George Thomas and Viktor Johansson 8 released by Leicester City

[Ric Flair]

32 minutes ago, lcfcsnow said:

Another one who made a mistake coming here, three years ago he was an ever present and highly thought of at Chester in the National League, you'd think he could have gone to a league one/two club at that point. Instead he's spent the next three years with our u23s, which included one loan where he couldn't get in the Salford team.

That injury is what scuppered him, his 1st year with us was really positive and he was on the verge of a game for us. 

[Rob1742]

I think the list highlights the equality in football. We just snap up anyone that we think may have a chance and bung them in the reserves and don’t give them a chance to progress.

 

So let’s look at Thomas, doing very well at Coventry, but no chance of him making the first team as would would buy much better than nurture someone like that.

 

So we bung them in the reserves, but pay them a huge amount more than a Championship club or League 1 team would pay all “ just in case” he progresses further.

 

We can afford these cheap gambles, but it takes potential talent away from the lower leagues.

 

We really need to address the balance, to enable clubs to keep people like him, rather than clubs like ours hamper their progress.

 

Ryan Loft was released by Spurs, wouldn’t it have been better for football and him if he had signed for a division 1 club where he would have been given games? 
 

The only thing is that the game is so very different in the lower leagues, but the more we take the talent away and leave them with lumpers and hoofers, the more the gap widens.

 

Its obviously not just us, the whole of the Premier League are at it, we are all just collecting players like the fans collected football cards as kids. 
 

 

[Guest]

2 hours ago, Ric Flair said:

He can still play U23's as you can name a certain amount of older players. Bizarre we have kept him though.

I think he's a good looking player and someone who could come into the team.

[Frost]

Not sure how many times we have to say it but the the U23 set-up should be binned off.

 

Seems to be a graveyard for young careers or at the very least ends up stagnating their development and we end up signing youngsters who have no chance of making it here just to bulk up the squad. If you're good enough you should be able to pick up a loan deal in League Two or above by the time they're no longer eligible for the U18s. 

 

Do we know how Terell Pennant was/is getting on at the minute? Heard great things about him - as well as the Canadian goalkeeper mentioned further up.

Edited 27 June 2020 by Frost

[moore_94]

22 minutes ago, Frost said:

Not sure how many times we have to say it but the the U23 set-up should be binned off.

 

Seems to be a graveyard for young careers or at the very least ends up stagnating their development and we end up signing youngsters who have no chance of making it here just to bulk up the squad. If you're good enough you should be able to pick up a loan deal in League Two or above by the time they're no longer eligible for the U18s. 

 

Do we know how Terell Pennant was/is getting on at the minute? Heard great things about him - as well as the Canadian goalkeeper mentioned further up.

Our U23 set-up is weird as all we seem to want is to try and win the PL2 rather than actually using it as an opportunity to develop younger players like other clubs

 

Chelsea won the PL2 this season with the squad being a majority of players 19 and under

 

Our most used players in PL2 this season have been:

 

Leshabela (20)

Callum Wright (20)

Darnell Johnson (21)

Calvin Bassey/Ughelumba (21)

Luke Thomas (19)

Johansson (21)

Muskwe (21) - Until he finally got a loan out to Swindon

Mitch Clark (21) - Until he went on loan to Port Vale

George Hirst (21)

Dewsbury-Hall (21) - Finally got a loan to Blackpool

Ali Reghba (20)

George Thomas (23) - Absolutely ridiculous he wasn't loaned out again this season until a late January move

Josh Eppiah (21)

 

Every single one of these players except maybe Luke Thomas who is only just 19 should have been out on loan somewhere this season

 

So what if we do worse in PL2 and the stupid cup we are involved in, at least younger players like Gyamfi, Pennant, Tavares, etc. will be getting regular game time at a higher development level than against actual kids in the u19s

 

Just look how much loans helped out Chilwell, Choudhury and Barnes at an early stage in their career (all 3 went out on loan to League 1/Championship from the age of 19 and it has helped them develop massively)

 

I honestly think unless we get someone massively talented through the youth system (maybe Pennant seems like he could be quality) it will be a while before we see someone regularly involved with our main squad like the 3 mentioned above are

 

Edited 27 June 2020 by moore_94

[Lesta2014]

3 hours ago, lcfcsnow said:

Another one who made a mistake coming here, three years ago he was an ever present and highly thought of at Chester in the National League, you'd think he could have gone to a league one/two club at that point. Instead he's spent the next three years with our u23s, which included one loan where he couldn't get in the Salford team.

