Neil Lennon's abuse in Scotland

[fleckneymike]

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2014/may/25/neil-lennon-persecution-shames-scotland-celtic-manager

 

When you look at all he had to endure it is a wonder he stuck it out as long as he did.

[purpleronnie]

I thought rangers fans were Angels?

[Guest MattP]

Big Jock Knew

[DennisNedry]

Well tbf Lennon is very unlikeable little ginger ****.

 

Great player for us, mind.

[MPH]

Well tbf Lennon is very unlikeable little ginger ****.

 

Great player for us, mind.

To be FAIR? To be FAIR? I'm hoping this is just a joke. It's hard to tell these days online...

[Webbo]

There have been a lot of Catholics who have played for Celtic, 99% don't get anything like this kind of abuse. There is obviously something else at play here. 

[Vacamion]

As someone who sees a lot of reports of what's gone on up here, Lennon has brought a ton of trouble upon himself. When he could have defused tensions he stirred them up. He's hard to like.

No one deserves assault, death threats and bullets in the post , though.

[fleckneymike]

As someone who sees a lot of reports of what's gone on up here, Lennon has brought a ton of trouble upon himself. When he could have defused tensions he stirred them up. He's hard to like.

No one deserves assault, death threats and bullets in the post , though.

 

Could you point to one specific thing that he has done wrong other than being a Northern Irish catholic?

[Guest MattP]

Could you point to one specific thing that he has done wrong other than being a Northern Irish catholic?

Calling a fellow player an 'orange bastard' on the pitch doesn't help does it?

[Jordan]

Calling a fellow player an 'orange bastard' on the pitch doesn't help does it?

Did he really, though?

[fleckneymike]

There have been a lot of Catholics who have played for Celtic, 99% don't get anything like this kind of abuse. There is obviously something else at play here. 

 

I think the fact he is northern Irish might have something to do with it.

[Guest MattP]

Did he really, though?

Are you being serious?

Just go on YouTube. No wonder you are so pro Celtic if you close your eyes to stuff like that.

Being a NY resident I'd imagine the Celtic twin towers song should be enough to put you off them.

[Vacamion]

Could you point to one specific thing that he has done wrong other than being a Northern Irish catholic?

 

 

If you have to ask this question (the fact that you pose it in this way causes me to question your motives for doing so), you give yourself away as knowing nothing about the game in Scotland and not following or paying atttention to Lennon's catalogue of ref baiting, fan baiting, victim-playing, aggressive, defiant arseholedness, which has stoked up the bigotry and inflamed tensions when a more conciliatory approach could have earned respect for some pretty decent results for his side.

 

I say this as Partick Thistle following neutral who has no axe to grind. 

 

Off the top of my head:

 

- The ref baiting after the Aberdeen match earlier this year

 

- His disgraceful behaviour when he lost his marbles at the end of that semi final in 2012

 

- His rearing up at McCoist (almost caused a riot - whatever McCoist said or however McCoist was out of order, no excuse)

 

- Kicking the water bottle in a rage the 1st game

 

- The cupping his hands to his ears at full time at Ibrox - a deliberate attempt to wind up the fans (again, potential riot time)

 

Is that enough?

 

Like I say, attacking him or threatening him was unforgiveable, and I've seen him out and about in pubs in Glasgow accompanied by his minders because he couldn't go anywhere for fear of being set upon, so I wouldn't want his life for all the tea in China, but he really didn't help himself at times.

 

Nothing to do with his religion or his nationality. 

[fleckneymike]

If you have to ask this question (the fact that you pose it in this way causes me to question your motives for doing so), you give yourself away as knowing nothing about the game in Scotland and not following or paying atttention to Lennon's catalogue of ref baiting, fan baiting, victim-playing, aggressive, defiant arseholedness, which has stoked up the bigotry and inflamed tensions when a more conciliatory approach could have earned respect for some pretty decent results for his side.

 

I say this as Partick Thistle following neutral who has no axe to grind. 

 

Off the top of my head:

 

- The ref baiting after the Aberdeen match earlier this year

 

- His disgraceful behaviour when he lost his marbles at the end of that semi final in 2012

 

- His rearing up at McCoist (almost caused a riot - whatever McCoist said or however McCoist was out of order, no excuse)

 

- Kicking the water bottle in a rage the 1st game

 

- The cupping his hands to his ears at full time at Ibrox - a deliberate attempt to wind up the fans (again, potential riot time)

 

Is that enough?

 

Like I say, attacking him or threatening him was unforgiveable, and I've seen him out and about in pubs in Glasgow accompanied by his minders because he couldn't go anywhere for fear of being set upon, so I wouldn't want his life for all the tea in China, but he really didn't help himself at times.

 

Nothing to do with his religion or his nationality. 

 

Nothing to do with his religion? The things you've listed above have been done by countless players/managers across the world and countless times yet weirdly only Lennon gets attacked on the pitch. The fact you mention kicking a bottle of water shows how ludicrous the situation is.

 

The same man can play in England without a whiff of controversy but in Scotland he gets death threats, bullets in the post etc!

 

Both Celtic and Rangers are as guilty as each other but the lack of desire to challenge the vile sectarianism that exists between the two is shameful.

[The God Emperor]

Vac, how was the Rangers Celtic situation when MON was there? I don't remember hearing anything about death threats etc but maybe I wasn't paying enough attention. I've always had the suspicion that Lennon tried to rile up the sectarian hate for whatever reason.

