catfordfox Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Anyone on here heard anything about this, or knows anyone who's had to do it? Sounds like the club have been taking people on mandatory workfare (people forced to work for free, or else will lose all benefits etc) and making them clean seats for six hours. http://www.boycottworkfare.org/?p=2913 Not very happy about this - the amount of money the club has, if there's a job that needs doing, they should pay someone to do it, not make unemployed youngsters do it for free at pain of having their only means of survival cut off. According to this (http://www.lsr-online.org/reports/unemployment_bulletin_june_2013/download/1/June%202013.pdf), there's a 14.4% unemployment rate in Leicester at the moment. I don't think the club should be exploiting its local community like this - the club only exists because of the fans. It should be helping local people during a recession, not taking advantage of unemployment levels and huge competition for jobs to get work done for free (subsidised by the state in effect) by using what amounts to forced labour. How is cleaning seats useful 'work experience'? You don't need experience to do that, or stack shelves in Tescos etc, its ridiculous. Even worse if theyre treating people badly, and if people are threatened with homelessness and going to food banks if they don't comply. By using workfare, the club can cut hours for employed staff, use zero hour contracts, or get rid of staff altogether. If they can afford to pay Konchesky, Wellens etc thousands a week to sit on the bench or in the stands, they can afford to pay people at least minimum wage to clear up the ground after a game etc. Anyway, would be interested to know what you thought about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc_star Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 "Work for free else lose benefits" Eh? Bit of a contradiction Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 I don't know about the rights and wrongs of this scheme whether due to how much you earn etc is exploitation but i would argue that it is still work experience. for example: Working in a team Working to instructions Attendance Effort, doing a good job no matter how 'shit' it is Understanding what committing to a 'job' requires in terms of sacrificing your personal wants I firmly believe that everyone whatever their status should and would benefit from doing a stint at some of the most mind numbing tasks that people have to endure with the hope that they remember what it was like when they eventually reach a position of influence over those very same or similar jobs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Its a scheme to build work ethic and experience, if all these people would do is sit on their arses at home then i dont see the problem. The club have probably created these jobs for this scheme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfordfox Posted 27 August 2013 Author Share Posted 27 August 2013 Jobseekers is given to you when you lose your job. It's about £65 a week. Working 6.5 hours for five days a week for £65 = £2 an hour, £4 an hour less than minimum wage. Why should anyone be made to work for that? Minimum wage is barely enough to survive as it is. If there's a job that needs doing, the club should pay someone to do it - at minimum wage at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 From my experience if these people weren't cleaning the seats they wouldn't be cleaned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lcfc278 Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Spot on - I respect the club for doing this. There are too many people in leicester doing nothing and sitting on the dole. Majority of these people should be made to do something to earn it - at the same time as learning these skills and getting work experience. Peoria should t expect things for free and if I ended up losing my job and being on the dole for too long - i would expect to do something like this myself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Maybe our owner needs a few at his Polo farm also?! This is a highly political issue that people will take sides on based on their beliefs. Personally I can see both sides of the coin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Jobseekers is given to you when you lose your job. It's about £65 a week. Working 6.5 hours for five days a week for £65 = £2 an hour, £4 an hour less than minimum wage. Why should anyone be made to work for that? Minimum wage is barely enough to survive as it is. If there's a job that needs doing, the club should pay someone to do it - at minimum wage at least. check put the rates for apprentiships etc, its not quite exploitation. Being on benifits should not be an easy option, it should be worse than work otherwise there is no incentive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicester_Numan Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Jobseekers is given to you when you lose your job. It's about £65 a week. Working 6.5 hours for five days a week for £65 = £2 an hour, £4 an hour less than minimum wage. Why should anyone be made to work for that? Minimum wage is barely enough to survive as it is. If there's a job that needs doing, the club should pay someone to do it - at minimum wage at least. You're forgetting about housing benefit, council tax benefit, free prescriptions and any child benefits they may be getting so it's substantially more than £2 an hour but still less than minimum wage for most people forced to do it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfordfox Posted 