The only thing I can think of is like josh Eppiah, we gave contracts when injured. Have we gave him another year to get to full fitness and when he’s at that level we deem him good enough? 

[moore_94]

19 minutes ago, Frost said:

Not sure how many times we have to say it but the the U23 set-up should be binned off.

 

Seems to be a graveyard for young careers or at the very least ends up stagnating their development and we end up signing youngsters who have no chance of making it here just to bulk up the squad. If you're good enough you should be able to pick up a loan deal in League Two or above by the time they're no longer eligible for the U18s. 

 

Do we know how Terell Pennant was/is getting on at the minute? Heard great things about him - as well as the Canadian goalkeeper mentioned further up.

Odunze has been mainly behind Oliver Bosworth as keeper for the u18s, with only 4 starts

 

Pennant has played 11 games at u18s with 7 goals and 4 assists, and managed a 7 minute cameo for the u23s

[themightyfin]

5 minutes ago, moore_94 said:

Our U23 set-up is weird as all we seem to want is to try and win the PL2 rather than actually using it as an opportunity to develop younger players like other clubs

 

Chelsea won the PL2 this season with the squad being a majority of players 19 and under

 

Our most used players in PL2 this season have been:

 

Leshabela (20)

Callum Wright (20)

Darnell Johnson (21)

Calvin Bassey/Ughelumba (21)

Luke Thomas (19)

Johansson (21)

Muskwe (21) - Until he finally got a loan out to Swindon

Mitch Clark (21) - Until he went on loan to Port Vale

George Hirst (21)

Dewsbury-Hall (21) - Finally got a loan to Blackpool

Ali Reghba (20)

George Thomas (23) - Absolutely ridiculous he wasn't loaned out again this season

Josh Eppiah (21)

 

Every single one of these players except maybe Luke Thomas who is only just 19 should have been out on loan somewhere this season

 

So what if we do worse in PL2 and the stupid cup we are involved in, at least younger players like Gyamfi, Pennant, Tavares, etc. will be getting regular game time at a higher development level than against actual kids in the u19s

 

Just look how much loans helped out Chilwell, Choudhury and Barnes at an early stage in their career (all 3 went out on loan to League 1/Championship from the age of 19 and it has helped them develop massively)

 

George Thomas was loaned to ADO Den Haag in the Eredivisie league and managed all if 2 games. 

[moore_94]

1 minute ago, themightyfin said:

George Thomas was loaned to ADO Den Haag in the Eredivisie league and managed all if 2 games. 

It was such a weird move, would've been better off going out loan to someone like Scunthorpe again, even if they were in a League One relegation battle at least he was playing then

[NaijaFox]

On 26/06/2020 at 04:00, Shane said:

 

U18s keeper Oliver Bosworth won academy player of the season last year, so maybe he’s next in line.

 

We also have Chituru Odunze who is supposed to be highly rated. 6’6, 17 yr old Canadian keeper we signed last year.

He played for the USA in last year’s U17 World Cup (and apparently eligible for Nigeria through both parents).

[Ric Flair]

2 hours ago, FIF said:

I think he's a good looking player and someone who could come into the team.

Knight is better IMO

[CosbehFox]

1 hour ago, moore_94 said:

Our U23 set-up is weird as all we seem to want is to try and win the PL2 rather than actually using it as an opportunity to develop younger players like other clubs

 

Chelsea won the PL2 this season with the squad being a majority of players 19 and under

 

Our most used players in PL2 this season have been:

 

Leshabela (20)

Callum Wright (20)

Darnell Johnson (21)

Calvin Bassey/Ughelumba (21)

Luke Thomas (19)

Johansson (21)

Muskwe (21) - Until he finally got a loan out to Swindon

Mitch Clark (21) - Until he went on loan to Port Vale

George Hirst (21)

Dewsbury-Hall (21) - Finally got a loan to Blackpool

Ali Reghba (20)

George Thomas (23) - Absolutely ridiculous he wasn't loaned out again this season until a late January move

Josh Eppiah (21)

 

Every single one of these players except maybe Luke Thomas who is only just 19 should have been out on loan somewhere this season

 

So what if we do worse in PL2 and the stupid cup we are involved in, at least younger players like Gyamfi, Pennant, Tavares, etc. will be getting regular game time at a higher development level than against actual kids in the u19s

 

Just look how much loans helped out Chilwell, Choudhury and Barnes at an early stage in their career (all 3 went out on loan to League 1/Championship from the age of 19 and it has helped them develop massively)

 

I honestly think unless we get someone massively talented through the youth system (maybe Pennant seems like he could be quality) it will be a while before we see someone regularly involved with our main squad like the 3 mentioned above are

 

Problem is the loan system in England has completely changed in the last season. Clubs can only have four loans and they must be long term. So lower league clubs are less likely to gamble on a month or three months. 
 

