Babylon Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 I undertand what he means - the players body language suggests a lack of belief.... I thought it was really obvious last night that we lacked ideas and belief and the player's body language suggested that too. I agree with what you said, but you used words that have little relation to MD. The way I read it was that they were in some way not happy with Pearson and that they weren't trying because of it. They just looked like any bunch of players currently having a bad patch. Lacking in confidence and shit scared to make mistakes that would lead to the inevitable boo brigade jumping on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 No not really..... Just trying to get people to understand that although NFP is, in overall term, a pretty successful manager for us, he is human (not mustelidae has as been suggested) and actually not perfect at everything...... I don't think anyone has said he is perfect. Thing is he could be doing the things you said, it's something we'll not know either way unless someone took over and used exactly the same players but achieved more with them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
5waller5 Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 I agree with what you said, but you used words that have little relation to MD. The way I read it was that they were in some way not happy with Pearson and that they weren't trying because of it. They just looked like any bunch of players currently having a bad patch. Lacking in confidence and shit scared to make mistakes that would lead to the inevitable boo brigade jumping on them. Yeah they did look like they are a nervous and tentative bunch that lack confidence..... that's NP's job to give though isn't it??? I know he tries that with his "right behind my players" dull monotony that comes out his mouth everytime he speaks .... But maybe they are as convinced as me by his leadership style? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Yeah they did look like they are a nervous and tentative bunch that lack confidence..... that's NP's job to give though isn't it??? Up to a point, but you're dealing with human emotion here of a relatively young and inexperienced team. He's not Derren Brown. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MrSpaM Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 He's not Derren Brown. NP OUT! DB IN! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fox1norfolk Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Yeah they did look like they are a nervous and tentative bunch that lack confidence..... that's NP's job to give though isn't it??? I know he tries that with his "right behind my players" dull monotony that comes out his mouth everytime he speaks .... But maybe they are as convinced as me by his leadership style? Has he 'lost the dressing room' ? and why is Schupp being (valued £2 million by MUFC) not playing for us, we need a bit of inspriration now! Of the 11 games left 7 are against the top teams in the division and as we now struggle with clubs at the lower end, unfortunately I don't think even the play-offs are possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 and why is Schupp being (valued £2 million by MUFC) not playing for us, we need a bit of inspriration now! Because they are paying for potential and potential only, he has proven nothing. He will not suddenly play for their first team. He will be in their development side and will in all probability get loaned out. Not much different from what would have happened here. Prior to United wanting to take a look barely anyone gave a shit about him and would have been happy for him to be farmed out to league one on loan. Now he's suddenly some wunderkind that Pearson is a retard for not playing in every game. He was average up front, barely made an impact from the bench... ever! and showed some promise at left back. That about sums up all he did. The club knows he has potential, if they didn't he wouldn't even be around the first team, but we are in a difficult position when it comes to being able to nurture him when we're in a promotion scrap. unfortunately I don't think even the play-offs are possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hackneyfox Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 They just looked like any bunch of players currently having a bad patch. Lacking in confidence and shit scared to make mistakes that would lead to the inevitable boo brigade jumping on them. Please don't blame the fans for our current 'blip'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbelladave Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 I don't think anyone has said he is perfect. Thing is he could be doing the things you said, it's something we'll not know either way unless someone took over and used exactly the same players but achieved more with them. Of couse he is not perfect, neither is he crap. As to whether anyone else would have done better is impossible to tell...... What we can do as fans, is to look at what we see (on the pitch) and draw our conclusions and discus them on here and elsewhere. I do believe that, in general terms, NFP has improved the club massively in the 18 months since his return yet I do not see why that fact should absolve him of all blame when things go wrong. Up to a point, but you're dealing with human emotion here of a relatively young and inexperienced team. He's not Derren Brown. Meaningless post..... More to the point is the fact that he is not Billy Davies...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Please don't blame the fans for our current 'blip'. Who blamed the sodding fans? But do you seriously think it plays no part at all when out of form and low on confidence players get turned on by the fans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 yet I do not see why that fact should absolve him of all blame when things go wrong. Has anyone said it does? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kitchandro Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 I think the point about the players being inexperienced is a good one. However, I do think Pearson has had the opportunity to bring in more experience in certain positions this season. For example could we have used one in the centre? And I do feel Knockaert, as much as he isn't the complete package, would be more effective more often in the centre. Or at least on the right (the problem with that is we have to shift Marshall onto the left). It's all very well having faith in young players but in some ways we've taken big risks with that faith. When they have not performed we have rarely had anyone to come off the bench with similar quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Meaningless post..... Why is it meaningless, if human emotion was so easy to control England wouldn't bottle it at pennos every two years, tennis players wouldn't suddenly fall apart when at set point etc etc. The older and more experienced you get the better you can deal with situations. And if Davies was so Brilliant he'd have stopped his team bottling it in the play offs each year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbelladave Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Has anyone said it does? I think so, not in so many words though..... I have been using the word 'blame' in a couple of post recently, I should not have done that....... I criticise NFP when I think he is at fault but generally speaking I do not try and 'blame' any individual. A football team is a complex dynamic involving players, management and to a degree fans and all we actually know is what we see on the pitch. I talked about poor body language (which I thought very obvious last night) but I do not have any idea why that is, maybe it is just a reaction to our poor form, maybe something deeper, like I said, I don't know........