27 August 2013 Author Share Posted 27 August 2013 Anyone who is made unemployed - and let's face it, that could be any of us at the moment - could end up being forced to work on these schemes. There was a case a few months ago of a woman who was already working on a voluntary basis for her local museum (she wanted to work in that area) being forced to give that up and stack shelves for Poundland or else face having her only means of survival cut off. Where's the sense in that? Seems to me that the government's intention with this scheme is try to keep wages as low as possible in order to increase profits and make it look like the economy is having some kind of 'recovery' - why should people have to work on zero hour contracts, or have their jobs replaced by people forced to work for free? The club should be supporting the local economy, not making it worse. A 14% unemployment rate is pretty high - and i dont buy into all this 'scroungers' rubbish. In 2006, unemployment in Leicester was less than 10%. There's no way that 4% of the population thought in 2007, around the same time as the financial crash, 'fck it, i can't be arsed to work anymore' - they lost their jobs because of the recession. The club shouldn't be taking advantage of that imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Mind you these sort of jobs are only work experience for those that have never worked. for those that have experienced work I guess it's more to do with showing some commitment and that you can be relied on rather than learning anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfordfox Posted 27 August 2013 Author Share Posted 27 August 2013 You're forgetting about housing benefit, council tax benefit, free prescriptions and any child benefits they may be getting so it's substantially more than £2 an hour but still less than minimum wage for most people forced to do it surely the point is, if you want to cut the welfare budget, get people proper jobs - not make it even harder for those in work, becuase they now have to compete with the people being forced to work for nothing on these schemes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lesta Legend Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Its a scheme to build work ethic and experience, if all these people would do is sit on their arses at home then i dont see the problem. The club have probably created these jobs for this scheme. Indeed People who can work should work, the only exploitation is from the people that exploit a system that allows people to live off the taxes of hard working people, this is lefty logic for you. There are jobs out there, just not jobs that they want to do and any that pay better than benefits on offer. Shouldn't this be general discussion ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 I guess getting a job is an alternative. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Libertine Dream Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Blame financial fair play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Anyone who is made unemployed - and let's face it, that could be any of us at the moment - could end up being forced to work on these schemes. There was a case a few months ago of a woman who was already working on a voluntary basis for her local museum (she wanted to work in that area) being forced to give that up and stack shelves for Poundland or else face having her only means of survival cut off. Where's the sense in that? Seems to me that the government's intention with this scheme is try to keep wages as low as possible in order to increase profits and make it look like the economy is having some kind of 'recovery' - why should people have to work on zero hour contracts, or have their jobs replaced by people forced to work for free? The club should be supporting the local economy, not making it worse. A 14% unemployment rate is pretty high - and i dont buy into all this 'scroungers' rubbish. In 2006, unemployment in Leicester was less than 10%. There's no way that 4% of the population thought in 2007, around the same time as the financial crash, 'fck it, i can't be arsed to work anymore' - they lost their jobs because of the recession. The club shouldn't be taking advantage of that imo If i lost my job i would be happy to do it, i dont expect money for nothing. Who knows if you show good application and attitude the respective employer might find you a permenant position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfordfox Posted 27 August 2013 Author Share Posted 27 August 2013 SO IndeedPeople who can work should work, the only exploitation is from the people that exploit a system that allows people to live off the taxes of hard working people, this is lefty logic for you.There are jobs out there, just not jobs that they want to do and any that pay better than benefits on offer.Shouldn't this be general discussion ? Sorry if its the wrong forum, thought it did concern the club directly. The club is the one 'living off the taxes of hardworking people' here - theyre getting work done for nothing, while the state continues to pay JSA! There are really not that many jobs out there - this is worth a read i think: http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/hope-and-despair-at-the-watford-jobfair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cc_star Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 Anyone who is made unemployed - and let's face it, that could be any of us at the moment - could end up being forced to work on these schemes. There was a case a few months ago of a woman who was already working on a voluntary basis