My theory on Riyad Mahrez

[ZeGuy]

4 minutes ago, HankMarvin said:

you thought i didn't read what i wrote?>

when i said kante effect, it was hardly a negative was it??

Sorry I read your first sentence as "What was the Kanté effect though?". Apologies.

[HankMarvin]

[Koke]

Put Mahrez in that Chelsea side instead of Pedro and you will see a world beater.. 

 

To put it in perspective how brilliant Mahrez was last season, in 2014/15 Hazard won PFA player og the year with 14 goals and 7 assists. Mahrez won PFA player of the year with 17 goals and 11 assists. Phenomenal numbers. He out-did Hazard and Hazard is regarded as a world class talent.

 

Mahrez is the best player I've seen in a Leicester shirt. 

[Guest Col city fan]

1 hour ago, HankMarvin said:

Was that the Kante effect though, Hazard currently excelling - Mattic second in the assist table with 5.

On his day Mahrez has showed glimpses of being world class. Not sure i have seen much to suggest he his world class this season tbh

Which was exactly the point I was making.

Yesterday, literally every chance we made was created by Mahrez. This season, the other players are just not reading him. He's pretty much the only player with an ounce of flair in the team at present.

Koke is spot on and as I said earlier, you get Mahrez playing with great players, on form, playing around him and he'd look a different player to the one he does in our struggling side.

More often than not, the 'world class' players go to teams and play consistently with other class players. This is why Maradona's feat at Napoli might never be matched. He went there and won Serie A, basically single handedly. That was a Napoli side nowhere near the team of the modern day. How he played that season was astounding.

You could replace Mahrez with Willian or Pedro at Chelsea, with Ozil at Arsenal and with Erikssen at Spurs and he would not look out of place. 

[DelBoy73]

1 hour ago, ZeGuy said:

Yeah I already read what you wrote, just thought you didn't. You still don't see the effect?

 

Kanté:

more balls intercepted=less danger for your own defense=more opportunities to counter.

can himself take the ball 10-15 meters forward without chickening out before passing to the attacking midfielders= faster game build-up which means less time for the opponent to reorganize its defense=more space for the attacking players=more opportunities to create a goal chance.

 

That's why Hazard shines, that's why Mahrez shined. With the current slow build up when Mahrez receive the (predictable) pass, mostly in his own half or just past the half line, he already has at least two men on him and must run 10-20m more, because he must now back track (which he didn't much last season because Kanté was there) Furthermore the passes are generally hoof balls he must first take down which also costs even more precious seconds. That's situations even Messi would have a hard time to deal with.

 

Playing counter supposes to get the ball in the opponents half as fast as possible in the best possible conditions (with the least possible, short, low and precise passes). That's why Kanté was crucial. 

 

Brilliant post mate.

That's exactly the feeling i had about our situation since the early off-season games.

 

 

 

 

[HankMarvin]

1 hour ago, Col city fan said:

Which was exactly the point I was making.

Yesterday, literally every chance we made was created by Mahrez. This season, the other players are just not reading him. He's pretty much the only player with an ounce of flair in the team at present.

Koke is spot on and as I said earlier, you get Mahrez playing with great players, on form, playing around him and he'd look a different player to the one he does in our struggling side.

More often than not, the 'world class' players go to teams and play consistently with other class players. This is why Maradona's feat at Napoli might never be matched. He went there and won Serie A, basically single handedly. That was a Napoli side nowhere near the team of the modern day. How he played that season was astounding.

You could replace Mahrez with Willian or Pedro at Chelsea, with Ozil at Arsenal and with Erikssen at Spurs and he would not look out of place. 

But i disagreed with you, i dont think he is world class. He has shown glimpses last season but he is far to inconstant to be labelled World class.

He made stuff happen on his own in the glimpses last year (Man City goal -Chelsea goal plus all the take ons). I dont think his short comings this year can be totally blamed on his teammates.

 

take-ons

Mahrez 25 (41% successful) which is one of the lowest success percentages in the top 50

 

 

[MattCan]

12 hours ago, TiffToff88 said:

Before you jump on my back and accuse me of being rash or using him as a scapegoat for our perceived poor performances lately*, Hear me out, and bear in mind I've had this opinion of him for a very long time, even during our incredible title winning season:

 

Ok, here it goes: Riyad Mahrez is the most overrated player I think I've ever seen in a Leicester City shirt.