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dynamark Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 For sure Knocky is better central or on the right some cracking link/overlap with de lait very effective coming in on his left(only)foot.Marshall less effective on the left possibly dare I say dyer a better option and maybe its just me but I saw some lovely confident play between dyer and jeff schlupp.Never get the best out of the Knock on the left wing/mid role.Knockys close quarter work is his strength,draws defenders to him and gives confidence to others to play footy on the floor. Im not the manager though .One win in six in the league 1 in 8 overall some reaction required right through the club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finnegan Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Fatigue and confidence. Small, young squad - it's going to happen. Otherwise not a debate here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbelladave Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Why is it meaningless, if human emotion was so easy to control England wouldn't bottle it at pennos every two years, tennis players wouldn't suddenly fall apart when at set point etc etc. The older and more experienced you get the better you can deal with situations. And if Davies was so Brilliant he'd have stopped his team bottling it in the play offs each year. It is meaningless for the obvious reason, he is not a football manager. Billy Davies though is, and since we were talking about what a different manager might do with the same (well very similar) set of players, his turnaround at Forest, achieved in a matter of days, is sensational....... And please stop putting words in my mouth, I did not say Billy Davies is brilliant, just that he is a rather more relevant point of comparison in the current discussion than some stage magician..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Fox Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 We need some experience to help us in the run in finance permitting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col city fan Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 I think so, not in so many words though..... I have been using the word 'blame' in a couple of post recently, I should not have done that....... I criticise NFP when I think he is at fault but generally speaking I do not try and 'blame' any individual. A football team is a complex dynamic involving players, management and to a degree fans and all we actually know is what we see on the pitch. I talked about poor body language (which I thought very obvious last night) but I do not have any idea why that is, maybe it is just a reaction to our poor form, maybe something deeper, like I said, I don't know........ I bought this up in another thread. The lads just didn't look very happy last night. Nuge was having a few rants at the ref again wasn't he? In my mind, the 'best' David Nugent is the 'happy' David Nugent. He plays with swagger, he's a jack-the-lad and his enthusiasm is infectious. Last night, that was all missing... He was back to his running down blind entries and was obviously pissed off. Chris Wood too looked a shadow of the player we know he can be. He too didn't look happy. I might be barking up the wrong proverbial tree, but this psychology IS important. Compared to how so many of the players looked just a month or so ago, the chirpiness last night was all gone. Finally, the Knocky we have seen over the past few weeks vis a vis the Knocky we saw just after Christmas time are simply two different players. Paradoxically, it seems that Nige has taken the 'hide Knocky' thread too literally... Saturday is now pretty much a must-win game, not in terms of points but in terms of regaining confidence. I'd like to see two things.. A more controlled performance and Pearson being bothered to enlighten the fans about his decisions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbelladave Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 We need some experience to help us in the run in finance permitting. Fair call, though personally I think it is a bit too late unless we can get someone truly outstanding, such a person would only have 1 or 2 games to turn things around..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Col city fan Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Fatigue and confidence. Small, young squad - it's going to happen. Otherwise not a debate here. If its 'going to happen' and you want to achieve promotion, don't you as the manager do something to stop if from happening? ie. introduce some experienced heads into the squad. What's the manager being paid for? Simply to accept that his squad will falter because it doesn't comprise enough of a skill-mix? It looks like Lambert is taking Villa down this season for exactly this reason? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Babylon Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 It is meaningless for the obvious reason, he is not a football manager. Billy Davies though is, and since we were talking about what a different manager might do with the same (well very similar) set of players, his turnaround at Forest, achieved in a matter of days, is sensational....... And please stop putting words in my mouth, I did not say Billy Davies is brilliant, just that he is a rather more relevant point of comparison in the current discussion than some stage magician..... You were talking about Derren Brown? Jesus Christ, is this place so devoid of humour that you actually took that seriously. It would be less sensational had they not spent more than us in the summer, really he's just got them performing at the level people expected them to be at... in fact a large number tipped them to finish above us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bettsj2 Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Why are people shocked at the players having negative body language? They're in a poor run of form and the fans have turned on them and the management. Do you really expect them to come skipping out of the tunnel with a massive grin on their faces? And if they did, how many threads would there be about them not giving a shit? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marbelladave Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 You were talking about Derren Brown? Jesus Christ, is this place so devoid of humour that you actually took that seriously. It would be less sensational had they not spent more than us in the summer, really he's just got them performing at the level people expected them to be at... in fact a large number tipped them to finish above us. You need some 'humour practice. I just took it as one of your usual attempts at a putdown...... Again not relevant. He took a group of players who were playing very poorly and losing and turned them into winners virtually overnight, what their actual 'level' is is not the point in this case, it is the difference that matters...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Cash Posted 6 March 2013 Share Posted 6 March 2013 Be quiet little boy, just stating the facts that Nugent with us is having the best two seasons of his career, last night I thought he played like a player returning from injury. If your seriously questioning Our top scorer then you are really an eejit as you so beautifully put it. Little boy? Do you know how old Johnny Cash is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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