Guardiola to take over at Bayern at the end of the season

[MC Prussian]

I cant help feeling this is a backward step for him.

The Bundesliga is not the big show platform that England and Spain provide.

I can see why he has done it however, Bayern are the big German fish and with Dortmund likely to break up their side and lose their coach he should have a more simple path to trophy glory.

Joining Chelsea would have been looking up at Man Utd and City rather than looking down on everyone at Bayern.

I stopped reading right there.

Anyone who calls a move to the Bundesliga a "backwards step" has no clue whatsoever about how big that league really is.

Germany's highest football league offers high regular attendances, relatively cheap ticket prices as well as very good football and most clubs are doing their utmost to stay competitive both domestically and in Europe without spending beyond their means.

Compare that to the financial state in England, Italy or Spain and you're having one big laugh.

[Babylon]

I stopped reading right there.

Anyone who calls a move to the Bundesliga a "backwards step" has no clue whatsoever about how big that league really is.

Germany's highest football league offers high regular attendances, relatively cheap ticket prices as well as very good football and most clubs are doing their utmost to stay competitive both domestically and in Europe without spending beyond their means.

Compare that to the financial state in England, Italy or Spain and you're having one big laugh.

So basically it offers the same as BPL apart from cheap tickets and clubs with little debt.... both of which don't really mean anything in terms how good a step for him it is.

It's a one horse race for him there at the minute, it should be relatively easy for him to keep up the belief he is some kind of super coach. Lets face it the bloke lucked out with the talent he had available to him at Barca, If he came here there are three teams who can win the league at the moment and it could end up with him losing that tag quite easily.

[Alexikokopops]

I love it when the sky sports generation are baffled because a manager or player chooses a non premiership club.

Me too

Speaking to people you would think he only choices were the Manchester clubs or Chelsea.

I presumed it was more to do with him coming out a couple of days ago saying he wanted to manage in England (rather than just the "Sky Sports Generation")

[Finnegan]

So basically it offers the same as BPL apart from cheap tickets and clubs with little debt.... both of which don't really mean anything in terms how good a step for him it is.

It's a one horse race for him there at the minute, it should be relatively easy for him to keep up the belief he is some kind of super coach. Lets face it the bloke lucked out with the talent he had available to him at Barca, If he came here there are three teams who can win the league at the moment and it could end up with him losing that tag quite easily.

A one horse race? The Bundesliga is probably the most competitive major top flight in Europe.

[Babylon]

A one horse race? The Bundesliga is probably the most competitive major top flight in Europe.

I said at the minute, they are currently 9 points clear!! Where as Chelsea seemingly his main option here sit 13 points behind Man United.

Bayern has won 8 out of the last 14 league title, same as United in this country. So they are about as competitive as our league.

[MC Prussian]

A one horse race? The Bundesliga is probably the most competitive major top flight in Europe.

Especially when that one Bavarian club does a Cardiff City FC in the second half of the season again.

[purpleronnie]

I presumed it was more to do with him coming out a couple of days ago saying he wanted to manage in England (rather than just the "Sky Sports Generation")

he didn't say when though, and what would he say?...nah I really dont want to manage in england ever.

[Mack]

I stopped reading right there.

Anyone who calls a move to the Bundesliga a "backwards step" has no clue whatsoever about how big that league really is.

Germany's highest football league offers high regular attendances, relatively cheap ticket prices as well as very good football and most clubs are doing their utmost to stay competitive both domestically and in Europe without spending beyond their means.

Compare that to the financial state in England, Italy or Spain and you're having one big laugh.

Now step outside of the 'Our Bundesliga is so wonderful' bubble inhabited by Germans and others who would like to see a return to the violent days and in the wider World of Football the German league is looked upon as not dining at the top table of Football.

Why is that? Because the best players and the best Football is played elsewhere quite simply.

Whether you like it or not the big show in Football is in the Premier League and La Liga, the rest is a step down so Guardiola going from Barca to Bayern is a step down.

However I can fully understand why he has done it. Chelsea would have been a genuine test of his abilities whereas at Bayern he should be able to add to his silverware haul without having to stretch his abilities or take a significant risk with his career.

[MC Prussian]

Now step outside of the 'Our Bundesliga is so wonderful' bubble inhabited by Germans and others who would like to see a return to the violent days and in the wider World of Football the German league is looked upon as not dining at the top table of Football.

Why is that? Because the best players and the best Football is played elsewhere quite simply.

Whether you like it or not the big show in Football is in the Premier League and La Liga, the rest is a step down so Guardiola going from Barca to Bayern is a step down.

However I can fully understand why he has done it. Chelsea would have been a genuine test of his abilities whereas at Bayern he should be able to add to his silverware haul without having to stretch his abilities or take a significant risk with his career.

I don't understand why you belittle the Bundesliga so much. It is a great league and in many ways acts as a role model as to how modern football and fandom could/should be.

