Answers from Peter Jones

[Raj]

Jamie.

Spoke to PJ tonight and he said that he awaits a response from you for a meeting.

No use going on about it on here but just arrange a face to face meeting and take it from there.

[Floating Fox]

Jamie.

Spoke to PJ tonight and he said that he awaits a response from you for a meeting.

No use going on about it on here but just arrange a face to face meeting and take it from there.

Don't worry we'll take it up. I am so keen on having a good rant at the club.

EDIT: Raj, when is the fans consultive meeting?

[Raj]

Don't worry we'll take it up. I am so keen on having a good rant at the club.

EDIT: Raj, when is the fans consultive meeting?

Standup...FCC meeting was last night.

Good luck with your meeting

[ozleicester]

Good luck Standup et al,

[Simi]

I'd personally like all three of these things to happen, as a lot of you would. But for the reasons stated above I just can't see any of them realistically happening unfortunately.

I really don't know what to say.

Statements like this are reasons why there is never progression.

[lcfc_jme]

I'd personally like all three of these things to happen, as a lot of you would. But for the reasons stated above I just can't see any of them realistically happening unfortunately.

And I wonder who one of the first people to jump on board the bandwagon should anything get changed will be...?

I despair sometimes, I really do. People who proclaim themselves pro-change and want things to improve jumping ship because certain influential figures aren't convinced by ideas. It's laughable, in my "brutally honest" opinion.

ched & jme... thanks for responding to my socialist rant, i know what you are saying, hell, it seems you really want to make changes, which is applaudable... however you have to accept that this is going to be a long, drawn out battle...

ok n-block failed, i'm afraid i don't know why, i assume there is still a body of people in L1 tho? you obviously want this and i guess, based on your responses to my post, you have to ask yourself a couple of things....

1. 'being ridiculed' - sorry, but that is something you will have to accept is gonna happen, a small price to pay, surely?

2. 'attitude problems' - well, either you just say 'fu(k it, these little bastards don't deserve a decent atmosphere' or you talk to them at half time, try to get over the spirit and the element of respect without seeming patronising (tricky, i know), try to get them to go to away games, to see how it can be, invite them along, maybe that will be 'cool' for them?

3. organising numbers - of course it is difficult, but that s what the club respond to unfortunately, hopefully now we're winning at home, this might get easier, but again it's all about communication

4. 'the club' - of course they'll try to stop you, but you have to play them at their own game - i know its shitty but it comes down to determination, singing while your sitting down, being prepared to get ejected, say everyone stands up with five minutes to go and just sings their heart out, if enough people do it, with everyone leaving, the stewards won't be able to do anything....

anyway, just some thoughts, i admire what you're doing and know why you want it so much, so good luck lads, you'll need it.

1. We accept that we will be ridiculed - as we did with N Block. We got over it. As long as the criticism is constructive, it's fine by us. It's the pathetic, teenage-girl, baseless, for-the-sake-of-it-because-everyone-else-thinks-it criticism that annoys us. Have your own opinions ffs don't hide behind influential people and jump on their bandwagon because it's the "in-thing" to do. Change will never come about that way.

2. We don't wish to say "fook it", that's not us. We're determined to bring about some sort of positive change - that's why we, especially me, haven't let N Block put us off or this latest set-back. We want things to change and are commited to getting things done, which is why we've proposed meeting dates already and are awaiting a response. We'll work on trying to encourage people to join in, but with our nonplussed and happy-clapping support at present, it'll be a long, mostly fruitless battle. We will try though.

3. Regardless of whether we're winning or not, we want committed people. I mean, I don't even care if these people are part-timers ffs. If they're willing to join in, then I'm not fooking bothered how many games they come to. It's the people that attend all the time and moan yet couldn't care less and don't want to try that get my goat. You can't have it both ways - put up or fooking shut up. But for the love of God, if people want to try, don't turn around and give them an icy stare, leave them to it and let them enjoy themselves.