There’s a case to be had sending players Scotland or Europe instead mind. 
 

I think Dewsbury Hall is the perfect example of player developing being exposed to that level 

[Guest]

So we have an U23 team of mostly 20 and 21 yo. I think that's about right. 

[Ric Flair]

39 minutes ago, FIF said:

So we have an U23 team of mostly 20 and 21 yo. I think that's about right. 

But we have zero history of picking a player out of the U23's and start using them without a loan or two first. That's why its better to get them loaned out earlier and the U18's promoted earlier, we are way too slow to do this.

[moore_94]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

But we have zero history of picking a player out of the U23's and start using them without a loan or two first. That's why its better to get them loaned out earlier and the U18's promoted earlier, we are way too slow to do this.

Hopefully the system in place can be taken up a notch with the new training ground, especially as they will now have designated top spec facilities for the development squads etc.

 

Has there been anything about who is taking Trevor Peakes role in the u18s?

[themightyfin]

13 hours ago, Cardiff_Fox said:

Problem is the loan system in England has completely changed in the last season. Clubs can only have four loans and they must be long term. So lower league clubs are less likely to gamble on a month or three months. 
 

There’s a case to be had sending players Scotland or Europe instead mind. 
 

I think Dewsbury Hall is the perfect example of player developing being exposed to that level 

Lower league clubs can have  upto 8 players on loan. Thry are allowed to play 5. Not sure where you got this from league 1 and 2 clubs have huge amounts if players on loan. 

Eg lincoln 2019/20 always had their max 8 loan players on their books through the whole season. 

[Richard]

It's easy to criticise the club for not getting players out on loan, but maybe clubs just don't want our players? 

 

Or we need to be selective on where players go? It didn't help Sam Hughes going to sit on Salford's bench, it didn't help Kapustka sitting on OHL's bench and it likely wouldn't help someone like Darnell Johnson if the only takers were L2 clubs 

[davieG]

I think it shows the whole concept of PL clubs scooping up the best young players is fundamentally wrong for the players and the lower league clubs. They should stay at their local League clubs and  funding should be provided from the FA, PL and FL to ensure all FL clubs have top quality coaches at all levels It doesn't mean PL clubs can't have their own local kids. 

 

I honestly don't think having super dooper training facilities are entirely necessary either but top quality coaches are. 

 

It'll never happen of course as the PL clubs have too much money and power to give up the unnecessary hoarding of players were it would seem too many fall though cracks.

 

After you've been at a PL club for half your life with 5* accommodation and top pay then being told you're not wanted at 21/22/23 and the only prospect is a lower league side with 2* facilities and probably less wages it's going to look less than welcome. Where as if you've come up the other way through a hierarchy of gradual improvements in conditions and pay then the Championship / PL will look like Utopia.

[CosbehFox]

2 hours ago, themightyfin said:

Lower league clubs can have  upto 8 players on loan. Thry are allowed to play 5. Not sure where you got this from league 1 and 2 clubs have huge amounts if players on loan. 

Eg lincoln 2019/20 always had their max 8 loan players on their books through the whole season. 

My error then. I was going off an interview with Carlisle’s manager at the time of Cup Third Round. He was illustrating the difficulty of getting loan signings right. That the abolishment of short term loanees doesn’t give them a lot of leeway 
 

His point is literally in what you are saying. If only five loan players can play on an occasion, the loaning club are going to want assurance that their player will play. We’ve seen how Sam Hughes has not done anything for his recovery for a bad injury going on loan to Salford 
 

Equally a lower league club want to avoid playing wages for three loanees who can’t play. Carlisle manager was making the point that they can’t sign a loanee and simply have him not playing. Maybe the likes of Lincoln and Salford could afford that. Others can’t. The ability to take a gamble on a short term loan has been lost to detriment of developing English players