 

Yes, OK, he has his magic moments and was vital to our title winning team of last season, but lets be honest, he tries to do far too much by himself and more often than not this tends to end badly. with him either losing possession of the ball trying to do one too many clever tricks, or simply running the ball into dead ends. I have honestly never understood what all the hype is about with him. He is definitely not a team player, and at times like this, I believe we need team players more than the apparent individual "brilliance" Mahrez is supposed to possess.

 

I'm well aware that I'm going to be in a vast minority with this opinion, and I hope he goes on to prove me wrong this season, I really do, but I just can't see it happening.

 

*For the record, I don't believe we have been unacceptably poor, but more a case of we were spoilt last season and too many fans expect us to be pushing for higher things again this year.

 

Oh My Gosh .. you are so smart .. you know football better than the majority of the  500  Premier League players (they voted for him) who play professional football every day ..

[Hume]

2 hours ago, HankMarvin said:

But i disagreed with you, i dont think he is world class. He has shown glimpses last season but he is far to inconstant to be labelled World class.

He made stuff happen on his own in the glimpses last year (Man City goal -Chelsea goal plus all the take ons). I dont think his short comings this year can be totally blamed on his teammates.

 

take-ons

Mahrez 25 (41% successful) which is one of the lowest success

 

 

Whilst this was obviously a brilliant individual goal, replace Kante with Andy King and it probably doesn't happen, not King's fault, he just can't skip past players like that.

[jon1bc]

19 hours ago, TiffToff88 said:

Before you jump on my back and accuse me of being rash or using him as a scapegoat for our perceived poor performances lately*, Hear me out, and bear in mind I've had this opinion of him for a very long time, even during our incredible title winning season:

 

Ok, here it goes: Riyad Mahrez is the most overrated player I think I've ever seen in a Leicester City shirt.

 

Yes, OK, he has his magic moments and was vital to our title winning team of last season, but lets be honest, he tries to do far too much by himself and more often than not this tends to end badly. with him either losing possession of the ball trying to do one too many clever tricks, or simply running the ball into dead ends. I have honestly never understood what all the hype is about with him. He is definitely not a team player, and at times like this, I believe we need team players more than the apparent individual "brilliance" Mahrez is supposed to possess.

 

I'm well aware that I'm going to be in a vast minority with this opinion, and I hope he goes on to prove me wrong this season, I really do, but I just can't see it happening.

 

*For the record, I don't believe we have been unacceptably poor, but more a case of we were spoilt last season and too many fans expect us to be pushing for higher things again this year.

wow.

 

He put in numerous dangerous crosses against WBA with one being the assist for Slim. What more do you want him to do when surrounded by other average players?

[desertfox2]

It's pretty easy to see where our problem lies and it is not Mahrez. We have downgraded in the middle of the park. No offence to King or Amartey but neither are even close to being on the same level although Amartey is still young. Mendy who knows? But we have lost a world class player in Kante and have nobody even close to his level to fill the gap. The plug has been pulled.

[TiffToff88]

"Welcome to Foxestalk, where all views are respected - as long as they conform to popular opinion"

[DelBoy73]

When 110% of opposing teams are doubling/tripling on Mahrez, that speaks volume about his attacking threat and the quality of the lad, period.

He is a tremendous player but hindered by our system, blimey, even Neymar & Messi would struggle out here with the kind of service they would get.

With Drinkwatter and Fuchs hoofing the ball almost everytime forward you won't play these kind of players to their strength, quite the opposite.

 

By releasing Kante before securing the SIlva deal, we have unprofessionaly shot ourselves in the foot and made the worst peace of business in history that set us back eons behind, regardless of the £25M.

We should have squeezed at the very least the double from the Chavs considering the kind of money we will have to spend for a decent box-to-box man in these days market.

January transfer window won't come too quickly me thinks.

 

[Guest Col city fan]

1 hour ago, DelBoy73 said:

When 110% of opposing teams are doubling/tripling on Mahrez, that speaks volume about his attacking threat and the quality of the lad, period.

