DJ Barry Hammond Posted 7 June 2018 Author Posted 7 June 2018 8 minutes ago, MattP said: Always going to happen as soon as the election returned a minority gov. She wanted such a large majority to give herself the option of soft or hard Brexit through parliament. Still makes no sense she denied guys like Dan Hannan into parliament, clearly wanted as many "vote with the whip" politicians as possible. I'm just thankful Corbyn is in charge of the opposition who need to be out as well to implement their policy now or we'd probably now be looking at a parliamentary majority to staying in the customs union and maybe even single market. Which would be the most pointless piece of government action I've ever seen. My side should have achieved it's aim via a general election rather than a referendum, it would have changed the parties had we attempted to so that as well instead of then being do out of touch with the public on the issue. Of course, this is all coming about because of the hardly considered at the time Irish question... which even poses an issue for “no deal” because even that would need some sort of agreement between UK, Ireland and the EU. So I still see this as the biggest problem for whatever happens going forward. A Conservative government would never jettison Northern Ireland, whereas a Corybn led Labour Government just might. It’d certainly would have been interesting to have a view into a parallel universe that saw Corybn win the last election and how he dealt with Brexit.
Guest Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, DJ Barry Hammond said: Of course, this is all coming about because of the hardly considered at the time Irish question... which even poses an issue for “no deal” because even that would need some sort of agreement between UK, Ireland and the EU. So I still see this as the biggest problem for whatever happens going forward. A Conservative government would never jettison Northern Ireland, whereas a Corybn led Labour Government just might. It’d certainly would have been interesting to have a view into a parallel universe that saw Corybn win the last election and how he dealt with Brexit. Interestingly I think there was a survey in northern island which suggested the people would rather stay in the EU and have a United Ireland than leave with the UK. The DUP really shouldn't be voting with the government on Brexit. Edited 7 June 2018 by Guest
Guest MattP Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 1 minute ago, toddybad said: Interestingly I think there was a survey in northern island which suggested the people would rather stay in the EU and have a United Ireland than leave with the UK. The DUP really shouldn't be voting with the government on Brexit. You've just made that up again haven't you?
Sharpe's Fox Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 2 minutes ago, MattP said: You've just made that up again haven't you? We dont let Somalians just decide they are British so why do we let micks? The solution to the hard border is a united Ireland.
Guest Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 2 minutes ago, MattP said: You've just made that up again haven't you? No, I haven't watched TV for about 2 years bit turned it on last night and landed on that Carry on EU programme that follows different MEPs around. It was either an Irish or Sein Fein MEP who was talking about the survey being the first time public opinion in N.Ireland has shown such a thing.
Guest Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 6 minutes ago, MattP said: You've just made that up again haven't you? Here you go. Perhaps you should do some research. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/northern-ireland-support-join-irish-republic-eu-hard-brexit-poll-lucidtalk-a8098531.html
Buce Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 3 minutes ago, Sharpe's Fox said: We dont let Somalians just decide they are British so why do we let micks? The solution to the hard border is a united Ireland. You clearly know nothing about Irish history. 1
Guest MattP Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 4 minutes ago, toddybad said: Here you go. Perhaps you should do some research. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/northern-ireland-support-join-irish-republic-eu-hard-brexit-poll-lucidtalk-a8098531.html "The survey commissioned by a left-leaning group in the European Parliament" Don't worry I've got a poll saying they'll stay, commissioned by Nigel Farage.
