1969 Moon Landing

[breadandcheese]

This thread is definitely one of my favourites.

- The Cold war was a myth. Actually, America and Russia were besties. Maybe Stalin and Eisenhower were lovers?

- The guy who discovered the Van Allen belt is actually a liar, apart from his discovery.

[Zingari]

This thread is definitely one of my favourites.

- The Cold war was a myth. Actually, America and Russia were besties. Maybe Stalin and Eisenhower were lovers?

- The guy who discovered the Van Allen belt is actually a liar, apart from his discovery.

I'm sure I saw a film once that produced a lot of evidence that the U.S. Banks financed the Russian revolution.

It may have been complete bollox though

[fleckneymike]

This thread is definitely one of my favourites.

- The Cold war was a myth. Actually, America and Russia were besties. Maybe Stalin and Eisenhower were lovers?

- The guy who discovered the Van Allen belt is actually a liar, apart from his discovery.

I too love this thread.

I am still eagerly awaiting the scientific explanation as to why we can travel through the Van Allen belts.

[breadandcheese]

I'm sure I saw a film once that produced a lot of evidence that the U.S. Banks financed the Russian revolution.

It may have been complete bollox though

I'm not sure any bank would fund a communist/bolshevik revolution as it would mean the nationalisation of all the country's assets. It is the same as turkeys voting for Christmas.

[Zingari]

I too love this thread.

I am still eagerly awaiting the scientific explanation as to why we can travel through the Van Allen belts.

do you mean can't ?

Has China , Russia or anyone else other than NASA sent any life form ( dog cat monkey etc) through the VABs yet and returned them safely and unharmed ?

[Captain...]

do you mean can't ?

Has China , Russia or anyone else other than NASA sent any life form ( dog cat monkey etc) through the VABs yet and returned them safely and unharmed ?

We can, it's just their might be consequences.

[Zingari]

I'm not sure any bank would fund a communist/bolshevik revolution as it would mean the nationalisation of all the country's assets. It is the same as turkeys voting for Christmas.

i've just spent a few minutes reading a few websites and there are many saying that the Rothschilds / Schiff were major financiers .

Obviously I can't vouch for their veracity , but the reasons are given as to why they did it ( if true)

I won't bother with any links it's easier just to look for yourself for whichever sources you believe credible .

[breadandcheese]

http://www.telegraph...rs-landing.html

Mankind 'only a decade away' from Mars landing

Mankind could only be a decade away from walking on Mars, a Nasa scientist has said, as the US space agency makes its final preparations to land a one-tonne exploratory rover – the largest yet – on the barren planet.

A probe the size of a small car will hurtle through the Martian atmosphere at 13,000mph early on Monday morning using engineering which, if successful, could lay the path for the first manned Mars landing.

Using a giant £1.67 billion heat shield, the world’s biggest supersonic parachute and eight rocket thrusters, scientists hope Curiosity, a super robot kitted out with 17 cameras and dozens of sampling instruments, will be the test of technological prowess needed to prove an astronaut could eventually descend on the Red Planet in the future.

“If we had the motive, if it was important enough I would say within 10 years we could be there,†Adam Steltzner, the lead mechanical engineer for the entry, told The Daily Telegraph.

“Putting men on Mars is not unachievable. It is just really hard and expensive. So if the world were to find itself with enough resources and the motivation, we could do it.â€

Scientists will use a “guided entry†system to land the Curiosity rover, with jet boosters firing at the back of the craft to help her steer through the atmosphere towards the Gale crater landing site.

The descent is expected to reach more than 10 Earth Gs.

It will take a nail-biting “seven minutes of terror†for Curiosity to land, but 14 minutes until Nasa’s more than 100-strong team of scientists will discover the fate of the probe and whether a combined three centuries of human investment has paid off.

“There is a little bit of apprehension but you have to be just a little nervous every time you go to Mars,†Doug McCuistion, director of the Mars Exploration Programme, said.

“Everyone is confident that they have done everything humanly possible to make sure that this will work. Now it’s a matter of putting it all together.â€

Technicians have installed sensors on the heat shield, which is designed to detach as the parachute is deployed, to measure pressure levels and thermal impact during the entry phase.

The heat shield designed for Curiosity’s landing is very similar in size and type to the thermal shield on the Orion deep-space capsule, a craft currently in development which will carry four crew members.

Radiation data will also be collected during the descent to test whether man could tolerate emission fluctuations caused by solar storms from inside a capsule.

“We will learn an enormous amount about what it takes on guided entry visual, what the impacts are on the thermal protection systems and what the atmosphere looks like,†Mr McCuistion said.

