ADK Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 Alot of people become institutionalised and so they get quite comfortable with their life in prison. Prison is supposed to protect the general public from people who pose a danger to them and ideally to rehabilitate those people so that they can become part of society.
Rincewind Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 I saw one of the programs. Re life being better. The point was the prisoner I saw speaking said he would not have had the education that he had inside outside and would probably be causing trouble. Is that a bad thing? He didn't want to be released because of the job market finding somewhere to live and the predjudice he'd receive. Not all are like him. Many would like to see their family and be with them. One said he would not think of escaping because the only places he could go to was to loved ones and to avoid capture he'd have to cut them out of his life.
Rincewind Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 The facilities that they have I would think they have to earn the right to have. If they act like morans they would spend a lot of time in solitary. And they are there for a minimum time. They do not include child killers or really hard gangsrer types. There was one on monday that was a bit of a nutter but the rest killed in a spur of the moment (would have been congratulated by some if they killed someone they though was abusing their kid) One killed his wife who was having an affair in full view. He said he thinks about it every day.
Nick Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 It's a huge myth a lot of people like to spread that prisons these days look like insides of something from the Shawshank Redemption, as you can see by many things, it simply isn't the case anymore. You haven't been in many prisons then.
Guest MattP Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 You haven't been in many prisons then. Go on then, provide me with a prison in England that resembles Shawshank.
sphericalfox Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 You haven't been in many prisons then. Nick, he's taking acooling's guide to forum posting and running with it. He's on a roll. Little knowledge and no experience = fully-fledged unwavering opinion.
Nick Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 Two and three to a cell. 23 hour lock down and a toilet. I've been in many prisons throughout the UK in my career and I assure you, holiday camps they are not. It depends on the category and the agency who runs it.
Guest MattP Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 Two and three to a cell. 23 hour lock down and a toilet. I've been in many prisons throughout the UK in my career and I assure you, holiday camps they are not. It depends on the category and the agency who runs it. Never mentioned "holiday camp" I said they werent as bad as people made out, there is a massive middle ground in between. I'll take your work for it but most of the lads I know who have been inside have never experienced anything like that.
Head Honcho Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 Fascinating stuff. I know their punishment is supposed to be the loss of freedom, but some of the perks they get must be galling for the families if victims.
Rincewind Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 They have to be good boys though before they are given extra bread to go with their water.
Daggers Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 I'm going to murder someone so I don't have to read Matt's shit-stained opinions any longer. Unless they offer me internet access in which case I am going to run away and join a circus.
Rincewind Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 Even if they are allowed Nintendo I doubt they'd be allowed games like GTA or Jail Break or Kill a Warden. And I can't see them being allowed access to porn sites so the ones who are moaning think how lucky you are. A hot Celeb page on a message forum would be a no no either. Why don't we have any City fans logging into Foxestalk from Gartree? Or even Welford Road.
acooling08 Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 I saw some of the episode, and from what I saw, some of them need a bullet in the head. Rehabilation followed by release is the best option, but in the cases of the serverly pyschopathic who show no signs of remourse or reform, just execute them. Do society a favour by a) not spending money keeping them alive and b) never allow them to harm an innocent person again.
Nick Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 I'm going to murder someone so I don't have to read Matt's shit-stained opinions any longer. Unless they offer me internet access in which case I am going to run away and join a circus. If you promise to kill me - i'll give you a lift to the circus.
foxfanazer Posted 27 June 2012 Posted 27 June 2012 This is exactly the attitude that I can't stand, it is basically jealousy, you are jealous because someone else has something you don't, or they didn't have to work for it as hard as you. It is the same attitude I see on every thread about benefits and it is this same attitude that represents everything that is wrong with modern society. They get to use a bit of Gym equipment for free, you have to pay £60 a month for your gym, they get access to a playstation as a reward for good behaviour you had to pay £300 plus games!!! They have lost their right to their liberty, to their privacy, to take part in society, to get a meaningful job and earn money to pay for the luxuries, to be able take a walk in the sunshine, to see their family whenever they want...but they sometimes have free access to a playstation, the lucky cvnts. I can see things from both sides of the argument but saying they have "lost" their rights to privacy etc is ridiculous. Surely they have given up their right the moment they take another persons life and ruin the lives of the victims family. That's a life sentence
Captain... Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 I can see things from both sides of the argument but saying they have "lost" their rights to privacy etc is ridiculous. Surely they have given up their right the moment they take another persons life and ruin the lives of the victims family. That's a life sentence Jesus, some people love to argue the semantics rather than look at the actual argument, lost, given-up, technically they are both wrong, they have had these rights taken away, that is their punishment, that is what I was getting at. That doesn't happen when you kill someone that happens when you are punished for it.
simmo1977 Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 I'm specifically talking about murderers here, but these people showed no mercy to their victims, I don't see why we should show them any mercy in their punishment.
