The European Union

[Strokes]

Put it this way Strokes. If Labour were to remain wedded to the EU project, I still wouldn't go running to put my cross by a UKIP candidate.

How far could you stray, if at all?

[l444ry]

How far could you stray, if at all?

 

I would have to stray a bit to the right just to vote Labour to be honest. Nothing to the Right of them remotely would interest me at all unless tactical voting came into play.                                  

[Strokes]

I would have to stray a bit to the right just to vote Labour to be honest. Nothing to the Right of them remotely would interest me at all unless tactical voting came into play.

What i am trying to establish is, is there room for a UKIP type party but with a left wing approach. Would they be able to establish a foothold on that side of the political spectrum, or is the EU membership such a side issue, that you wouldnt see enough interest?

[Guest MattP]

Put it this way Strokes. If Labour were to remain wedded to the EU project, I still wouldn't go running to put my cross by a UKIP candidate.

 

So as someone who wants to pull out of the EU and is left leaning, who does your vote go to in the European Elections?

[Littletoe]

I would like to stay in the EU, as I think a very high percentage of European people are intelligent, civil and genuine, something we as British should establish a strong connection with. But they're so many negatives and exploits, I can't be arsed to go further in depth. I voted out, for now. But I'm hoping when we develop a real backbone and demand a respectable status in the EU government, my opinion will change. They have a stronger effect of the free market, which we are a massive part of. So in essence, a good percentage of our future, could lie in their hands, which I sort of trust more than any other continent/religious unions. But I can't help but think from time to time we are being undermined.

 

[l444ry]

So as someone who wants to pull out of the EU and is left leaning, who does your vote go to in the European Elections?

Labour. At least they can join with the other "Socialists" within Europe.

[l444ry]

What i am trying to establish is, is there room for a UKIP type party but with a left wing approach. Would they be able to establish a foothold on that side of the political spectrum, or is the EU membership such a side issue, that you wouldnt see enough interest?

The latter Strokes. Single issue Parties don't make much headway when push comes to shove.

[Strokes]

The latter Strokes. Single issue Parties don't make much headway when push comes to shove.

The way I see it is, it forces your party of origin to take on the matter at the risk of losing votes. Few people will actually sway from left to right but can use smaller parties that pick up on a 'bigger issue'.

[ARTY_FOX]

There is obviously benefits for it but we would be better off out imo. I hate that a "European rule" can over rule what we all believe is right.

[MC Prussian]

Hmm… I wonder what the European Union will do to Hungary, now that the country has turned to Moscow for help?

Hungarian MPs approve Russia nuclear deal

 

Hungarian lawmakers have approved a controversial Russian-financed plan to construct two new reactors at the country's only nuclear plant.

Under the deal, Russia will lend Hungary up to 10bn euros (£8.3bn) to build the reactors in the city of Paks.

The government says the bill - which was passed by 256 to 29 votes - will reduce reliance on foreign sources.

But critics argue it will make Hungary fully dependent on Russia, which is already its main oil and gas supplier.

The European Union also expressed concern over the deal's lack of transparency and fair competition.

There was no formal bidding process for the plant's expansion, and the terms of the loan agreement have not yet been made public.

'Against national interest'

The deal was approved by MPs from the governing Fidesz party and the far-right Jobbik party.

Hungarian opposition leader Gordon Bajnai said the agreement was "against the national interest" and would "give up Hungary's independence".

He has called on President Janos Ader to not sign the bill into law.

Correspondents say the expansion of Paks has emerged as an important issue in the 6 April general election.

Three protests were held in the lead-up to the vote, with the opposition Socialists moving away from their traditional pro-nuclear position, to join other opposition parties in a call for a referendum on the agreement.

Public opinion surveys show the country remains divided over nuclear energy.

Prime Minister Viktor Orban struck the agreement with Russian President Vladimir Putin in January.

The pact allows Russia's atomic energy corporation, Rosatom, to build the reactors in Paks, which lies around 100km (60 miles) south of the capital, Budapest.

It also stipulates that Russia will loan Hungary around 80% of the estimated construction cost.

The nuclear power station on the River Danube currently comprises four Soviet-built reactors, which came online between 1982 and 1987.

It generates some 40% of the Hungary's electricity supply.

The upgrade would increase production from 2,000 to 4,400 megawatts, with the reactors scheduled to begin operation in 2023.

The government said it expected the project to boost Hungary's economic growth and create up to 10,000 jobs.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-26072303

[The Doctor]

There is obviously benefits for it but we would be better off out imo. I hate that a "European rule" can over rule what we all believe is right.