He is a tremendous player but hindered by our system, blimey, even Neymar & Messi would struggle out here with the kind of service they would get.

With Drinkwatter and Fuchs hoofing the ball almost everytime forward you won't play these kind of players to their strength, quite the opposite.

 

By releasing Kante before securing the SIlva deal, we have unprofessionaly shot ourselves in the foot and made the worst peace of business in history that set us back eons behind, regardless of the £25M.

We should have squeezed at the very least the double from the Chavs considering the kind of money we will have to spend for a decent box-to-box man in these days market.

January transfer window won't come too quickly me thinks.

 

Liking your posts at the mo.

I agree.

[Manwell Pablo]

1 hour ago, DelBoy73 said:

When 110% of opposing teams are doubling/tripling on Mahrez, that speaks volume about his attacking threat and the quality of the lad, period.

He is a tremendous player but hindered by our system, blimey, even Neymar & Messi would struggle out here with the kind of service they would get.

With Drinkwatter and Fuchs hoofing the ball almost everytime forward you won't play these kind of players to their strength, quite the opposite.

 

By releasing Kante before securing the SIlva deal, we have unprofessionaly shot ourselves in the foot and made the worst peace of business in history that set us back eons behind, regardless of the £25M.

We should have squeezed at the very least the double from the Chavs considering the kind of money we will have to spend for a decent box-to-box man in these days market.

January transfer window won't come too quickly me thinks.

 

It was around 30-35 Million.

 

Kante was always going to go, we actually were fortunate in managing to get that much for him, given any side in the Champions League could activate a 25 million release clause and we would have no choice but to sell. We were lucky Chelsea came in when they did they effectively made us 8 Million quid.

 

Not bringing in Silva was criminal mind you, if money was the problem we should of taken the 12 Million for Jeffrey given we have an army of left wingers. 

[ZeGuy]

3 hours ago, TiffToff88 said:

"Welcome to Foxestalk, where all views are respected - as long as they conform to popular opinion"

Sore loser. You called one of the best players to ever wear the LCFC shirt the most overrated ever. People gave you facts and pretty much well argumented replies about how much you assessment is not correct. Don't blame people for your lack of basic football knowledge.

[TiffToff88]

14 minutes ago, ZeGuy said:

Sore loser. You called one of the best players to ever wear the LCFC shirt the most overrated ever. People gave you facts and pretty much well argumented replies about how much you assessment is not correct. Don't blame people for your lack of basic football knowledge.

Again, it's not like I said he's crap. All I said was I don't think he's as good as soon people seem to think he is. Can you not see the difference?

[DelBoy73]

47 minutes ago, Manwell Pablo said:

It was around 30-35 Million.

 

Kante was always going to go, we actually were fortunate in managing to get that much for him, given any side in the Champions League could activate a 25 million release clause and we would have no choice but to sell. We were lucky Chelsea came in when they did they effectively made us 8 Million quid.

 

Not bringing in Silva was criminal mind you, if money was the problem we should of taken the 12 Million for Jeffrey given we have an army of left wingers. 

Actually, it was 35M€, so roughly £30M. Anyway, it was still a disgusting steal from Chelsea.

Every year we see Italian or Portuguese sides selling players for twice or triple the amount of their release clause, why do we accept to be bullied ?

 

[Manwell Pablo]

4 minutes ago, DelBoy73 said:

Actually, it was 35M€, so roughly £30M. Anyway, it was still a disgusting steal from Chelsea.

Every year we see Italian or Portuguese sides selling players for twice or triple the amount of their release clause, why do we accept to be bullied ?

 

 

So what I said then. 

 

Do we? Honestly interested in some examples of that if true, I thought the general idea of a release clause was that was max you would have to pay for the player in question. 

[HankMarvin]

2 hours ago, DelBoy73 said:

When 110% of opposing teams are doubling/tripling on Mahrez, that speaks volume about his attacking threat and the quality of the lad, period.

He is a tremendous player but hindered by our system, blimey, even Neymar & Messi would struggle out here with the kind of service they would get.

With Drinkwatter and Fuchs hoofing the ball almost everytime forward you won't play these kind of players to their strength, quite the opposite.

