Is On-line shopping killing the High Street?

[Trav Le Bleu]

Minimum wage has got little to do with it. We all know the costs of property and rent. That's much more the reason why. I should imagine Amazon's warehouse people are on miminum wage (they certainly don't seem to like paying any more than they absolutely have to).

Yet in the end it all comes down to one word.

Greed.

But having all the money in the world is worthless if no one else has any. Money is like blood; it needs to circulate. If it doesn't you haemorage or bleed out and neither of those are good. At the moment, things are starting to haemorage quite badly.

[Captain...]

Blockbuster have gone into administration... hardly a shock with places like Lovefilm, netflix, sky boxoffice, itunes etc taking a huge slice.

I'm sure this has been on the horizon for a long time, they must have seen it coming and should have diversified to save their ass.

Or negotiated a take-over/buy-out from Love-film

[Captain...]

Reducing the minimum wage won't save the High Street, innovation will. The same sort of innovation that Amazon showed by building a world class online shopping experience. The High Street needs to respond by providing a service that online shops can't, something HMV failed completely to do.

Such as?

It is all well and good saying the high street only has itself to blame, but I don't really see how HMV or Blockbusters could have improved their shopping experience, they could have increased product knowledge and service and be true experts in their field, but that didn't save Jessops.

They slashed prices and had a number of sales on, offering many CDs at decent value, but Amazon was always cheaper, even if only by a few pence, everything I have bought recently form HMV has been cheaper at Amazon, almost as if they monitored HMV's prices and under cut it by a few pence. That's entertainment on Gallowtree gate was cheaper too

[Guest BlueBrett]

I'm sure this has been on the horizon for a long time, they must have seen it coming and should have diversified to save their ass.

I think this is a large part of the problem. Most of the shops in the high street just sell all the same rubbish as one another and most of it is rubbish you could just as easily buy online.

We seem to be heading either towards having one giant Tesco-esque superstore in each town that sells literally everything or preferably towards the death of all large chains and the rise of more niche independents with greater focus on quality rather than pile the shit high sell the shit cheap. Maybe a combination of both is most likely but I feel no sympathy for Woolworths, HMV et. al. who have been trying to push us generic tat for years.

[Trav Le Bleu]

I've just had a terrible realisation. My job is inherently responsible in part for the death of the High St!

[Captain...]

I've just had a terrible realisation. My job is inherently responsible in part for the death of the High St!

Well this is one area that should work in the high street's favour, delivery costs, but Amazon offer a free delivery and still under cut the high street.

[Babylon]

We seem to be heading either towards having one giant Tesco-esque superstore in each town that sells literally everything

You can see it with Pubs also. Exactly why I purchased Whetherspoons shares a few years back, you'll end up with every pub and club being one of them.

[Trav Le Bleu]

You can see it with Pubs also. Exactly why I purchased Whetherspoons shares a few years back, you'll end up with every pub and club being one of them.

Not enough posts are answered by music videos.

[Babylon]

I think this is a large part of the problem. Most of the shops in the high street just sell all the same rubbish as one another and most of it is rubbish you could just as easily buy online.

I wonder how long it will be before we see an Amazon on the high street. Something that is used part as showroom, part as a collection point. Or perhaps something along the apple route where they sell just their own products, Kindle etc.

[Guest BlueBrett]

You can see it with Pubs also. Exactly why I purchased Whetherspoons shares a few years back, you'll end up with every pub and club being one of them.

I think that will prove to be a shrewd move. Along with M&B they've pretty much got the market sewn up. My uncle had 30k in Woolworth's when they folded but I just couldn't bring myself to feel sorry for him. Even as a kid I remember walking around there thinking 'who the hell wants any of this crap?' (apart from pic n' mix obviously)

I wonder how long it will be before we see an Amazon on the high street. Something that is used part as showroom, part as a collection point. Or perhaps something along the apple route where they sell just their own products, Kindle etc.

Sort of Amazon does Argos?

[Manwell Pablo]

I'm not calling for it to save HMV, I am calling for it to help save the high street and jobs, one of the reasons prices for commodities is going up is because costs are going up, reducing costs means prices can be reduced and can be more competitive.

As I said in my original post reduce it from £6.19 to £5. It will also create jobs, for every 5 people that have a reduced minimum wage there is room in the budget to employ one more person.

Still nobody has answered my very simple question, if given the choice would you take a wage decrease or lose your job?

If they decreased my wages I'd quit on the spot and be back in employment in roughly 2-5 weeks I reckon.