4. I'm not bothered about stewards anymore - I've got to the point where I'd happily take another ban from the ground. I'm wiser now than I was last time, I'd fight the ban with more vigour than I did last time. I know more this time from talking to various sources, and I know now what my rights are and what legal powers stewards and police have in these situations respectively. The club wouldn't get away with it so easily this time. If it takes me sacrificing one game, one ticket cost to make people stand up and take note, so be it. Let's face it, nobody else will bother will they?

Jamie.

Spoke to PJ tonight and he said that he awaits a response from you for a meeting.

No use going on about it on here but just arrange a face to face meeting and take it from there.

Raj, I respect and value your opinions on here more than I do most, but to be honest I'm not going to cease my open criticism of something I consider insulting and derogatory, as well as hypocritical, just because there are other options open. I've kept my mouth shut before, I'm not doing it anymore, and if that annoys some then I'm sorry but they're going to have to deal with it, just as I have to deal with the "match-day experience" and the wall of silence from the club. "If you don't like it don't turn up" you might say? If people don't like what I'm saying, don't read it and block me. I'm having to put a lot more effort in what with people jumping ship all the time and all the apathy in our support, so I will take any criticism with a pinch of salt and not let it deter me from the matter at hand.

[Geo V]

Jamie.

Spoke to PJ tonight and he said that he awaits a response from you for a meeting.

No use going on about it on here but just arrange a face to face meeting and take it from there.

Raj will be there too so bring the vaseline

[Raj]

Raj, I respect and value your opinions on here more than I do most, but to be honest I'm not going to cease my open criticism of something I consider insulting and derogatory, as well as hypocritical, just because there are other options open. I've kept my mouth shut before, I'm not doing it anymore, and if that annoys some then I'm sorry but they're going to have to deal with it, just as I have to deal with the "match-day experience" and the wall of silence from the club. "If you don't like it don't turn up" you might say? If people don't like what I'm saying, don't read it and block me. I'm having to put a lot more effort in what with people jumping ship all the time and all the apathy in our support, so I will take any criticism with a pinch of salt and not let it deter me from the matter at hand.

J.

I didnt mean my comment "No use going on about it on here" to mean to stop talking about the situation.

Just meant it as put an end to the cussing of PJ, set up a meeting and see what the club has to say about your agenda.

[Geo V]

J.

I didnt mean my comment "No use going on about it on here" to mean to stop talking about the situation.

Just meant it as put an end to the cussing of PJ, set up a meeting and see what the club has to say about your agenda.

Trouble maker

[Joe.]

And I wonder who one of the first people to jump on board the bandwagon should anything get changed will be...?

I despair sometimes, I really do. People who proclaim themselves pro-change and want things to improve jumping ship because certain influential figures aren't convinced by ideas. It's laughable, in my "brutally honest" opinion.

I'd be delighted if you got what you wanted out of this and I respect you, Ched and Andy a lot for everything you try and do honestly.

Not quite sure what you mean by jumping on the bandwagon though.

You're fighting a battle not just against things that happen at this club, it's pretty much everything that football has turned into.

[Raj]

Raj will be there too so bring the vaseline

Trouble maker

You can stop stirring it un all!!!!

[Kilworthfox]

The reply from PJ is one you guys must have expected, but were still obviously disappointed with. This leaves the fans still angered & frustrated at the little respect that has been once again shown by the clubs representatives to the fans who want change. I'm not even too bothered if I and you others are in the majority anymore, I'm happy with how I perceive the matchday experiance and I'm not happy about 95% of it discounting the match.

The answers are to be found within this thread from many respected posters on Foxestalk, all that needs to happen is they need to be joined up to come up with a conclusion so the next action can be decided and put into action not cheap talk(not accusing anyone of that ).

As we all know a group of fans between what 1000+ fans are fed up of the restrictive rules which govern how we watch a football match and now to top it off we seem to have our traditional music and atmosphere traded in for a cheap yokal knock off which is not and will never be our style. What we collectively need to do is unite the people who believe that something however small with the way our matchday is being tainted with this new wave of commercialism. There is no point in 1's 2's 3's or 4's going to PJ or whoever as it results in the responses that we have all had if you write to anyone at LCFC.

