Pearson our usual standard was exactly where we are now. The team with these players has no history of being any better than this, unlike Chelsea have. If Pearson had taken over and we dopped into the bottom few teams then he would have them performing worse than their standard under Sven, but that isn't the case.

[Babylon]

It's the team he chose to manage.

Yes I team everyone thought might be good enough, but have consistantly failed. Look at a list of players yeah you think it looks ok, but until you know them you don't know what they are like.

There is no reason that he SHOULD have money to spend in the summer. He has a team and he has to get the best out of them - which he isn't consistently - or sell them for what he can and hope he gets given the money.

Who said he will have money, I'm guessing he will have to move players out to bring players in as per your second point. If they don't give him the money then we will have to judge him on havig nothing to spend in the summer and what he produces with that.

As for getting the best out of the team. What is the best out of them? We're midtable, as we were under Sven. The team has shown itself to be nothing else at the moment. Maybe, just maybe, this is the best the group has to offer.

Finally I like the argument given by someone earlier. When you - not a footie manager - agree to work for a company - not a footie team - you inherit a team of people and you have to do the best you can with them and make them as efficient as possible. In a normal management situation you can't sell or fire your employees because they are not the ones you brought in. Saying that NP can't win because he hasn't brought the players in himself is a puerile argument. I'm sure that he told th owners he could make a good go of it this season (probably that he saw promotion as a strong probability).

It's not a purile argument at all, and the two things are nothing alike no matter how much you want them to be.

Do you think if he was given chelsea or Manure's squad and told to get promotion to the premier league he'd say well you'll have to wait until I've brought in Matty Fryatt and Jack hobbs?

Eh? Does that even make sense, Man U and Chelsea are proven teams. What has this group of players actually done to prove themselves capable as a unit. As I already said, what if this is as good as they can be as a unit. What makes people so sure anyone could get more out of them if Sven and Pearson have failed. Two very different people with very different styles.

Enough with this argument - he knew the squad when he accepted the big pay rise and he will have made positive sounds to the owners. He HAS failed. I'm not advocating that he is sacked but I am saying he has failed and his position should not be guaranteed if a better prospect is available in May.

Whether he has failed or not is subjective to what you thought his aim was. If the owners brief was to try and get promotion this season, but to actually build for the long term if that wasn't possible, then the project isn't finished yet. They were attracted by what he did here and what he did at Hull, which was to build a team. If they wanted a quick fix rather than a builder then they went for the wrong man. The fact they did makes me think that they may well have been looking at this as more long term than short.

[Cecchini1976]

Deary me, you just don't get it do you.

You've been insulted for posting a load of old cods wallop. For instance...

"No 5, lost to P'boro, Bristol, Reading , drew with Forest & Blackpool and beat Hull"

Not bothering to do your research.

"Pearson done himself any favours with a shocking points return in a period we had to win games in?"

Before yesterday it was the third best points return over 8 games, today it's the 11th, with all the teams I listed in worse form. That's not shocking, it's average.

Constantly stating I and others are happy with how things are.

Nobody has ever said they are happy.

Stating I think it's Svens Fault.

When I clearly stated they both share the blame. Stop making things up!!!!

"I'm sure when Sven left we were in a better position to make the play offs"

Incorrect, currently higher in the league and his ppg ratio would see us pretty much where we are now had it carried on.

"and all your messiah had done is piss half the players off."

You mean he's decided to not play one player who has a track record of having a questionable personality?

For the last and final time, stop saying people are happy just because they don't think all the blame lays with Pearson. When someone actually states they are happy fine, but they haven't so stop saying it and using it in your arguments, it's nonsense.

What argument?? I have stated I am not happy with our recent points return as it is not good enough. And as for your other comments my oh my. You make me laugh anyway.I love how you don't seem to get the point of a fans forum, you are entitled to your opinions and I am allowed mine, if you don't like them, tough I don't give a shit

[seenitall]

He said time, not games.

Before Villas Boas joined Chelsea they were comfortably in the top couple of teams for gods knows how long, the team had a record of being good. Villas Boas had those players performing BELOW their usual standard.

The difference being that prior to Pearson our usual standard was exactly where we are now. The team with these players has no history of being any better than this, unlike Chelsea have. If Pearson had taken over and we dopped into the bottom few teams then he would have them performing worse than their standard under Sven, but that isn't the case.

Silly me tee hee - all those games we played in June and July were mega for us..........pedant

Yes I team everyone thought might be good enough, but have consistantly failed. Look at a list of players yeah you think it looks ok, but until you know them you don't know what they are like.

Who said he will have money, I'm guessing he will have to move players out to bring players in as per your second point. If they don't give him the money then we will have to judge him on havig nothing to spend in the summer and what he produces with that.

As for getting the best out of the team. What is the best out of them? We're midtable, as we were under Sven. The team has shown itself to be nothing else at the moment. Maybe, just maybe, this is the best the group has to offer.

It's not a purile argument at all, and the two things are nothing alike no matter how much you want them to be.

Eh? Does that even make sense, Man U and Chelsea are proven teams. What has this group of players actually done to prove themselves capable as a unit. As I already said, what if this is as good as they can be as a unit. What makes people so sure anyone could get more out of them if Sven and Pearson have failed. Two very different people with very different styles.

Whether he has failed or not is subjective to what you thought his aim was. If the owners brief was to try and get promotion this season, but to actually build for the long term if that wasn't possible, then the project isn't finished yet. They were attracted by what he did here and what he did at Hull, which was to build a team. If they wanted a quick fix rather than a builder then they went for the wrong man. The fact they did makes me think that they may well have been looking at this as more long term than short.

You love Nige - but love can be blind..........

Is it just me or are Hull crap too? If that's building a team we should stop him right now - finished below us last year and are pants this year

[Raw Dykes]

Silly me tee hee - all those games we played in June and July were mega for us..........pedant

Seriously? Are you actually saying that the off season has no bearing on the team for the following season? When all the pre-season fitness and all the important buying and selling of players takes place. Essentially, the manager should be able to lead a team to promotion, as long as he has 11 men on the pitch for each match. No?

[seenitall]

Seriously? Are you actually saying that the off season has no bearing on the team for the following season? When all the pre-season fitness and all the important buying and selling of players takes place. Essentially, the manager should be able to lead a team to promotion, as long as he has 11 men on the pitch for each match. No?

Not at all but I am saying that Nigel has stuttered through almost half as many games as Sven had. Sure he didn't have the close season but in four months he has had a transfer window, access to the loan market (both to bring in and offload), a chance to impose his own fitness regime, bought a third of a new team and gets to play another third that he had when he was here before in most games - arguably has a better keeper than he had before and a better right back and on paper two way better strikers that he seems incapable of getting more than the odd game out of, an exciting midfielder in Neil Danns (who he was apparently after at Hull), is getting paid £20k a week still has several more of his old guard available if he needs them and somehow has failed miserably

The gamble didn't pay off

[paulsherwood1]

Not at all but I am saying that Nigel has stuttered through almost half as many games as Sven had. Sure he didn't have the close season but in four months he has had a transfer window, access to the loan market (both to bring in and offload), a chance to impose his own fitness regime, bought a third of a new team and gets to play another third that he had when he was here before in most games - arguably has a better keeper than he had before and a better right back and on paper two way better strikers that he seems incapable of getting more than the odd game out of, an exciting midfielder in Neil Danns (who he was apparently after at Hull), is getting paid £20k a week still has several more of his old guard available if he needs them and somehow has failed miserably

The gamble didn't pay off

AGREE