“This coupled with the RAD (Radiation Assessment Detector) data really pushes us further into the future and the potential to get humans to Mars.â€

Experts at Nasa's Jet Propulsion Laboratory said conditions were “looking good†for the Mars landing on Monday morning, scheduled for impact just after 6.30am.

[leicsmac]

As an astrophysicist I find the idea that we didn't land on the Moon one of the most laughable of conspiracy theories, and to be honest there's not much I can add in terms of trying to convince the sceptics that hasn't already been said on this pretty comprehensive thread. And what is more the attitude on here is so ingrained on both sides that I do not feel the inclination to attempt it, either...no-one is going to change their opinion on here regardless of what anyone says.

Web links or anecdotal evidence in this case are pretty much worthless as both will be called lies/faked, so I guess it just comes down to who you've talked to, what you've read, and what you believe personally. And having talked to many influential people in the space industry, I believe that we made it....purely because if we didn't the magnitude of the conspiracy is such that SOMEONE would have got to know about it, and shown clear, incontrovertible proof (eg. the site where the faked landing took place).

[Guest Bilo]

Does El Empty think that the US, USSR or Great Britain have ever achieved anything worthy of credit that can't be disputed with a crackpot conspiracy theory?

Answers on a postcard please.

[Darkon84]

I'm sure I saw a film once that produced a lot of evidence that the U.S. Banks financed the Russian revolution.

It may have been complete bollox though

Well they managed to back/supply/finance both sides of the war in WWII soooooooooooo......

[fleckneymike]

do you mean can't ?

Has China , Russia or anyone else other than NASA sent any life form ( dog cat monkey etc) through the VABs yet and returned them safely and unharmed ?

Thank you for correcting my typo. No one other than the USA have sent men (21 to be precise) through the VAB. I am still awaiting scientific evidence as to why travel through the VAB is impossible for a human.

[davieG]

i've just spent a few minutes reading a few websites and there are many saying that the Rothschilds / Schiff were major financiers .

Obviously I can't vouch for their veracity , but the reasons are given as to why they did it ( if true)

I won't bother with any links it's easier just to look for yourself for whichever sources you believe credible .

I'd guess that was a financial rather than a political move, they were good at predicting winners and they obviously weren't to fussed about who they backed as long as they ended up richer.

[fleckneymike]

I'd guess that was a financial rather than a political move, they were good at predicting winners and they obviously weren't to fussed about who they backed as long as they ended up richer.

Quite. Much in the same the way they lent money to us during the Napoleonic wars.

[Zingari]

Thank you for correcting my typo. No one other than the USA have sent men (21 to be precise) through the VAB. I am still awaiting scientific evidence as to why travel through the VAB is impossible for a human.

Surely the very fact that no one other than NASA has sent even a small mammal through these belts really does look a little suspicious though.

How can any of us prove one way or the other if they are safe . How do you know if the data you're working by is true/correct ? Why did NASA announce them to be more dangerous than previously thought?

The moon landings may very real ( I really don't know) but you've a least got to consider that a suspicious mind would find this very odd considering the massive leaps in technology etc in the intervening years .

Surely there have been enough missions through the belts for at least one of them to take a little monkey along for the ride , if only just to put the issue to bed.

If you believe them not to be a problem and proven to be harmless , that's fine, but I really ain't totally convinced yet.

Enjoying your input though it keeps El Empty on his toes

[fleckneymike]

Surely the very fact that no one other than NASA has sent even a small mammal through these belts really does look a little suspicious though.

How can any of us prove one way or the other if they are safe . How do you know if the data you're working by is true/correct ? Why did NASA announce them to be more dangerous than previously thought?

The moon landings may very real ( I really don't know) but you've a least got to consider that a suspicious mind would find this very odd considering the massive leaps in technology etc in the intervening years .

Surely there have been enough missions through the belts for at least one of them to take a little monkey along for the ride , if only just to put the issue to bed.

If you believe them not to be a problem and proven to be harmless , that's fine, but I really ain't totally convinced yet.

Enjoying your input though it keeps El Empty on his toes

Why would a Monkey be better evidence than 21 men?

The science behind the VAB is what enable us to prove they are safe, and the good thing about science is that it is open to everyone and has to be peer reviewed. In order for the science behind the VAB to be flawed it would require the entire scientific community to be in on it, it would also require all other science based on the same equations and formulae to be false also.

[Babylon]

How can any of us prove one way or the other if they are safe

If people are going to use it as a reason as to why it didn't and couldn't have happened, then you would hope they have some evidence to back that up.

[Captain...]