On their own these people cannot and will; not do a thing to make a change. So it is my recommendation that we all must get together and create a group of fans who believe that something has to be done so that our views are recognised seriously and not just passed on and forgotten about. If there is some things that you are unhappy about then your in the group! As a group with good numbers the club cannot just bypass you so easily as they can an individual or small group.

Until you unite your support and make yourselves a collective voice wanting change you are just 1 or 5 people against 20000 and the club will use their fob off lines about majorities and such.

I think if a group of people was formed, you would not even consult the club anymore! You would do whatever you liked: Move to the west stand for instance and stand and sing there for a season? Why not? You would make yourselves heard! Also what are they going to do if 1000 paying customers all do the same thing. One thing is essential tho......... you have to stick together, if not no one cares and the idea fails and you end up with what we currently have, and deserve as IMO we have shit fans (someone who does not consistently get behind their team win lose or draw) who want atmosphere but do nothing (in the majority) to create that atmosphere.

What you must stop feeling is that you are only a kds or just 1 person against the majority as you have as much right to vent your opinions as I do or anyone else as you pay your money and you are not happy with the product you receive. Excuses do need to be gotten rid of but how? Well IMO once again as a group of fans united in the same cause you would be more difficult to shut up together rather than individually, which is what everyone seems to have been doing on their own. Many people on here are all frustrated as I see it just with different things but we all seem to see that something has to be done and that the current methods are not working. Being reasonable individually is not working is it!

The club is suiting its own needs, pressure needs to be put on the club by its source of support and income. Possibly those who do sing should be quiet for 1 half of a game (fook me who would know the difference ) and then make a mighty effort in the 2nd for example?

If we were to get a group of "singers" or "lads" together it is not something that could be done gradually, it would have to be done instantly possibly the start of next season when there is time to organise. I would love it if it could be in the west stand! Would make my day as it would be on all the cameras and the traditional quiet side would be in shock.

Do we as fans need to be controlled with music when we are in our delirious states after we score?

Do we need to be told that standing is unsafe in modern arenas?

Do we want to become fans like Bolton and Middlesborough? DU DU DU DU

If the club don't want another L1 then lets make one! why not, get noticed!

I have a question, why do the club have these little meetings, come out with statements like we want to improve atmosphere and then take sides of those traditionally quiet areas over the singing fans? I.E N block last year?

If you feel the need to not be a shit fan, and as they say stand up and be counted, I for one am happy enough to make a difference, or give, giving it a go a try.

Can we start? Take some names and get some support from those in L1 the top of the Kop or anyone else who is disillusioned. I'm so willing to help change things, as i'm fooked off with these dead bodies who watch us play.

Frustrated and angry KilworthFox

[lildave3]

Don't worry we'll take it up. I am so keen on having a good rant at the club.

EDIT: Raj, when is the fans consultive meeting?

Can I come and sit in a corner, just to watch you rant at the club? Would cheer me up no end.

[Simi]

I'd be delighted if you got what you wanted out of this and I respect you, Ched and Andy a lot for everything you try and do honestly.

Not quite sure what you mean by jumping on the bandwagon though.

You're fighting a battle not just against things that happen at this club, it's pretty much everything that football has turned into.

Why be delighted if you're not willing to help any way other than respect?

Respect gets you nowhere. Action does.

[dave the caveman]

The atmosphere in football grounds across the country and beyond has fallen dramtically over the last decade or so.

It's no longer about getting the lads together to go and cheer on the boys. It's about having a nice family day out. It's soft, lame, pink patterns and pretty roses garbage. It's pathetic. I'm no chav supporter, i don't want to throw coins at the opposing fans. But i also don't want screaming kids and upset mothers. I want a football ground experience. Not 'The Walkers Stadium Experience'. I don't want some abysmal, cheesy, cringeworthy tack-meister3000 music coming on after the goals. What is this? Is it a disco? No. It's a football ground. Shouldn't we be celebrating now? Yes, but the families prefer to sit down quickly and enjoy the music, and we can't be upsetting the families now, they're the future etc etc

Unfortunately, while the club is still bringing in the gate reciepts, they're not going to change a thing.

