ronnup Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 It's almost as amazing as those who trust Labour with the NHS given Mid Staffs, Wales and the fact they extensively privatised large portions of it through PFI. 'awaits shit link from random bedroom bound left wing blogger' A 1.5trillion debt and a deficit of 90 billion yet some people still think we can someone solve this without making cuts? It's beyond belief, fantasy politics. You not a fan of facts?
sphericalfox Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 It's almost as amazing as those who trust Labour with the NHS given Mid Staffs, Wales and the fact they extensively privatised large portions of it through PFI. 'awaits shit link from random bedroom bound left wing blogger' You genuinely don't know dick about the NHS. I could give you numerous massive institutional failures under Tory governments, but given the size of the NHS as an institution, there are going to be bad eggs, and certainly Mid Staffs was one of those, and it did its best to keep things under wraps. Labour can't be blamed for that directly. I won't disagree with the PFI schemes. Hideously expensive privatisation that we'll pay over the odds for buildings/hospitals for a very long time, with contractors operating these estates with no interest in them other than their shareholders and the margins they squeeze to earn more profits, but neglect the most important part of the NHS....the patient. The care however is delivered by NHS staff, they just have to put up with horrid conditions that are out of their control. It's amusing that you point this out, but fail to understand the deliberate destruction of barriers that the Tory government have imposed upon the NHS in order that they can privatise more of the NHS, specifically direct care for patients. Oh, and also made it impossible to turn around that ship once its sailed.
Guest MattP Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 You genuinely don't know dick about the NHS. I could give you numerous massive institutional failures under Tory governments, but given the size of the NHS as an institution, there are going to be bad eggs, and certainly Mid Staffs was one of those, and it did its best to keep things under wraps. Labour can't be blamed for that directly. I won't disagree with the PFI schemes. Hideously expensive privatisation that we'll pay over the odds for buildings/hospitals for a very long time, with contractors operating these estates with no interest in them other than their shareholders and the margins they squeeze to earn more profits, but neglect the most important part of the NHS....the patient. The care however is delivered by NHS staff, they just have to put up with horrid conditions that are out of their control. It's amusing that you point this out, but fail to understand the deliberate destruction of barriers that the Tory government have imposed upon the NHS in order that they can privatise more of the NHS, specifically direct care for patients. Oh, and also made it impossible to turn around that ship once its sailed. If I don't know dick about something it's bit daft to then start the next paragraph with 'I won't disagree with' in reference to something I've mentioned I go out with a nurse and have numerous family members who work in the NHS, they tell me the vast majority of the stuff that goes on in it, they never subcribe to all this bullshit you write on here. Your opinion on the NHS isn't sacrosanct despite you seeming to think it is. To describe 2,000 people dying through total negligence as a 'bad egg' is quite unbelievable - if the Tories have overseen Mid Staffs people like you would be calling for them never to be allowed in charge of a hospital again, as someone else also pointed out, take a look at Wales, the NHS is a total shambles there and Labour runs it, so yet again you won't be keen to mention it. The NHS has become a lifejacket to Labour, desperately clinging onto it as it's the one thing they know the people of the country will still swallow that they can be trusted with.
Strokes Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 "Because i believe we all do better under the tories". That single sentence has just completely dumbfounded me. Now....explain to me how those who pay the bedroom tax are now financially better off? They rent their spare room out?
sphericalfox Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 If I don't know dick about something it's bit daft to then start the next paragraph with 'I won't disagree with' in reference to something I've mentioned I go out with a nurse and have numerous family members who work in the NHS, they tell me the vast majority of the stuff that goes on in it, they never subcribe to all this bullshit you write on here. Your opinion on the NHS isn't sacrosanct despite you seeming to think it is. To describe 2,000 people dying through total negligence as a 'bad egg' is quite unbelievable - if the Tories have overseen Mid Staffs people like you would be calling for them never to be allowed in charge of a hospital again, as someone else also pointed out, take a look at Wales, the NHS is a total shambles there and Labour runs it, so yet again you won't be keen to mention it. The NHS has become a lifejacket to Labour, desperately clinging onto it as it's the one thing they know the people of the country will still swallow that they can be trusted with. Do you really believe that Labour were in charge of that hospital? Matt I have never said my opinion on the matter is sacrosanct, however your girlfriend (you have a girlfriend? wow! congrats) is a nurse and you know some people who work in the NHS. We all do Matt. But as you do not work in the NHS yourself, nor have ever worked in the Commissioning element or at the DH, I'd say you know pretty much **** all what the Tories have done to the NHS. The fact is I've pointed out that the PFI scandal which I agree with you is highly objectionable, and the Tories have actually done FAR WORSE, and you ignored that point is hilarious to the point of ridiculous.
Guest Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 No harm in aspiration fif, one day I might upgrade all the way to closet Tory......you are my inspiration How can I be a closet tory when I'm maggie's poster boy?
BlueSi13 Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 Ex-Labour. Voted Conservative. Quite a few of my family were Labour too, they voted UKIP today.