Guest Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 4 minutes ago, MattP said: "The survey commissioned by a left-leaning group in the European Parliament" Don't worry I've got a poll saying they'll stay, commissioned by Nigel Farage. Every poll you ever see comes from one side or other. There are very few neutral sources. So it's of no interest at all in your view? It also says left leaning, not far left. I also have to question the use of the emoji. You've trying to laugh it down as ridiculous when it's just a survey. Well, there are plenty. Here's another one, sought by LBC and discussed in the Express. https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/937255/Brexit-Northern-Ireland-UK-EU-YouGov-poll-LBC-Democratic-Unionist-Sir-Jeffrey-Donaldson The only person deserving of emoji is the idiot that wants to jump to conclusions.
theessexfox Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 3 hours ago, Foxin_mad said: Is there genuinely a country in the world, or is there every likely to be where every single person is completely equal with no variation? Maybe North Korea is a bout as close as we get? Nowhere in Marx's writings is such an aspiration expressed. 2
Sharpe's Fox Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 12 minutes ago, Buce said: You clearly know nothing about Irish history. I know geography though
Guest MattP Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 1 minute ago, toddybad said: Every poll you ever see comes from one side or other. There are very few neutral sources. So it's of no interest at all in your view? It also says left leaning, not far left. I also have to question the use of the emoji. You've trying to laugh it down as ridiculous when it's just a survey. Well, there are plenty. Here's another one, sought by LBC and discussed in the Express. https://www.express.co.uk/news/politics/937255/Brexit-Northern-Ireland-UK-EU-YouGov-poll-LBC-Democratic-Unionist-Sir-Jeffrey-Donaldson The only person deserving of emoji is the idiot that wants to jump to conclusions. Plenty of polls told us Scotland would leave with the Tories in charge. Ireland will be united eventually, the demographics will see to that, but there is not a chance at the minute of the North voting to come together with the south. Ironically that's the part of the GFA that means eventually they probably will return to the troubles, though no one likes to talk about it.
Guest Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 2 minutes ago, MattP said: Plenty of polls told us Scotland would leave with the Tories in charge. Ireland will be united eventually, the demographics will see to that, but there is not a chance at the minute of the North voting to come together with the south. Ironically that's the part of the GFA that means eventually they probably will return to the troubles, though no one likes to talk about it. You've changed the discussion. My point was the DUP aren't properly representing northern Irish voters.
Guest MattP Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 5 minutes ago, toddybad said: You've changed the discussion. My point was the DUP aren't properly representing northern Irish voters. They should represent the country? Why? The DUP is representing it's voters, in every constituency they hold the people voted leave. I'm assuming by your point that they should represent the whole nation (only logical conclusion unless you can explain otherwise) then that all the MP's in England and Wales should also be voting for Brexit yes?
Guest MattP Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 Should Plaid MP's vote with Brexit policy to represent the country?
Guest Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 13 minutes ago, MattP said: They should represent the country? Why? The DUP is representing it's voters, in every constituency they hold the people voted leave. I'm assuming by your point that they should represent the whole nation (only logical conclusion unless you can explain otherwise) then that all the MP's in England and Wales should also be voting for Brexit yes? Remain won in a few unionist areas.
Guest MattP Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 1 minute ago, toddybad said: Remain won in a few unionist areas. Source?
Bellend Sebastian Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 Paul "you're all c*nts" Dacre being replaced at the Daily Mail by Geordie Greig of the Mail on Sunday, which I hadn't realised supports Remain
foxinexile Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, MattP said: They should represent the country? Why? The DUP is representing it's voters, in every constituency they hold the people voted leave. I'm assuming by your point that they should represent the whole nation (only logical conclusion unless you can explain otherwise) then that all the MP's in England and Wales should also be voting for Brexit yes? Belfast North, Belfast South, and Londonderry East all voted Remain. These are DUP constituencies as far as I am aware. Edited 7 June 2018 by foxinexile
Guest MattP Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 20 minutes ago, Bellend Sebastian said: Paul "you're all c*nts" Dacre being replaced at the Daily Mail by Geordie Greig of the Mail on Sunday, which I hadn't realised supports Remain Really? It's probably the most vociferous Sunday pro-remain paper aside from the Observer. Then again a lot of people I've met who shout about "the mail" often seem to know nothing about it. Dacre was never my cup of tea but have to credit him for one thing, the Lawrence headline was the most brave decision I think an editor has made.