You don't employ people to save them from unemployment, you employ people if you need them to do a job. No point in employing 6 people to do 5 peoples work!

[foz.foz]

Do you currently work for minimum wage?

Would you rather take a pay cut or lose your job?

The way things are going mate I could be in that situation again within the next 12 months. We took a massive pay cut and a new contract 18 months ago. It was either that or out the door. I wouldn't want to be faced with the same thing again.

[Captain...]

If they decreased my wages I'd quit on the spot and be back in employment in roughly 2-5 weeks I reckon.

You don't employ people to save them from unemployment, you employ people if you need them to do a job. No point in employing 6 people to do 5 peoples work!

But I am guessing you are a skilled worker, and not working in HMV, this is the difference, with all the high street shops closing, unskilled jobs are decreasing.

You don't employ people for the sake of it, but if you need 6 people to do a job, but you only have the budget to employ 5 at minimum wage, you employ 5 at minimum wage and get them to work harder, you can't do anything else, even if you wanted to and the workforce were happy to work for that amount you would be legally stopped from doing so.

[foz.foz]

I can actually see in the future, on-line shops like Amazon opening up warehouses like B n Q size, where you can drive up and collect your goods no matter what time of day or night it is. You order on-line and it would be ready for collection in 60 minutes should you choose.

pic.

I wonder how long it will be before we see an Amazon on the high street. Something that is used part as showroom, part as a collection point. Or perhaps something along the apple route where they sell just their own products, Kindle etc.

Makes 2 of us

[MooseBreath]

Click and collect should take off. I've been thinking of using it for food shopping. Do the shopping online at work and then pick it up on the way home. I haven't tried it yet though.

[Manwell Pablo]

But I am guessing you are a skilled worker, and not working in HMV, this is the difference, with all the high street shops closing, unskilled jobs are decreasing.

You don't employ people for the sake of it, but if you need 6 people to do a job, but you only have the budget to employ 5 at minimum wage, you employ 5 at minimum wage and get them to work harder, you can't do anything else, even if you wanted to and the workforce were happy to work for that amount you would be legally stopped from doing so.

Well you didn't say that in the quoted post did you.

Busniess's such as HMV will employ the levels of staff they need, and if they go under because of it, they go under. They wont generally under staff, not to an extreme at least. This is irrelevant anyway, there are a number of reasons why Amazon can charge less gain a better gross and generally out do high street stores like HMV, no VAT, or Multi Million pound highstreet rent bills contribute just as much, however general consumer demand is the main factor, I live in Ashby and I want a film or Xbox game, what am I going to do travel a round 40 minutes to the nearest HMV and waste money on petrol and parking or order it off the Internet, or if I want it straight away, drive to Tesco who probably have what I want anyway.

There were always going under, they wont be the last either you'll see many a store close in the next few years, which will hopefully push rent prices down and you may see some sort of rival.

[cambridgefox]

I wonder how long it will be before we see an Amazon on the high street. Something that is used part as showroom, part as a collection point. Or perhaps something along the apple route where they sell just their own products, Kindle etc.

im not too sure myself,one of the reasons they do so well and have low prices is because they haven't got expensive dead space.While their profits grow the rate they have( 20% of all online retail in US)there is not a need to do this as yet.fulfilment centres,yes,but I believe in the states they have invested heavily in robots and not people for these.

Wise move on the Wetherspoon shares by the way,my dad made a killing on his before he died.

[Captain...]

Well you didn't say that in the quoted post did you.

Busniess's such as HMV will employ the levels of staff they need, and if they go under because of it, they go under. They wont generally under staff, not to an extreme at least. This is irrelevant anyway, there are a number of reasons why Amazon can charge less gain a better gross and generally out do high street stores like HMV, no VAT, or Multi Million pound highstreet rent bills contribute just as much, however general consumer demand is the main factor, I live in Ashby and I want a film or Xbox game, what am I going to do travel a round 40 minutes to the nearest HMV and waste money on petrol and parking or order it off the Internet, or if I want it straight away, drive to Tesco who probably have what I want anyway.

There were always going under, they wont be the last either you'll see many a store close in the next few years, which will hopefully push rent prices down and you may see some sort of rival.

I thought it was pretty clear I was talking about the minimum wage and people who are on it.

I have also mentioned all the other factors that you have in the difference between Amazon and HMV, I have also said it is not just about Amazon and HMV, but the high street vs online, and one of the big advantages online have is that they don't need to employ sales staff (along with retail space) if the high street closes then all these minimum wage workers will become unemployed, now by reducing their wages, and cutting costs for the high streer you may save their jobs, for a little longer at least.