 

By releasing Kante before securing the SIlva deal, we have unprofessionaly shot ourselves in the foot and made the worst peace of business in history that set us back eons behind, regardless of the £25M.

We should have squeezed at the very least the double from the Chavs considering the kind of money we will have to spend for a decent box-to-box man in these days market.

January transfer window won't come too quickly me thinks.

 

But his "world class" to some why should that matter? are you insinuating that hazard and these other keymen dont have defenders doing the same?

There seems to be a lot of excuses, but fact of the matter is that he is playing poorly and the one part of his game that can be judged solely is take ons.

 

 

 

 

[DelBoy73]

3 hours ago, HankMarvin said:

But his "world class" to some why should that matter? are you insinuating that hazard and these other keymen dont have defenders doing the same?

There seems to be a lot of excuses, but fact of the matter is that he is playing poorly and the one part of his game that can be judged solely is take ons.

 

You are missing one essential parameter there.

The matter is Hazard's service is ten times better than what Mahrez has to work with here.

It is infinitely easier to perform takes-on against defenses which have being torn appart by intricate and quick collective builds-up;

while our lad gets the ball most of the time 50 yards of the opposition's box and has to deal with their defenders already closing-in because our passing scheme is the same cliché week-in week-out.

 

Bring Hazard in our curent team and i bet you my left nut that he would have the exact same stinker of a season he had the year before.

And how the irony, now that Kante has joined his squad and a competent managers plays him to his own strength, he shines again, blimey !

 

 

[ZeGuy]

48 minutes ago, DelBoy73 said:

You are missing one essential parameter there.

The matter is Hazard's service is ten times better than what Mahrez has to work with here.

It is infinitely easier to perform takes-on against defenses which have being torn appart by intricate and quick collective builds-up;

while our lad gets the ball most of the time 50 yards of the opposition's box and has to deal with their defenders already closing-in because our passing scheme is the same cliché week-in week-out.

 

Bring Hazard in our curent team and i bet you my left nut that he would have the exact same stinker of a season he had the year before.

And how the irony, now that Kante has joined his squad and a competent managers plays him to his own strength, he shines again, blimey !

 

 

Spot on. That's exactly what most of the people fail to see.

[MattCan]

You logically cannot compare the numbers of Hazard in Chelsea to the numbers of Mahrez in Leicester. It is like comparing the number of cars a rich guy can purchase to those of a poor guy. Still, he outperformed Hazard last year against all odds.

 

Edit:

Yeah, what's a successful take-on?

- Passing ONE player with Costa, Kante, Matic, Alonso around?  or

- Passing THREE/FOUR players at the same time with no leicester player in sight?

[MattCan]

9 hours ago, TiffToff88 said:

"Welcome to Foxestalk, where all views are respected - as long as they conform to popular opinion"

Ok, and I am the Queen of England.

[Guest Col city fan]

1 hour ago, DelBoy73 said:

You are missing one essential parameter there.

The matter is Hazard's service is ten times better than what Mahrez has to work with here.

It is infinitely easier to perform takes-on against defenses which have being torn appart by intricate and quick collective builds-up;

while our lad gets the ball most of the time 50 yards of the opposition's box and has to deal with their defenders already closing-in because our passing scheme is the same cliché week-in week-out.

 

Bring Hazard in our curent team and i bet you my left nut that he would have the exact same stinker of a season he had the year before.

And how the irony, now that Kante has joined his squad and a competent managers plays him to his own strength, he shines again, blimey !

 

 

Exactly the point! Which HankMarvin don't seem to get? For some reason?

[fuchsntf]

5 hours ago, HankMarvin said:

But his "world class" to some why should that matter? are you insinuating that hazard and these other keymen dont have defenders doing the same?

There seems to be a lot of excuses, but fact of the matter is that he is playing poorly and the one part of his game that can be judged solely is take ons.

 

 

 

 

Difference. Mahrez is the only player we have who runs at the oppo. Easy covered in our style of play.

Those others listed, or at least most of them, have also WClass players has teammates, or others who can

take more players on. We never had high class quality tekkies, Mahrez at present is the only one..