US Presidential Election 2024

[st albans fox]

39 minutes ago, ealingfox said:

 

I said fleshed-out policies. The coherent reason to vote for Harris is that she is the only candidate with a chance of winning that hasn't previously incited a violent insurrection in response to losing an election. 

Sounds like a good reason not to vote for her 😂

violent insurrections should be avoided 

 

four years of trump will fly by !

 

in all seriousness, if he is going to win then the glass half full view is that he can’t run again and in four years time the dems may have a good candidate able to serve two terms.  I’m simply unconvinced by Harris.  She may be ok once elected but she seems pretty meh and not sure she’d do well on the international stage where you need to be able to strut your stuff these days. 

[MPH]

1 hour ago, Babylon said:

I would love to know the reasoning. America is a strange strange place... whilst they might be smart enough to be a brain surgeon, in America it's so warped around religion, the constitutions and things like guns etc. An incredibly intelligent person can also come across, to us like a total moron because they are a proper bible basher, or gun loving numpty. 

 
Ok.. so to be objective for a minute..

 

For a lot of people, Money is their religion. Or at least, a strong economy. I actually think many Americans are fearful about being anything other than the strongest  / most powerful country in the world  and feel personal well-being is secondary to that. They will be fearful about the rise of China into a superpower and the continuing threat of Russia. They feel comforted by the fact the president just needs to sign a peice of paper and they can win virtually any war. They don’t want to be anything other than. Number one and feel like Trump is the one to do that.

[MPH]

1 hour ago, WigstonWanderer said:

It all depends on whether you think you’ll get the chance to vote again in a free and fair election. I don’t think Americans can take this for granted if Trump gets in. Whatever you think of him as maybe just a joker or a clown, probably quite incompetent at being a real bad guy, he’s got some really dark people around him who might be more competent.

 

I guess we’ll see.

 

he’s campaigned repeatedly  on the promise that those responsible for stealing the previous election will be prosecuted. I’m not buying it for a minute but it will be interesting to see what level of skullduggery goes on to win an election, even if it falls short of being illegal as I’m sure a few things will come to light..

Edited 28 October 2024 by MPH

[Otis]

25 minutes ago, MPH said:

 

well it could be claimed that one is encouraging us to embrace the future and the other is encouraging us to not let go of the past…

True, the future will certainly be enhanced renewables which is great.

But going back to my original point, to harp on about FF subsidies when renewables are double is slightly disingenuous.

[LiberalFox]

It reminds me of the Brexit referendum really. The thick, the bigoted and the well off sociopaths vs the rest. 

 

The difference is that the US is actually a superpower so while it's bad for us and the world if they adopt an America First outlook it might benefit more Americans relative to the idiocy that was Brexit. 

 

 

[leicsmac]

45 minutes ago, Otis said:

Come on now...

You seem to know that fossil fuels are subsidised but don't know the figures for renewables, I find that odd.

 

Renewables keep being touted as the cheaper alternative, but at the same time requiring double the fossil fuel subsidies.  If you ask struggling families which they would prefer, you can guess the answer.

Fossil fuels will be needed until viable alternatives are readily available.i.e renewables and nuclear. 

 

 

To add to the figures given earlier, the point is rather simple: either these solutions are subsidised at cost now, or the US and everywhere else pays much, much more in lives, infrastructure and insurance costs later.

 

26 minutes ago, st albans fox said:

Sounds like a good reason not to vote for her 😂

violent insurrections should be avoided 

 

four years of trump will fly by !

 

in all seriousness, if he is going to win then the glass half full view is that he can’t run again and in four years time the dems may have a good candidate able to serve two terms.  I’m simply unconvinced by Harris.  She may be ok once elected but she seems pretty meh and not sure she’d do well on the international stage where you need to be able to strut your stuff these days. 

And the glass half empty viewpoint is that there will have been irrevocable damage done by that point.

[Lionator]

Two party systems are really, really terrible for democracy. Our parliament FPTP is dreadful as it is but at least we get wider representation in parliament and across local councils. This is a choice between two terrible candidates (one obviously morally worse than the other), and two terrible political parties. Gross. The biggest delusion is democracy. 

[Trav Le Bleu]

Can someone run for the presidency as an independent?

[MPH]

5 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

Can someone run for the presidency as an independent?

 

Yes. RFK originally tried to, and there’s a couple more smaller options still running but the United States electorate hasn’t quite fully embraced the idea of an independent candidate yet… I mean… how can you hate someone when you don’t know what they stand for?!

[Zear0]

9 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

Can someone run for the presidency as an independent?

[HighPeakFox]

I think a lot of people like a bit of fascism, so long as it's their particular brand of fascism. 

 

My view is that if Trump is elected, then what's left of their democracy will be dismantled before he can be removed from power. 

 

That should be reason enough not to vote for him, never mind the countless other reasons that have been iterated here before by numerous others. 