Guest Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 21 minutes ago, MattP said: Really? It's probably the most vociferous Sunday pro-remain paper aside from the Observer. Then again a lot of people I've met who shout about "the mail" often seem to know nothing about it. Dacre was never my cup of tea but have to credit him for one thing, the Lawrence headline was the most brave decision I think an editor has made. Mail on Sunday was pretty anti Brexit I'm told. I've no idea for myself but surely one of you rabid Tories must have bought the odd copy?
Bellend Sebastian Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 25 minutes ago, MattP said: Really? It's probably the most vociferous Sunday pro-remain paper aside from the Observer. Then again a lot of people I've met who shout about "the mail" often seem to know nothing about it. Dacre was never my cup of tea but have to credit him for one thing, the Lawrence headline was the most brave decision I think an editor has made. Well, although the presence of the Daily Mail is pretty much a given in the households of everyone I know over the age of 60 (and for this reason I'm rather more familiar with it than I'd wish to be), The Mail on Sunday is a much rarer beast which I don't think I've seen since Kylie was in You Magazine in pink feather hotpants and nothing else in about 1992 (the best trip to my Nan's ever - I was EXHAUSTED). It's only relatively recently I've become aware of the differing ethos from the daily, the tensions between Dacre and Greig, without really knowing how it was different, as I simply never saw it. I always assumed that its take-up seemed low because the oldies were just being a bit tight
leicsmac Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 1 hour ago, MattP said: Really? It's probably the most vociferous Sunday pro-remain paper aside from the Observer. Then again a lot of people I've met who shout about "the mail" often seem to know nothing about it. Dacre was never my cup of tea but have to credit him for one thing, the Lawrence headline was the most brave decision I think an editor has made. I'm by no means the biggest fan of the Mail, but the Stephen Lawrence headline was a diamond in the middle of the pig excrement of sensationalism and dog-whistles they normally enjoy printing.
Guest MattP Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, toddybad said: Mail on Sunday was pretty anti Brexit I'm told. I've no idea for myself but surely one of you rabid Tories must have bought the odd copy? Me and Webbo both buy it. Despite being anti-Brexit it is a great Sunday paper, Peter Hitchins is the best SC going apart from Rod Liddle, Hodges is pretty good and the investigative journalism is comfortably the best, they sweep up all the awards on that for a reason. 1 hour ago, Bellend Sebastian said: Well, although the presence of the Daily Mail is pretty much a given in the households of everyone I know over the age of 60 (and for this reason I'm rather more familiar with it than I'd wish to be), The Mail on Sunday is a much rarer beast which I don't think I've seen since Kylie was in You Magazine in pink feather hotpants and nothing else in about 1992 (the best trip to my Nan's ever - I was EXHAUSTED). It's only relatively recently I've become aware of the differing ethos from the daily, the tensions between Dacre and Greig, without really knowing how it was different, as I simply never saw it. I always assumed that its take-up seemed low because the oldies were just being a bit tight Amazed. They are literally at jouno war with each other. Always have been. As I said, I don't think anyone who complains about the Mail on Sunday has read it since 1965. It's not my cup of tea, I read the Times, but they do have a few decent columnists. The take-up isn't low either - it's the biggest selling Sunday paper now. Edited 7 June 2018 by MattP
Guest Posted 7 June 2018 Posted 7 June 2018 (edited) 6 minutes ago, MattP said: Me and Webbo both buy it. Despite being anti-Brexit it is a great Sunday paper, Peter Hitchins is the best SC going apart from Rod Liddle, Hodges is pretty good and the investigative journalism is comfortably the best, they sweep up all the awards on that for a reason. Amazed. They are literally at jouno war with each other. Always have been. As I said, I don't think anyone who complains about the Mail on Sunday has read it since 1965. It's not my cup of tea, I read the Times, but they do have a few decent columnists. The take-up isn't low either - it's the biggest selling Sunday paper now. Will be interesting to see what direction the daily goes in. And how this affects both the readership and the government given how scared of dacre they were. I believe dacre will still be around as he's on the board though he hates the new guy. Interesting times. But then I thought that when mirror group bought the Express. Edited 7 June 2018 by Guest
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