Guest Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 So if we're not thick we must be selfish? How I wish I had your moral fortitude. He has a point though.
Larry_LCFC Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 I really struggled. Think they are all utterly hopeless. I hate what conservatives have done with the cuts. Both the current and planned cuts to the police for example should be 'criminal' in itself. Labour got us into this mess and their planned crazy spending would probably be a disaster.... again. That along with the fact they don't want trident renewed. Green Party are mad. UKIP are too extreme, as are those bafoons that call themselves the SNP. So many chimps they may aswell run the country from Monkey World. Ive voted Conservatives. Best of an awful bunch.
Legend_in_blue Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 Frightening on that exit poll to see snp with 58 seats.
Thracian Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 Can't understand why anyone with the interests of this country at heart would ever vote Labour. Dirtiest word in the English language to me. The who system is riddled with lies, corruption and people who should never be entrusted with political responsibility. I wouldn't have voted at all but for my wife shaming me into doing so but, having listened to all but two of the speeches at the UKIP conference in person, I heard more sense and sincerity from them than anyone else for all their senseless own goals and their having a selection system with serious flaws in it. I'm pretty cynical about politics anyway and am certainly not a believer in democracy. Just because a lot of people vote for something doesn't mean they're right.
MooseBreath Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 Well for starters....instead of saying how well our country is doing in comparison to Greece for instance, why don't you actually compare ourselves to a country with a similar GDP. Germany perhaps? Germany had another recession in late 2012, early 2013 while we were picking up. Just last year they narrowly avoided ANOTHER recession when they posted growth rates of - 0.1% and 0.1% in consecutive quarters. Their currency has absolutely tanked in comparison to the pound, making them all poorer in global terms. Why are you using them as an example?
MooseBreath Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 Austerity has been repeatedly shown to be an ineffective growth strategy. Again, this is a known, proven truth, not opinion. The cuts are there to appeal to voters. What do you make of labour's predictions from five years ago when they said the tories would lead us into another recession (they didn't), unemployment would skyrocket (it didn't), and growth was impossible (it wasn't)? Feel free to say "I don't know because it wasn't in my alevel economics text book" if tthat's the truth. I won't think any less of you.
Grewks Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 Germany had another recession in late 2012, early 2013 while we were picking up. Just last year they narrowly avoided ANOTHER recession when they posted growth rates of - 0.1% and 0.1% in consecutive quarters. Their currency has absolutely tanked in comparison to the pound, making them all poorer in global terms. Why are you using them as an example? Example for what? May i ask how you voted??
Webbo Posted 7 May 2015 Author Posted 7 May 2015 Well for starters....instead of saying how well our country is doing in comparison to Greece for instance, why don't you actually compare ourselves to a country with a similar GDP. Germany perhaps? Or France even? If the tories are doing such a bad job why are you voting for them?
MooseBreath Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 Example for what? May i ask how you voted?? I assumed you thought a comparison with Germany would show that their economy is performing better than ours. Sure, I voted green.
Grewks Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 I assumed you thought a comparison with Germany would show that their economy is performing better than ours. Sure, I voted green. I was simply asking why he would compare an economy the size of ours with that of Greece...just seemed extremely strange. Interesting choice with the greens though....Reducing a deficit with no cuts is interesting, but each to their own.
Webbo Posted 7 May 2015 Author Posted 7 May 2015 Ex-Labour. Voted Conservative. Quite a few of my family were Labour too, they voted UKIP today. I'm on your side but tbh I never believed you were ex labour for a second.
Webbo Posted 7 May 2015 Author Posted 7 May 2015 I was simply asking why he would compare an economy the size of ours with that of Greece...just seemed extremely strange. Interesting choice with the greens though....Reducing a deficit with no cuts is interesting, but each to their own. You said the whole world was doing better but we seem to be doing better than most, especially Greece. Now answer my question if the tories are doing such a bad job why do you claim you voted for them?
Grewks Posted 7 May 2015 Posted 7 May 2015 Or France even? If the tories are doing such a bad job why are you voting for them? I take the view in politics that there are 'no good guys'.... There are policies from virtually every party which i could agree with....e.g. Ukip - Their strict policies on immigration appeal to me. Greens - The theory of 'no more cuts' appeals to everyone. Lib dems - Their economic input during the coalition has been promosing. labour - The bedroom tax doesn't apply to me, but i could see why individuals affected by it would vote labour. For myself conservatives are the party which i feel represent my needs and beliefs more than any other party. Little things like the fact that i trust the Osbourne with economics far more than Balls have an impact on my vote. I consider myself intelligent enough to realise that there is no real 'right way to vote'....Every voter has different requirements when voting.
Webbo Posted 7 May 2015 Author Posted 7 May 2015 I consider myself intelligent enough to realise that there is no real 'right way to vote'....Every voter has different requirements when voting. I agree.
Guest Posted 8 May 2015 Posted 8 May 2015 Frightening on that exit poll to see snp with 58 seats. It just means that the Scottish despise Conservatives and dislike Labour. If there was a referendum today it would still be a NO result.
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