for her local museum (she wanted to work in that area) being forced to give that up and stack shelves for Poundland or else face having her only means of survival cut off. Where's the sense in that? Seems to me that the government's intention with this scheme is try to keep wages as low as possible in order to increase profits and make it look like the economy is having some kind of 'recovery' - why should people have to work on zero hour contracts, or have their jobs replaced by people forced to work for free? The club should be supporting the local economy, not making it worse. A 14% unemployment rate is pretty high - and i dont buy into all this 'scroungers' rubbish. In 2006, unemployment in Leicester was less than 10%. There's no way that 4% of the population thought in 2007, around the same time as the financial crash, 'fck it, i can't be arsed to work anymore' - they lost their jobs because of the recession. The club shouldn't be taking advantage of that imo Having been made unemployed in 2008 I spent some time milling around, lying to my wife & to myself I'd sort it out next week & really knuckle down and get back into employment then when Monday came it would always be tomorrow & so on & on. It's very easy to lose work ethic & then the skills needed to be employable at all (one of the reasons so many low skilled & entry level jobs are filled by economic migrants who can be arsed to work) Then when I was out of work for a while the job seekers & various other benefits add up you believe that work doesn't pay. I wish there was a scheme like this around when I slipped into a malaise - It would have been either the 'stick' I needed to seriously look to return to work, or at the least it would have broke the sofa habit that so many out of work suffer from thinking the world owes them a living & lying to themselves about how hard they were really trying to fill one of the tens of thousands of vacancies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfordfox Posted 27 August 2013 Author Share Posted 27 August 2013 If i lost my job i would be happy to do it, i dont expect money for nothing. Who knows if you show good application and attitude the respective employer might find you a permenant position. I've emailed the club to ask them how many people have been offered a permanent position after completing the mandatory placement, so i guess we'll see. I do know that nationally, its very very few, less than 3% i think. in fact, the government's own research shows that the mandatory schemes have no impact on likelihood of getting a job http://www.theguardian.com/society/2012/jun/13/mandatory-work-scheme-government-research Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leicester_Numan Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 surely the point is, if you want to cut the welfare budget, get people proper jobs - not make it even harder for those in work, becuase they now have to compete with the people being forced to work for nothing on these schemesI agree with you I was just pointing out that it's not just JSA that people are being forced to work for.Most of these kind of work experience placements were confined to charitable organisations in the past as they couldn't afford to pay staff, but proper businesses that can afford it should not be using the system in this way to avoid paying wages and make more profit. That just stinks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strokes Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 SO Sorry if its the wrong forum, thought it did concern the club directly. The club is the one 'living off the taxes of hardworking people' here - theyre getting work done for nothing, while the state continues to pay JSA! There are really not that many jobs out there - this is worth a read i think: http://www.vice.com/en_uk/read/hope-and-despair-at-the-watford-jobfair Prospective employers would be more likely to take someone who has been on a scheme like this, than one who has not. For those that have never had a job it gives them the oppurtunity to gain positive references/CV's. Its a very good idea and i see no negatives, if you are too concerned sellotape a fiver under seat as a tip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kylestyle06 Posted 27 August 2013 Share Posted 27 August 2013 There is a job out there for everyone... honestly. People who sit at home moaning about having no work are not trying hard enough Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfordfox Posted 27 August 2013 Author Share Posted 27 August 2013 I agree with you I was just pointing out that it's not just JSA that people are being forced to work for. Most of these kind of work experience placements were confined to charitable organisations in the past as they couldn't afford to pay staff, but proper businesses that can afford it should not be using the system in this way to avoid paying wages and make more profit. That just stinks ah right - and yeah, agree entirely. Still don't think charities should do it either, unless its genuinely volunatary (ie without threat of sanctions) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
catfordfox Posted 27 August 2013 Author Share Posted 27 August 2013 There is a job out there for everyone... honestly. People who sit at home moaning about having no work are not trying hard enough not true - at the moment there's around 5/6 unemployed people for every job vacancy http://www.theguardian.com/politics/reality-check-with-polly-curtis/2012/feb/06/jobs-shortage-maria-miller Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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