 

You do realise that european rule is decided by every country and their MEP's. Maybe if UKIP actually used their seats in the european parliament rather than being the pointless jebends they are, that european rule could be better of for us. 

 

Frankly, we're better off in the EU than out. UKIP's leave the EU but magically keep all the trade deals idea is as fanciful as Scotlands leave the UK but keep the pound idea.

[Guest MattP]

You do realise that european rule is decided by every country and their MEP's. Maybe if UKIP actually used their seats in the european parliament rather than being the pointless jebends they are, that european rule could be better of for us. 

 

Frankly, we're better off in the EU than out. UKIP's leave the EU but magically keep all the trade deals idea is as fanciful as Scotlands leave the UK but keep the pound idea.

 

Except it isn't is it? Do you really believe BMW will stop selling us cars or Thales radar and commincations if we left the EU?

 

Of course they wouldn't, hence why no one in the actual pro-EU argument is even bothering to bring it up as an excuse anymore, to compare it to a country trying to keep a currency that isn't theirs is ridiculous.

 

You have enough decent pro EU arguments out there without resorting to lies and scaremongering.

[ADK]

We would lose out though. It's not going to be a case of BMW refusing to sell us cars but it might be a case of European companies looking less favourably at siting their operations in the UK.

[Captain...]

We would lose out though. It's not going to be a case of BMW refusing to sell us cars but it might be a case of European companies looking less favourably at siting their operations in the UK.

 

On the flip side, non EU companies might want to invest in us as we could be seen as a way into europe without being involved in the Eurozone, I found this summary of the key points quite interesting:

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/what-if-britain-left-the-eu-7904469.html

 

I think when the Doctor talks about our trade deals though, he is referring to the fact all of our existing trade agreements will probably need to change, we don't know what sort of export and import tariffs will be imposed by the UK, or by other EU countries, or whether we would be able to join Norway and Iceland in the EFTA. There are so many unknowns that I don't believe anyone can seriously consider voting to leave the EU, without knowing where we will stand should we leave, what our Government and the EU would do about things like immigration and trade agreements and existing business ties.

 

If the vote was to become a member of the EFTA with a view to working with the EU and maintaining trade links, with a sustainable and sensible immigration policy, giving us control to sort out our own mess and maybe trying to find a solution that satisfies our needs as well as their overall goals to at some point re-join the EU, then I could vote for that.

 

But with currently no plans or policies or guarantees in place should we leave, then I don't understand how anyone can even consider voting to leave at this point.

[Guest]

looking at the votes they were mostly easy to guess - even the "on the fence"ers.

[ADK]

looking at the votes they were mostly easy to guess - even the "on the fence"ers.

 

Well done.

[absolutelegend]

I've not seen many, if at all any, decent arguments for the UK being in the EU yet.

 

Never say never though.

[Captain...]

I've not seen many, if at all any, decent arguments for the UK being in the EU yet.

 

Never say never though.

 

Have a read through this a condensed and attempting to be unbiased summary of the key issues.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/what-if-britain-left-the-eu-7904469.html

 

The main ones for me is that as part of the EU we have a much stronger collective voice, than if we were on our own, but then if we are dissenting against the collective voice then it doesn't really help us or the EU.

 

Don't be fooled by all the negative stories that we haven't benefitted from being in the EU, as you know newspapers rarely publish good news, all the good things that have happened are now established parts of everyday life, such as the freedom for UK citizens to live and work anywhere in the EU, the ability to trade within the EU without incurring import taxes. Even the fact we have largely moved away from the antiquated and illogical imperial system was down to the EU. (Not that we would be forced to move back if we left). Likewise things like roaming and mobile phone charges when abroad were targetted and capped by the EU, they also want to cap things like bankers bonuses. They are also working on legislation to cut the amount banks charge for credit card transactions, reducing costs for retailers that could hopefully see lower prices.

 

In this global age the fact that it is so easy to trade within the EU has benefitted our economy, but seeing as we import more than we export any import/export tariffs would hit us financially.

 

The freedom of movement is also a massive plus for many of us, just imagine the amount of extra hassle it will be when we qualify for the Europa League next season if we are no longer a part of the EU, and we would also have to start dicking around with work permits for Knocky, Mahrez and Kasper.

 

There are positives and negatives associated with the EU, but the change to our lives from leaving it would be a lot bigger than people think, it would not just be a simple case of well now we can do what we want, we would also have to spend a lot time tightening up any loopholes left open when we stop being bound by EU legislation.