Besides, there's tons of people outside of Germany supporting this notion (there's a few English Bundesliga fans even on here), people who've actually been there and seen it with their own two eyes.

Also, the recent achievements on the European stage suggest that German clubs are by no means a "pushover" (I guess you'd use that term yourself). Overall, they've come further than English clubs.

Guardiola will be coaching at a club with great player material that can be easily compared to some of England's finest. Bayern are also the most financially stable club in the Bundesliga and hardly ever spend beyond their means (as much as it hurts to say that ).

And there's no guarantee his job will be any easier - the Bavarian club is known for its "hire and fire" mentality, should the sportive success not be achieved in the given time period.

Bayern fans have been spoilt in recent years and decades and demand instant success. And the board is very ambitious, consisting of some of Germany's best footballers from times past (Heynckes, Rummenigge, Breitner, Sammer, Beckenbauer).

The "bubble" you're referring to exists - but elsewhere. If you were to research the financial situations of most clubs in Spain, for instance, you'd definitely change your mind altogether.

La Liga exists on thin ground and the major clubs down there are only able to live on money that isn't their own thanks to government interventions and/or a government that turns a blind eye.

[Corky]

I said at the minute, they are currently 9 points clear!! Where as Chelsea seemingly his main option here sit 13 points behind Man United.

Bayern has won 8 out of the last 14 league title, same as United in this country. So they are about as competitive as our league.

It's hardly a step down then.

He's done well to stay well clear of Chelsea, they'd get bored of him pretty quickly and bring in the next best thing. At Bayern he'll be given much more time.

[Guest MattP]

Now step outside of the 'Our Bundesliga is so wonderful' bubble inhabited by Germans and others who would like to see a return to the violent days and in the wider World of Football the German league is looked upon as not dining at the top table of Football.

Why is that? Because the best players and the best Football is played elsewhere quite simply.

I think the Bundesliga is actually set to overtake the EPL in the UEFA co-efs next year......

[Mack]

I think the Bundesliga is actually set to overtake the EPL in the UEFA co-efs next year......

It cant.

Their financial system stops them being able to compete financially with the Premier League or the might of the big Spanish clubs.

So the top players will continue to be plundered from he Bundesliga and come here or go to Spain.

[Babylon]

It's hardly a step down then.

Bayern is a big club, but no matter how you slice it the Premier and La Liga is where the worlds spotlight falls.

If I was to guess why he took the job there, it would be because the Chelsea job promotes a much higher risk to his reputation.

[Mack]

Bayern is a big club, but no matter how you slice it the Premier and La Liga is where the worlds spotlight falls.

If I was to guess why he took the job there, it would be because the Chelsea job promotes a much higher risk to his reputation.

I agree.

Chelsea is a huge challenge with bigger clubs and a trigger happy owner to negotiate.

Bayern is the big German fish and is tailor made for trophy success.

[Alexikokopops]

he didn't say when though, and what would he say?...nah I really dont want to manage in england ever.

Well he did announce he was going to return to management for next season and then said the whole management in England thing so it's not that inconceivable to put two and two together. I'm just saying the surprise isn't entirely down to the "Sky Sports Generation", as much fun as it is to lay into them. Personally I wouldn't have expected him to go to Chelsea or Man City anyway. Man Utd, yes, but Fergie's not retiring this summer. The only other place I could have seen him was Arsenal but again Wenger's still going there and most likely will be next season.

[Babylon]

Well he did announce he was going to return to management for next season and then said the whole management in England thing so it's not that inconceivable to put two and two together. I'm just saying the surprise isn't entirely down to the "Sky Sports Generation", as much fun as it is to lay into them. Personally I wouldn't have expected him to go to Chelsea or Man City anyway. Man Utd, yes, but Fergie's not retiring this summer. The only other place I could have seen him was Arsenal but again Wenger's still going there and most likely will be next season.

Couple of seasons of success at Bayern = Man United job on a plate when Fergie retires.

Although I don't know why, but I just can't picture anyone but Moyes being at Man U.

[Alexikokopops]

Couple of seasons of success at Bayern = Man United job on a plate when Fergie retires.

Although I don't know why, but I just can't picture anyone but Moyes being at Man U.

So he's using Bayern, an easy club to manage to success, to keep his stock easily high in preparation for the Man Utd job? Don't let Ronnie see that, he'll be apoplectic

[Babylon]

So he's using Bayern, an easy club to manage to success, to keep his stock easily high in preparation for the Man Utd job? Don't let Ronnie see that, he'll be apoplectic

I don't think he's doing it to get that job, I think he would stand a much better chance of getting it with success there on top of Barca though.

[Guest ttfn]

I don't think this is really a great example of the German league's rising status, as much as that is undoubtedly the case.

Bayern transcend German football - they are a European superpower. Realistically at this moment in time the only clubs on that level are Barcelona, Real Madrid and Manchester United.