[Vacamion]

I can't agree.

You ignored the serious stuff and went straight for the bottle kicking? Seriously?

Previous Catholic Celtic bosses managed to get on with it without getting involved in such bother.

Previous Irish Celtic bosses likewise.

I'm not saying Lennon brought everything that happened to him upon himself but, knowing how toxic the environment was, his actions did not help.

[Vacamion]

Vac, how was the Rangers Celtic situation when MON was there? I don't remember hearing anything about death threats etc but maybe I wasn't paying enough attention. I've always had the suspicion that Lennon tried to rile up the sectarian hate for whatever reason.

I think MON was actually respected by most neutrals and some of the less swivel eyed Huns.

That 's the difference.

[MPH]

I can't agree.

You ignored the serious stuff and went straight for the bottle kicking? Seriously?

Previous Catholic Celtic bosses managed to get on with it without getting involved in such bother.

Previous Irish Celtic bosses likewise.

I'm not saying Lennon brought everything that happened to him upon himself but, knowing how toxic the environment was, his actions did not help.

I wouldn't quite call the other stuff serious, but you really didn't help yourself by adding the kicking of a water bottle to his list of 'crimes'!

[Vacamion]

I wouldn't quite call the other stuff serious, but you really didn't help yourself by adding the kicking of a water bottle to his list of 'crimes'!

Agreed.

I didn't explain why I included this.

He booted it in a rage in ,(IIRC) his first game. It made him look like a kind of unbalanced rage merchant and set the tone.

Far less serious than his fan baiting and ref abuse, admittedly.

Having been challenged to list ONE incident to justify my assertion that he fanned the flames of hatred, I listed several ones from memory (I'm sure there will be others if I looked them up).

Still not enough for those determined to paint Lennon as an entirely blameless victim, though, it would seem.

[Jordan]

Are you being serious?

Just go on YouTube. No wonder you are so pro Celtic if you close your eyes to stuff like that.

Being a NY resident I'd imagine the Celtic twin towers song should be enough to put you off them.

Yes, just go on YouTube: you'll find one video with no sound and dubious subtitles put in by a Rangers fan. I'm pretty sure we went over this at least once before on one of the many threads about Scottish football that always disintegrates thanks to sectarian bullshit.

And what do Celtic songs and where I'm from have anything to do with the topic at hand? Why can't Rangers fans just take ownership of and try to solve their own problems and just quit the "what aboot" nonsense? If you want to go have a dig at Celtic fans for their own transgressions, why don't you go start your own thread about that?

Any reasonable person, regardless of where they're from and which team they support, can say that the treatment Neil Lennon gets is reprehensible, yet Rangers fans have to preface any of their half-assed condemnations of their own behavior by pinning things on Lennon to some degree. As much as you and the Rangers support try to twist this to make Neil Lennon at some degree of fault for "escalating" the issue, "not defusing" situations or whatever excuse you want to make, this isn't Neil Lennon's problem: it's a Rangers fans' problem.

You can talk about Celtic fans singing songs about terrorism until your face is as blue as a Gers shirt, but it looks like the Rangers fans are the ones sending parcel bombs, making death threats, and attacking Celtic managers in the street... In other words, they're the ones actually doing the "terrorism."

As an aside, Lennon put in a few excellent years at Leicester, and I think City fans should treat him with a bit of respect.

[Richard]

He may have been a good servant to City, but he's a t**t

[ADK]

Still prefer him to Savage.

[Vacamion]

Yes, just go on YouTube: you'll find one video with no sound and dubious subtitles put in by a Rangers fan. I'm pretty sure we went over this at least once before on one of the many threads about Scottish football that always disintegrates thanks to sectarian bullshit.

And what do Celtic songs and where I'm from have anything to do with the topic at hand? Why can't Rangers fans just take ownership of and try to solve their own problems and just quit the "what aboot" nonsense? If you want to go have a dig at Celtic fans for their own transgressions, why don't you go start your own thread about that?

Any reasonable person, regardless of where they're from and which team they support, can say that the treatment Neil Lennon gets is reprehensible, yet Rangers fans have to preface any of their half-assed condemnations of their own behavior by pinning things on Lennon to some degree. As much as you and the Rangers support try to twist this to make Neil Lennon at some degree of fault for "escalating" the issue, "not defusing" situations or whatever excuse you want to make, this isn't Neil Lennon's problem: it's a Rangers fans' problem.

You can talk about Celtic fans singing songs about terrorism until your face is as blue as a Gers shirt, but it looks like the Rangers fans are the ones sending parcel bombs, making death threats, and attacking Celtic managers in the street... In other words, they're the ones actually doing the "terrorism."

As an aside, Lennon put in a few excellent years at Leicester, and I think City fans should treat him with a bit of respect.

But it's not just Rangers fans. It's not 'whataboutery' as they say up here.

Plenty of neutrals , me included, lost respect for Lennon every time he got in a ref's face, goaded opponents or made gestures at fans.

I'm slightly offended that you have lumped any critics of Lennon, me included, in with the red white and blue Orcs.

You don't need a sectarian motive to consider some of his antics dickheadish.

The fact he served City well shouldn't reduce his duty to behave himself.

By no reasonable measure (ask the SFA) did he behave himself.

[ackles]

Sure he's got a new job lined up, he's nobodies fool.

[Stadt]

It's cos he's ginger, it's the same reason we hate Dyche and Megson