Edited 29 October 2024 by HighPeakFox

[Torquay Gunner]

35 minutes ago, Trav Le Bleu said:

Can someone run for the presidency as an independent?

Ross Perot in 1992, received no electoral college votes, partly because he dropped out in July and did not re-enter until October! 

[MPH]

[Sir Steve Howard]

8 minutes ago, HighPeakFox said:

I think a lot of people like a bit of fascism, so long as it's their particular brand of fascism. 

 

My view is that if Trump us elected, then what's left of their democracy will be dismantled before he can be removed from power. 

 

That should be reason enough not to vote for him, never mind the countless other reasons that have been iterated her before by numerous others. 

This is a tad dramatic, bloke has already served four years as president.

 

What's more worrying is that the Democrats were willing to have a clearly senile man in Biden run for four more years until the infamous debate halted that great plan.

Who's really running things in that scenario? (and right now for that matter, considering he's still in role).

[MPH]

28 minutes ago, HighPeakFox said:

I think a lot of people like a bit of fascism, so long as it's their particular brand of fascism. 

 

My view is that if Trump us elected, then what's left of their democracy will be dismantled before he can be removed from power. 

 

That should be reason enough not to vote for him, never mind the countless other reasons that have been iterated her before by numerous others. 

 

Hmm… as much as a dislike him… if he is Democratically  elected won’t he make any changes whilst covered under the banner of democracy?

 

 

Edited 28 October 2024 by MPH

[Zear0]

3 minutes ago, MPH said:

 

Hmm… as much as a dislike him… if he is Democratically  elected won’t he make any changes whilst covered under the banner of democracy?

 

 

Most fascists were voted in and pulled the drawbridge up behind them. 

[leicsmac]

Just now, Zear0 said:

Most fascists were voted in and pulled the drawbridge up behind them. 

Additionally, let's not pretend January 6th 2021 didn't happen and Trump hasn't at least flirted with subverting democracy before.

[MPH]

 So the Trump campaign are catching flack for  a comedian  filling his slot making jokes about black people and Latinos. At one point calling Puerto Rico ‘ an island full of garbage. This should be headline news and there should be outrage all over the electorate at this but some how it looks like it will just slip by most people.  Sure, Trumps entourage has said that this comedian doesn’t represent his views… but they invited him! You can’t say you didn’t know what he was going to say. Besides… that would be like the Tories inviting Roy Chubby Brown to one of their rallies and acting all surprised when he does one of his racist jokes..

[bovril]

I'm not the greatest fan of American liberalism, but every clip I've seen from the rally yesterday is just the most deranged fascist shit I've ever seen from a developed country's politicians. If I was American I'd be absolutely terrified. Sick country. 

[MPH]

4 minutes ago, Zear0 said:

Most fascists were voted in and pulled the drawbridge up behind them. 

 

as previously mentioned… he didn’t pull the drawbridge in his first 4 years as president..

[leicsmac]

1 minute ago, MPH said:

 So the Trump campaign are catching flack for  a comedian  filling his slot making jokes about black people and Latinos. At one point calling Puerto Rico ‘ an island full of garbage. This should be headline news and there should be outrage all over the electorate at this but some how it looks like it will just slip by most people.  Sure, Trumps entourage has said that this comedian doesn’t represent his views… but they invited him! You can’t say you didn’t know what he was going to say. Besides… that would be like the Tories inviting Roy Chubby Brown to one of their rallies and acting all surprised when he does one of his racist jokes..

 

Just now, bovril said:

I'm not the greatest fan of American liberalism, but every clip I've seen from the rally yesterday is just the most deranged fascist shit I've ever seen from a developed country's politicians. If I was American I'd be absolutely terrified. Sick country. 

Why should people be outraged now?

 

Trump and his followers have been mask off for years now, behaviour like this is who they really are and always have been and it's been normalised to the point that people clearly accept it.

[Zear0]

6 minutes ago, MPH said:

 

as previously mentioned… he didn’t pull the drawbridge in his first 4 years as president..

He literally tried to overturn an election he lost. 

[MPH]

2 minutes ago, leicsmac said:

 

Why should people be outraged now?

 

Trump and his followers have been mask off for years now, behaviour like this is who they really are and always have been and it's been normalised to the point that people clearly accept it.

 

well it’s been normalized by Trump supporters. But it’s not likely to be the Trump supporters who decide this election but the swing voters and specifically his increase in support by  Spanish speaking and black minorities… 

[MPH]

1 minute ago, Zear0 said:

He literally tried to overturn an election he lost. 

so he did a very bad job of closing the drawbridge then if he originally allowed an open election 

[leicsmac]

Just now, MPH said:

 

well it’s been normalized by Trump supporters. But it’s not likely to be the Trump supporters who decide this election but the swing voters and specifically his increase in support by  Spanish speaking and black minorities… 

I guess it's a case of "better much later than never" if they finally get the hint now, then. Considering how long it's been fairly obvious for.