[Manwell Pablo]

I thought it was pretty clear I was talking about the minimum wage and people who are on it.

I have also mentioned all the other factors that you have in the difference between Amazon and HMV, I have also said it is not just about Amazon and HMV, but the high street vs online, and one of the big advantages online have is that they don't need to employ sales staff (along with retail space) if the high street closes then all these minimum wage workers will become unemployed, now by reducing their wages, and cutting costs for the high streer you may save their jobs, for a little longer at least.

Not really if you've just rocked up in this thread, just sounded like a hypothetical question to me!

Wont work, it's game over for high street stores who can't or wont move with the times. at the end of the day the world moves on, as it did when industrys were closed in the 70's and 80's.

[Webbo]

Minimum wage has got little to do with it. We all know the costs of property and rent. That's much more the reason why. I should imagine Amazon's warehouse people are on miminum wage (they certainly don't seem to like paying any more than they absolutely have to).

Yet in the end it all comes down to one word.

Greed.

It's not greed to want your business to succeed. If you are starting in an established field like retail you need to be either cheaper or better, preferably both to survive.That means cutting your costs to compete on price, which the customer benefits from btw.

If HMV could have put Amazon out of business they wouldn't have thought twice.

[Trav Le Bleu]

It's not greed to want your business to succeed. If you are starting in an established field like retail you need to be either cheaper or better, preferably both to survive.That means cutting your costs to compete on price, which the customer benefits from btw.

If HMV could have put Amazon out of business they wouldn't have thought twice.

No, it's not, but many businesses have gone beyond that. When we have 5-6 companies controlling everything the world buys and able to set the prices... well, we won't ever reach that point, it'll be too late.

Beside which, in the comment I was referring to greed more in the fact that rents in the High St remain stupidly high as more and more shop space empties. There seems to be little corelation between prices and market forces at the moment. We're led to believe (and it certainly feels like it) that we have less money to spend and yet prices increase.

[leicsmac]

No, it's not, but many businesses have gone beyond that. When we have 5-6 companies controlling everything the world buys and able to set the prices... well, we won't ever reach that point, it'll be too late.

Beside which, in the comment I was referring to greed more in the fact that rents in the High St remain stupidly high as more and more shop space empties. There seems to be little corelation between prices and market forces at the moment. We're led to believe (and it certainly feels like it) that we have less money to spend and yet prices increase.

This is the natural and likely outcome for the future that everyone is trying not to notice. Not a monopoly, but a cabal that is as good as one. With all the money and political power that comes with it.

[Webbo]

This is the natural and likely outcome for the future that everyone is trying not to notice. Not a monopoly, but a cabal that is as good as one. With all the money and political power that comes with it.

But Amazon came from nowhere to dominate online trading, there's no reason why somebody else can't do the same. Facebook was one of the top companies a year ago now they're in decline.

There's no cabal or political plot it's just evolution.

[leicsmac]

But Amazon came from nowhere to dominate online trading, there's no reason why somebody else can't do the same. Facebook was one of the top companies a year ago now they're in decline.

There's no cabal or political plot it's just evolution.

Amazon picked a point in time where Internet trading was just beginning to take off, and used the lack of requirement of bricks and mortar to make a hugely successful business and undercut their competitors selling consumer products, which is an enduring market. This has had a clear effect on the competitors - they've gone out of business. So far, so reasonable. Fair play to them.

But (perhaps this puts me in with the tinfoil-hat wearers here) I think it would be far, far harder for another company to come in and do what Amazon is doing and compete with them in this market than it was for Amazon to come into the market in the first place. I just don't see where the competition (which is what drives capitalism) is going to come from. Now the Internet is already pretty much fully established, I think the market for various goods bought there is close to fixed, and that's not a good thing at all. I think Amazon are going to increase their dominance over this particular market to a pretty much total level. And that's not a good thing either.

I mean, what could an aspiring company offer in competition...lower prices? The food superstores have shown you can't win price wars with bigger companies selling the same products, as a rule.

And that's just one particular market (though probably one of the most widespread). What about the markets for essentials, like food and energy? The energy market and prices in the UK are a joke.

I hope I'm wrong. You could probably offer me reasons why I'm mistaken. I hope so, because they'd be reassurances, not criticisms to me.

[foz.foz]

Another thing along similar lines is the mobile phone market. If its not in "fashion", its not wanted... Samsung, Apple V's Nokia, blackberry