 

Finally any attempt to rejoin the EU at a later date, which I am sure would be the aim of the Labour party, would require some serious concessions on the rights we managed to keep hold of when it first started.

[Captain...]

Further good stuff by the eu: drinking water standards, all eu countries now have safe clean drinking water on tap. I remember going on holiday to Spain as a kid and being told not to drink the tap water. Unthinkable now, but that change was brought about by the EU.

[Guest MattP]

The freedom of movement is also a massive plus for many of us, just imagine the amount of extra hassle it will be when we qualify for the Europa League next season if we are no longer a part of the EU, and we would also have to start dicking around with work permits for Knocky, Mahrez and Kasper.

 

Given the fact we only have three players who would need them compared to other sides surely we would greatly benefit from withdrawing from the EU? (Reality it's irrelevent though, entertainment business would as it was back then be bypassed if the player was any good)

 

Can't remember how old you were but when we used to go to Spain before the freedom of movement laws it was probably even easier, you generally threw your passport at a bloke holding a cigar and he waved you through without even looking at your face.

 

Common sense ruled back then, we didn't need laws and checks to make a decision on who you let into the country, same as we didn't start searching 90 year grannies at airports to make sure we were compliant with various bizarre equality laws.

 

I'd love to go back to those times, common sense was really underrated looking back.

[Guest MattP]

Further good stuff by the eu: drinking water standards, all eu countries now have safe clean drinking water on tap. I remember going on holiday to Spain as a kid and being told not to drink the tap water. Unthinkable now, but that change was brought about by the EU.

 

Most people still recommend drinking bottled water in Spain in my experience, I certainly still did last year.

 

It might have standards but it tastes vile out of the tap.

[SMX11]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9P1zp3q4opQ

[Strokes]

People talk about the free trade as to our benifit but has it really helped us? We now have so little industry because we freely import everything, if a tax was slapped on import it might help us compete again within our own boarders and keep some money in our country.

[MC Prussian]

Have a read through this a condensed and attempting to be unbiased summary of the key issues.

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/what-if-britain-left-the-eu-7904469.html

 

The main ones for me is that as part of the EU we have a much stronger collective voice, than if we were on our own, but then if we are dissenting against the collective voice then it doesn't really help us or the EU.

 

Don't be fooled by all the negative stories that we haven't benefitted from being in the EU, as you know newspapers rarely publish good news, all the good things that have happened are now established parts of everyday life, such as the freedom for UK citizens to live and work anywhere in the EU, the ability to trade within the EU without incurring import taxes. Even the fact we have largely moved away from the antiquated and illogical imperial system was down to the EU. (Not that we would be forced to move back if we left). Likewise things like roaming and mobile phone charges when abroad were targetted and capped by the EU, they also want to cap things like bankers bonuses. They are also working on legislation to cut the amount banks charge for credit card transactions, reducing costs for retailers that could hopefully see lower prices.

 

In this global age the fact that it is so easy to trade within the EU has benefitted our economy, but seeing as we import more than we export any import/export tariffs would hit us financially.

 

The freedom of movement is also a massive plus for many of us, just imagine the amount of extra hassle it will be when we qualify for the Europa League next season if we are no longer a part of the EU, and we would also have to start dicking around with work permits for Knocky, Mahrez and Kasper.

 

There are positives and negatives associated with the EU, but the change to our lives from leaving it would be a lot bigger than people think, it would not just be a simple case of well now we can do what we want, we would also have to spend a lot time tightening up any loopholes left open when we stop being bound by EU legislation.

 

Finally any attempt to rejoin the EU at a later date, which I am sure would be the aim of the Labour party, would require some serious concessions on the rights we managed to keep hold of when it first started.

I think it's safe to say everyone was able to move around freely and find jobs and a home abroad even before the European Union came along.

 

We may want to come back to all the economic suggestions in your reply. It may take a while before those changes will be implemented, though.

 

As far as I'm concerned, the EU puts too much emphasis on the economic aspects, such as trade and banking, but fail to secure safe working conditions for the masses of workers migrating on a constant basis.

You may want to call it modern slavery (on a much larger scale).

The European Union has to prove it is more interested in having the people benefit and not just or only companies and/or a few selected individuals.

 

And in terms of transparency, there's also still lots to learn.

[I am Rod Hull]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9P1zp3q4opQ

 

How dare you post something so matter of fact. Absolutely outrageous....