He's just left 1, can't really manage another and the United job is reserved for Ferguson indefinitely. It's all in the timing - Heynckesvjust happens to be leaving Bayern this summer and Pep is free.

You can bet your bottom dollar that had the United job been available this summer he'd have taken it.

[Guest MattP]

It cant.

Their financial system stops them being able to compete financially with the Premier League or the might of the big Spanish clubs.

So the top players will continue to be plundered from he Bundesliga and come here or go to Spain.

There is a 2,500 difference and when 2008-2009 drops out we lose 3,500 on the Germans, our sides will have to considerably outperform theirs in Europe this season for us to hold onto the number two spot.

http://en.wikipedia....EFA_coefficient

as for the financial system stopping them competing with the Premier League or Spains big clubs?.............

1 Borussia Dortmund 6 4 2 0 11 5 6 14

2 Real Madrid 6 3 2 1 15 9 6 11

3 Ajax 6 1 1 4 8 16 -8 4

4 Man City 6 0 3 3 7 11 -4 3

[Babylon]

There is a 2,500 difference and when 2008-2009 drops out we lose 3,500 on the Germans, our sides will have to considerably outperform theirs in Europe this season for us to hold onto the number two spot.

http://en.wikipedia....EFA_coefficient

as for the financial system stopping them competing with the Premier League or Spains big clubs?.............

1 Borussia Dortmund 6 4 2 0 11 5 6 14

2 Real Madrid 6 3 2 1 15 9 6 11

3 Ajax 6 1 1 4 8 16 -8 4

4 Man City 6 0 3 3 7 11 -4 3

He said competing financially.

Until they can, then big names will mostly come here rather than there. Foreign fans will continue to watch us and La Liga over the Bundes', and jobs in the premier will look better than those in Germany.

[Guest MattP]

He said competing financially.

He was replying to a point regarding the Bundesliga overtaking the PL in the UEFA rankings.

[Miquel The Work Geordie]

...the German league is looked upon as not dining at the top table of Football.

Why is that? Because the best players and the best Football is played elsewhere quite simply.

I must've missed the last few months where Man City failed miserably in the Champions League (in a group that included a German side), Arsenal limped through their group (which again included a German side) and Chelsea, the defending champions of Europe, were completely shown up in their European effort. And that's dining at the top table, is it? Having your domestic champions feebly exit after round one - great stuff.

In terms of quality, talent and excitement, the Bundesliga is most definitely catching up with the Premier League - if it hasn't already. The whole issue is less to do with the lustre of the Premier League fading and more to do with the rise in quality from Germany over the past few seasons. Just because the English game throws cash around recklessly - does it means we can attract the best players, or are PL sides merely paying over the odds for average ones? Loic Remy hasn't scored a single league goal for Marseille this season, and, by all accounts (ie - French journalists on Twitter ) has been dog awful. QPR give him 75k a week. That's not excitement, that's taking a player in bang average form and paying him a king's ransom - having the league with the most cash doesn't necessarily mean the best talent if the moolah is squandered.

I'm sure if you picked a Bundesliga XI and a Premier League XI, they'd not be poles apart. And I'd bet my house (well, flat) that the German side would be a better watch, too.

[Babylon]

And that's dining at the top table.

What are the global viewing figures for the prem and the bund?

Because until they get close, whether you like it or not, globally it will not be looked at as favourably as the prem is.

There will be peaks and troughs of success, but cash is usually King unfortunately.

[Guest ttfn]

I must've missed the last few months where Man City failed miserably in the Champions League (in a group that included a German side), Arsenal limped through their group (which again included a German side) and Chelsea, the defending champions of Europe, were completely shown up in their European effort. And that's dining at the top table, is it? Having your domestic champions feebly exit after round one - great stuff.

In terms of quality, talent and excitement, the Bundesliga is most definitely catching up with the Premier League - if it hasn't already. The whole issue is less to do with the lustre of the Premier League fading and more to do with the rise in quality from Germany over the past few seasons. Just because the English game throws cash around recklessly - does it means we can attract the best players, or are PL sides merely paying over the odds for average ones? Loic Remy hasn't scored a single league goal for Marseille this season, and, by all accounts (ie - French journalists on Twitter ) has been dog awful. QPR give him 75k a week. That's not excitement, that's taking a player in bang average form and paying him a king's ransom - having the league with the most cash doesn't necessarily mean the best talent if the moolah is squandered.

I'm sure if you picked a Bundesliga XI and a Premier League XI, they'd not be poles apart. And I'd bet my house (well, flat) that the German side would be a better watch, too.

We've got some pretty exciting players in the Premier League. You could put out a team of:

Cech

Zabaleta

Vidic

Kompany

Baines

Lucas

Toure

Mata

Rooney

Bale

Van Persie

That would be pretty exciting to watch, Schweinsteiger and co. not withstanding.

Lets not bash the Premier League for the sake of it.