The Knee

[Nuneatonfox in Manchester]

14 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

It was Hitler's opinion that the Jews were an inferior race that should be wiped off the planet.

 

Just his opinion like.

 

 

 

 

 

Seriously, the, "it's just my opinion" thing. It may be an opinion; doesn't mean it can't be held up to scrutiny.

 

But I suppose no one should ever challenge someone's opinion. 

Apparently not just Hitler’s judging by the overwhelming support for Hamas in Europe 

[BlueSi13]

8 minutes ago, hackneyfox said:

Did you read what you've linked?

'black people are more than twice as likely to die in police custody.'

Yes when taking in to account overall population size and % of arrests.  In another post I shared the stats saying blacks are more likely to be arrested than any other ethnic group.

 

However ignoring population sizes, out of those actually arrested, a white inmate is 25% more likely to die than a black person.

 

Being level headed that sounds huge, but thankfully still a very small number over the course of a decade.  Hopefully efforts continue to reduce that number further over the next ten years.

[srex9]

6 minutes ago, Mark_w said:

It's not just the terms he used. It's the meaning of the things he said. His entire political position was based on bigotry. He was a firm supporter of the idea that we were superior to other peoples, and that that was justification to 'civilise' or more realistically exploit them. It's not about the terminology, it's about his world view. He was a racist in terms of some the terms he used yes, but his politics were also racist.

Are you basing that on Churchill's brief support of eugenics? The idea that undesirable traits could be "bred out" of the human race. That was born from Social Darwinism. He wasn't alone. H.G. Wells, John Maynard Keynes, Theodore Roosevelt were all eugenicists. NAACP founder W.E.B. DuBois was a eugenicist. Two of the world's foremost campaigners for women's reproductive rights, Marie Stopes and Margaret Sanger were the same.

Would anyone seriously claim that Keynes or DuBois or Sanger were racists?

 

I'm afraid we'll have to agree to disagree. I'd happily discuss further but I need my rest. 

[shailen]

14 minutes ago, sheffield_fox said:

Pisses me off so much that the clubs spout on about having zero tolerance to racism then allow this to happen without taking action. 

 

It time for them to stop fannying about and put their money where their mouth is. 

 

Anyone who says they're booing players taking the knee and it's not racist cos they just don't like the politics of BLM or some nonsense. Absolute bollocks. If you don't like it and supposedly aren't a racist then just shut the **** up and let the black players and everyone get on with making a gesture to say the racists are not welcome. 

 

The level of entitlement these people express in being unwilling to give up 5 seconds of their time at the start of the match is unforgivable. Ban them all and give the season tickets to someone who can support the team without being a ****. 

I agree with most of your post, but think part of the problem is also those that stay quiet which only hides the problem.

 

We need to get this ideology out of people's minds that any prejudice (race, gender, religion, age) is acceptable and not just make people afraid of showing it in public. It doesn't make you less racist imo if you have views and stay quiet or express them to everyone. Education is the only way to reform. 

[Mark_w]

6 minutes ago, BlueSi13 said:

So down to racism then?  No other reasons at all?  

 

Nothing to do with the fact that Black children are 2.5 times more likely to be raised in a single parent home compared to a white child (5 times more likely than an Asian child)? 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/lifeandstyle/2019/mar/06/father-figures-why-the-new-wave-of-visible-black-dads-give-me-hope

 

As for fewer educational opportunities, % of state school pupils getting a higher education place (2020:

 

Chinese - 72%

Asian - 53%

Black - 48%

 

White - 33%

 

https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/education-skills-and-training/higher-education/entry-rates-into-higher-education/latest#by-ethnicity-over-time

Cool. Here's some other fun stuff.

https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/education-skills-and-training/higher-education/undergraduate-degree-results/latest
https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/education-skills-and-training/a-levels-apprenticeships-further-education/further-education-participation/latest
https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/education-skills-and-training/11-to-16-years-old/gcse-results-attainment-8-for-children-aged-14-to-16-key-stage-4/latest
https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/education-skills-and-training/11-to-16-years-old/a-to-c-in-english-and-maths-gcse-attainment-for-children-aged-14-to-16-key-stage-4/latest
https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/education-skills-and-training/a-levels-apprenticeships-further-education/students-aged-16-to-18-achieving-3-a-grades-or-better-at-a-level/latest
https://www.ethnicity-facts-figures.service.gov.uk/education-skills-and-training/a-levels-apprenticeships-further-education/average-score-for-students-taking-a-levels-and-other-qualifications/latest
 

[theessexfox]

9 minutes ago, barnacle said:

Then why was the initial gesture about BLM on the back of shirts, and the knee is in direct response to George Floyd. Perhaps the promoters of this movement should respectfully include all victims of racism.

 

Isn't the Rooney rule racism - only one race gets a leg-up at the expense of other races.

Positive discrimination to try and address historical institutional racial biases isn’t racism, no. Whether it’s an effective solution is another question.

[theessexfox]

10 minutes ago, Nuneatonfox in Manchester said:

Apparently not just Hitler’s judging by the overwhelming support for Hamas in Europe 

Yep it’s definitely support for Hamas, not merely the right for Palestinian people not to be murdered 

[LCFCbwoi]

5 minutes ago, volpeazzurro said:

The report you refer to was the McPherson report following the murder of Stephen Lawrence murder. It was 20yrs ago. There is policing outside the Met. I think all Forces however made great strides in both education and practice. They aren't perfect. Every public service is made up from the general public, some are racist. However, I do honestly believe that it's a minority and sadly, the police, doctors, nurses, fireman, teachers etc are all bodies of people that sometimes get judged by the odd bad individuals and not the in general good work of the majority. Biased media reporting doesn't help either never letting the truth get in the way of a good story for sales and profit. Currently, nurses and other NHS staff are angels but further down the line, they'll get a slagging off too. It's cyclical. 

I don’t disagree that all forces aren’t as bad as the met, however they are this countries biggest force by some way and they also police this countries biggest black communities.

So the report is never going to look well. I also don’t believe our forces are as bad as the US, however completely refuting institutional racism in this country will show no need to change. 

 

I also don’t like to believe the notion that racism in this country stems from lower class, less educated people, as I believe there are people with much more power and wealth who harbour these thoughts and spread them to the masses.

[Nuneatonfox in Manchester]

6 minutes ago, theessexfox said:

Yep it’s definitely support for Hamas, not merely the right for Palestinian people not to be murdered 

What about Israel’s right to not be bombarded with rockets every 5 minutes?

 

Edited 23 May 2021 by Nuneatonfox in Manchester