There is also the possibility that the severity and strength of the van allen belt has increased over the years, possibly due to them detonating nuclear weapons up there, or the destruction of our ozone layer, or other man made effects.

This would also not be something they would want to make public, because it would expose the damage we are doing in the name of progress.

The Van Allen belt is not a physical wall we can pass through it now, as we did before, the only difference is we understand it much better, and may not have the technology now to pass through it without putting human passengers at unnecessary risk.

I am happy to believe that NASA is not being 100% honest about things, and a few things don't add up, but the ludicrous notion that we faked the whole thing is so laughable that it distracts from any other wrong doing or lies from NASA, and that is probably why they are happy for it to keep on going.

[Babylon]

Why would a Monkey be better evidence than 21 men?

And if they had sent a monkey through to prove it, the doubters would turn around and say Russia/China or whomever sent it up there were part of the plot etc etc etc etc.

You are expecting irrational people to accept a rational explanation, not going to happen. Their minds are mind up...no matter how much they deny it.

[fleckneymike]

There is also the possibility that the severity and strength of the van allen belt has increased over the years, possibly due to them detonating nuclear weapons up there, or the destruction of our ozone layer, or other man made effects.

This would also not be something they would want to make public, because it would expose the damage we are doing in the name of progress.

The Van Allen belt is not a physical wall we can pass through it now, as we did before, the only difference is we understand it much better, and may not have the technology now to pass through it without putting human passengers at unnecessary risk.

I am happy to believe that NASA is not being 100% honest about things, and a few things don't add up, but the ludicrous notion that we faked the whole thing is so laughable that it distracts from any other wrong doing or lies from NASA, and that is probably why they are happy for it to keep on going.

If the strength of the VAB has increased we can tell as we can measure it.

What elements of the Apollo programme don't add up to people.

It is incredible arrogance to use the line of logic that because an individual cannot understand something that it therefore cannot be true.

[fleckneymike]

And if they had sent a monkey through to prove it, the doubters would turn around and say Russia/China or whomever sent it up there were part of the plot etc etc etc etc.

You are expecting irrational people to accept a rational explanation, not going to happen. Their minds are mind up...no matter how much they deny it.

I'm not expecting us all to turn into Spock but I would have thought most of us are prepared to listen to logic and science. Scepticism is healthy, dogma and intransigence is not.

[Babylon]

If the strength of the VAB has increased we can tell as we can measure it.

Or the equipment to measure it is better than used previously, or more samples were taken etc etc etc. There could be any number of reasons as to why they think it's different to before.

[Captain...]

If the strength of the VAB has increased we can tell as we can measure it.

What elements of the Apollo programme don't add up to people.

It is incredible arrogance to use the line of logic that because an individual cannot understand something that it therefore cannot be true.

Things like we don't have the technology now to go to the money and it would take a decade to develop it, when it was originally developed in a much shorter space of time, 50 years ago. That the plans for the original space suits have been lost, along with some of the moon rocks and other things that just don't sound plausible.

I am not saying that we didn't go to the moon, I am just saying that NASA allow this conspiracy theory to continue for their own gains.

[marty78]

I'm sure someone has probably mentioned this but the reason we don't send Men/Women into Space like we did then is because we have realized it is cheaper, easier and more productive to send computer operated robotic equipment. If we send a man the general public will expect that man to return safely when probes/robots can be left on Planets, Moons or even asteroids and they can get there with no food, oxygen and all the other things which men need that increases the weight of a spacecraft significantly. Look at equipment that is still sending information now, many years after being launched to see that sending men is not needed.

The only reason to send man to the Moon again is to say "we done that". If it does get done again then my money would be on China, so they can show the world they are now a truly global powerhouse. It will accomplish nothing else though.

[Zingari]

Why would a Monkey be better evidence than 21 men?

The science behind the VAB is what enable us to prove they are safe, and the good thing about science is that it is open to everyone and has to be peer reviewed. In order for the science behind the VAB to be flawed it would require the entire scientific community to be in on it, it would also require all other science based on the same equations and formulae to be false also.

If NASA did it it would of course then it would be no more evidence , but the problem is that only NASA have claimed to achieve it.And that's the big problem in beleving it .

Why is every other country with ambitions of manned moon missions still incapable or of doing it now ?

It can't be finances , political will , danger etc in the case of China etc

Surely they would be very keen to see the radio active effect it has on life before manned missions were attempted .

If another country such as China or Russia were to do it now ( out of NASA control) then it would at least confirm that the VABs are safe to transit .

But until then I'm pretty sure many people will continue to be very suspicious.

I love being suspicious though and I'd probably be very disappointed if i found for definite it was real