RobHawk Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 I saw some of the episode, and from what I saw, some of them need a bullet in the head. Rehabilation followed by release is the best option, but in the cases of the serverly pyschopathic who show no signs of remourse or reform, just execute them. Do society a favour by a) not spending money keeping them alive and b) never allow them to harm an innocent person again. From now on i think i'll call you Gordon!!! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTKORcr1jhY
Captain... Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 I'm specifically talking about murderers here, but these people showed no mercy to their victims, I don't see why we should show them any mercy in their punishment. But that then makes us/the judicial system, no better than them.
foxfanazer Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 Jesus, some people love to argue the semantics rather than look at the actual argument, lost, given-up, technically they are both wrong, they have had these rights taken away, that is their punishment, that is what I was getting at. That doesn't happen when you kill someone that happens when you are punished for it. 1 I'm not arguing and 2 it wasn't specifically the word lost I was pIcking you up on, more the sentiment that they are entitled to these "perks" (wrong word). Saying this I agree with that without mental and physical stimulation you could have a far more dangerous prisoner than you started with. Just think there needs to be a bit more moderation
Captain... Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 1 I'm not arguing and 2 it wasn't specifically the word lost I was pIcking you up on, more the sentiment that they are entitled to these "perks" (wrong word). Saying this I agree with that without mental and physical stimulation you could have a far more dangerous prisoner than you started with. Just think there needs to be a bit more moderation I think one of the most interesting bits of the programme was at the start, the first guy that spoke, he said "I'm in here for life, what more can they do to me? What is going to stop me killing these men, killing you? I have nothing more to lose." I think this is one of the toughest things you have to deal with when dealing with "lifers", motivating them to change.
foxfanazer Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 I think one of the most interesting bits of the programme was at the start, the first guy that spoke, he said "I'm in here for life, what more can they do to me? What is going to stop me killing these men, killing you? I have nothing more to lose." I think this is one of the toughest things you have to deal with when dealing with "lifers", motivating them to change. Yeah that was the guy that is guaranteed to spend the rest of his life in there, didn't understand why the others got tariffs but his was permanent
Captain... Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 Yeah that was the guy that is guaranteed to spend the rest of his life in there, didn't understand why the others got tariffs but his was permanent I can only assume due to the severity of his crimes, or his complete lack of remorse, sometimes in these cases I do think it would be better to execute them, or give them the option of taking their own lives, it does generally go against my beliefs but if somebody is that damages that they cannot distinguish right from wrong, to the point where they are capable of taking someone's life, and it has been determined they will never be safe to allow back into society, then maybe it is better to allow them to die. Compare that guy to the one with Aspergers, or the guy who just lost it and killed his mate over drugs, they are clearly not in the same category and can be helped.
foxfanazer Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 I can only assume due to the severity of his crimes, or his complete lack of remorse, sometimes in these cases I do think it would be better to execute them, or give them the option of taking their own lives, it does generally go against my beliefs but if somebody is that damages that they cannot distinguish right from wrong, to the point where they are capable of taking someone's life, and it has been determined they will never be safe to allow back into society, then maybe it is better to allow them to die. Compare that guy to the one with Aspergers, or the guy who just lost it and killed his mate over drugs, they are clearly not in the same category and can be helped. Yeah I felt quite sorry for the guy with the beard that killed his mate and a bit for the one who killed his wife. Both seemed to come from a moment of uncontrolable rage which is quite a scary thought to think it could happen to you. Don't think they should have the option to die though, just my opinion. The best bit was when they found all those bottles of hooch
Daggers Posted 28 June 2012 Posted 28 June 2012 If you promise to kill me - i'll give you a lift to the circus. I bet you've never been to a circus. I've read about them once in the Daily Mail so I have a strong opinion. They train giraffes to read the Communist manifesto and the tigers have Xbox360s and everything. It's disgusting. They should all be closed down and the animals made to suffer like, err, animals.
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