So if you really want change you have to vote with your feet and not go.

[Daggers]

There was a paradigm shift in football the day the Premier League was created and to a certain extent I find the raging against the 'ills of the modern game' a Luddite response.

Music is in the game for good - see the amount of people waving their hands after a goal? That's people enjoying it. See people clapping in time as the teams come out? Ditto. There's more of them than there are of us, far more.

As for banning kids from the Kop? Some of you are ****ed in the head. You are either too young to remember or old enough that senility has set in; "kids" have always been present in Kops the length and breadth of the country. Exactly how do you think banning someone from a section of the ground based on age would stack up in court? Let's ban woman from grounds while we're at it, eh? Shit! Football was always better in the old days without them at grounds with their fancy perfume and breasts and stuff.

If any problem exists with respect to atmosphere, and I don't acknowledge that the atmosphere in the Kop is that bad at the moment, then it gets solved by improved performances on the pitch. The silence that accompanies a poor run of form or a poor patch in the game isn't linked to this club, it isn't down to the location of sections, women or children. It is a national character of the game at present that the club can do nothing about other than buy better players and play better - it's that simple.

The only major improvement in the game I see is that of the re-introduction of the choice to stand at matches - and that comes, as has been pointed out, by lobbying the clubs and MP's.

Getting pissed off with, and pissing off, the club will get no one anywhere.

[Webbo]

< Common sense>

I couldn't put it as eloquently as that, but basically dead right.

[dave the caveman]

Music is in the game for good - see the amount of people waving their hands after a goal? That's people enjoying it. See people clapping in time as the teams come out? Ditto. There's more of them than there are of us, far more.

When i'm cheering and waving my hands after a goal, i'm not disco-bopping, i'm celebrating the goal.

When i'm clapping the team out at the start, i'm not dad-dancing, i'm clapping for the team.

Music or no music, people will still celebrate goals, and people will still clap out the teams. All the music does is stifle the noise and get people to sit down and be quiet quicker, thus causing a negative effect on the atmosphere.

As for banning kids from the Kop? Some of you are ****ed in the head. You are either too young to remember or old enough that senility has set in; "kids" have always been present in Kops the length and breadth of the country. Exactly how do you think banning someone from a section of the ground based on age would stack up in court? Let's ban woman from grounds while we're at it, eh? Shit! Football was always better in the old days without them at grounds with their fancy perfume and breasts and stuff.

This is a pain to explain because its so obvious. Some people want to let off some steam at football matches, they want to shout chant loudly and shout abuse and such. They want to be in an area with like minded people who will join them. They don't want to be doing that in the presence of young families.

Not that it matters, but i don't think there would be any problems in a courtroom. Its not illegal to ban kids from any establishment if there is good reason.

[shrood]

If any problem exists with respect to atmosphere, and I don't acknowledge that the atmosphere in the Kop is that bad at the moment, then it gets solved by improved performances on the pitch. The silence that accompanies a poor run of form or a poor patch in the game isn't linked to this club, it isn't down to the location of sections, women or children. It is a national character of the game at present that the club can do nothing about other than buy better players and play better - it's that simple.

I'm fed up of this argument. People have forgotten that it is possible to sing when you're losing, to lift them and spur them on. We did this at Filbo and even in the first year at the Walkers, but suddenly everyone is happy to accept we're one of those clubs that will only vocally get behind our boys when they're winning week in, week out. It's got nothing to do with modern football. I've been to plenty of away matches where the home team has been fooking shit and their fans have still got right behind them.

Of course winning every week would probably be the most effective way of improving atmosphere but adjustments off the pitch would really help to.

[Jay]

I'm fed up of this argument. People have forgotten that it is possible to sing when you're losing, to lift them and spur them on. We did this at Filbo and even in the first year at the Walkers, but suddenly everyone is happy to accept we're one of those clubs that will only vocally get behind our boys when they're winning week in, week out. It's got nothing to do with modern football. I've been to plenty of away matches where the home team has been fooking shit and their fans have still got right behind them.

Of course winning every week would probably be the most effective way of improving atmosphere but adjustments off the pitch would really help to.

but in them days we had a pride, passion and belief that those one the pitch were giving 100% for the club and that even at 1-0 or 2-0 down that we would battle for every ball and keep playing till the end over the last few years I believe that many fans have become disillusioned with what they have been watching and the mercenaries wandering around on the pitch and what was happening to the club

I think Holloway said something about if the fans in the stands can see the team on the pitch giving everything for the club then they would give their all in the stands and I personally think thats a fair comment and I don't think he was far off the mark the negative atmosphere within the club was in the stands and on the pitch

[shrood]

but in them days we had a pride, passion and belief that those one the pitch were giving 100% for the club and that even at 1-0 or 2-0 down that we would battle for every ball and keep playing till the end over the last few years I believe that many fans have become disillusioned with what they have been watching and the mercenaries wandering around on the pitch and what was happening to the club

I think Holloway said something about if the fans in the stands can see the team on the pitch giving everything for the club then they would give their all in the stands and I personally think thats a fair comment and I don't think he was far off the mark the negative atmosphere within the club was in the stands and on the pitch

I agree fans are less likely to get behind the team if the team is playing like it just doesn't give two ****s but I think you're looking through rose-tinted glasses if you think in the past we always played with pride, passion and belief. I'm not talking about being 1-0 down in the Martin era. I've witnessed some absolutely abysmal performaces where the fans were far far more vocal than they would be nowadays.

[Daggers]

<re: clapping & music>

Do you know how many people are dancing to Chelsea Dagger, waving their arms up and down in time to the music? I'll give you a clue - next to every single one of them. And you know what? They are enjoying it.

This is a pain to explain because its so obvious. Some people want to let off some steam at football matches, they want to shout chant loudly and shout abuse and such. They want to be in an area with like minded people who will join them. They don't want to be doing that in the presence of young families.

Go back to my post, re-read it and then see if you can spot the bit where I've already covered your point.

Not that it matters, but i don't think there would be any problems in a courtroom. Its not illegal to ban kids from any establishment if there is good reason.

Wrong.

[shrood]

Do you know how many people are dancing to Chelsea Dagger, waving their arms up and down in time to the music? I'll give you a clue - next to every single one of them. And you know what? They are enjoying it.

I agree most people join in but that doesn't really give us a fair representation of how many people want the music. Me and my mates would much rather the music wasn't there but we join in to an extent, Leicester have just scored for ****s sake, we're not gunna stand still. When we're jumping around celebrating maybe we should ensure we don't do it 'in time to the music' just so it makes it clear we'd prefer it without?! I'm sure there are others like me who don't want CD but aren't going to not celebrate goals as some form of protest.

[yorkthorpe]

after reading the eight pages of repling to answers from pj, i think its pretty obvious pjs answer " you cant please everyone " to be spot on, there are not to many answers that all want exactly the same changes. if pj does read foxestalk, what changes and whos ideas does he warrent to listen to. a signed petition never works as anybody could put as many names down as they like,a questionaire could be filled out on match day 1 reply per person handed in at the turnstyle, at least that way you would get a proper reading of what the real fans want changed. there are many good ideas in the forum, but your going to have to be pretty well united on any of them for pj or anybody at lcfc to even look at changes because " you cant please everyone ".

city 4 life

[Guest]

This is a pain to explain because its so obvious. Some people want to let off some steam at football matches, they want to shout chant loudly and shout abuse and such. They want to be in an area with like minded people who will join them. They don't want to be doing that in the presence of young families.

Not that it matters, but i don't think there would be any problems in a courtroom. Its not illegal to ban kids from any establishment if there is good reason.

Silly, silly, silly.

Yes, there are people who want a sanitised atmosphere. Not all of them have children.

There are also people who want their kids to experience the full match day atmosphere, as much as they want to experience it themselves. Don't forget, these are the kids who will be the adults of the future who will be singing the songs that they learnt whilst they were just nippers.

Just out of interest, what is the good reason for banning kids from football matches?