Multiculturalism has failed

[FoxyPV]

Is this not just islamophobia? I don't see how you can say multiculturalism has failed when most asian, African, carribean, European immigrants have settled and acclimatised to British culture. In some cases their culture has been celebrated as part of our own I.e Chinese new year, Diwali etc.

The problem English people have with culture is that for too long their identity has been based on being the coloniser or a superpower and a paternalistic view of the rest of the world. Any challenge to this view completely baffles them and leaves them at a loss as to their own national identity.

Let's not get sidetracked- this is state sponsored islamophobia.

[Guest Basildon Fox]

Multiculturalism does not work but a Multiracial system could. At the end of the day if I went to somebody else's country I would respect their laws and tradition. When you have a society that tries to adapt to everything and everyone it ends in the chaos we have in our country today. If people who emegrated to this country were to respect the laws and the freedom we have in this country we could all live together in a much more peaceful way.

I do not expect everyone to agree with this but there we go.

[Nick]

Well, Nick Griffin Thracian will be happy.

[Nick]

BlueBrett gets a lot of shit, but the man talks sense.

When?

[Nick]

Whilst i'm not totally disagreeing with you and accept there may be an element of truth in your assertion of "state sponsored terrorism" , surely this will only work if there is an already deep seated problem of mistrust and cultural conflict

Hmm but with Western Foreign Policy being as it is, I would struggle to believe that there wouldn't be deep seated mistrust and cultural conflict.

[Nick]

Aye, just like Israel and Palestine have been good mates for years, there always sending each other rockets

That's nearer a situation of civil war (Created largely by historical western foreign policy I might add) not an example of poor multi-cultural integration.

[dave the caveman]

Britain has achieved multiculturalism by becoming relatively cultureLESS. Especially combined with the ever increasing apathy and laziness of modern society and, of course, the glutinous over-consumption of American cultural content.

When I read things like this I always wonder exactly what parts of our culture we have actually lost? What actual things, activities, thoughts, or whatever makes up 'culture', can/do we no longer do or see or feel? And how much of that loss is as a direct result of multiculturalism and not, say, technological advancements or globalisation?

Let's not get sidetracked- this is state sponsored islamophobia.

Read the speech before you say things like this. Cameron pandered heavily to Islam on more than one occasion. He didn't even directly say that multiculturalism has failed, he said that previous policies have failed with regards to home grown terrorists.

I don't know whether he'll be dissapointed or pleased by the slant that has been put on this by the media. On the one hand it appears to disregard the huge amounts of progress that has been made in creating genuine, working multicultural societies (not least in Leicester), but on the other, it'll surely drum up support from the great swathes of daily mail readers who will no doubt be delighted by him 'telling it how it is'.

Which is of course, exactly what he's not doing. If he was doing that he would say, "terrorism is irrelevent, lets forget it and move on." But then what's the point of instilling fear into society if you're not going to use it to get votes.

[Webbo]

Reading some of the comments on here I now realise what a success multiculturalism has been. There is absolutely no ethnic tensions and no resentment at all.

[dave the caveman]

Reading some of the comments on here I now realise what a success multiculturalism has been. There is absolutely no ethnic tensions and no resentment at all.

Yes because there is absolutely no chance that tensions and resentment between races is just a natural extension of the tensions and resentment between human beings in general, proven beyond all doubt by the indisputable fact that when you remove all racial diversity from a popuation it becomes completely harmonious: a paradise, free from any problems at all.

I have a headache right now but I wouldn't if there wasn't a black man living upstairs.

[Webbo]

Yes because there is absolutely no chance that tensions and resentment between races is just a natural extension of the tensions and resentment between human beings in general, proven beyond all doubt by the indisputable fact that when you remove all racial diversity from a popuation it becomes completely harmonious: a paradise, free from any problems at all.

I have a headache right now but I wouldn't if there wasn't a black man living upstairs.

So what you're saying is that racism doesn't exist, it's just a natural extension of the tensions and resentment between human beings in general.

[Guest BlueBrett]

Hmm but with Western Foreign Policy being as it is, I would struggle to believe that there wouldn't be deep seated mistrust and cultural conflict.

Do you really think that the West is any more expansionist or aggressive than the Russians, the Chinese or the Arab world? International Relations are dominated by realism which means that everyone is just out for what they can get because they work under the assumption that everybody else is aswell.

[Zingari]

Reading some of the comments on here I now realise what a success multiculturalism has been. There is absolutely no ethnic tensions and no resentment at all.

if it wasn't for multi culturalism , i don't know what would keep liberal faggots and racist rednecks on collision course

[dave the caveman]

So what you're saying is that racism doesn't exist, it's just a natural extension of the tensions and resentment between human beings in general.

I think racism is a much too broad term which encapsulates a natural preference towards familiarity and wrongly categorises it as evil. It is ultimately no different from sexism or ageism. We see no social problem with old people wanting to live together in old peoples homes and we do not take part in arguements over the morality of the fact that men tend to have more male friends and women often socialise with other women. Yet when this exact phenomenon is applied to race it is given the upmost importance. So when creating multiracial societies you can expect some natural tension, yes, and for me progress is not necessarily removing that tension but accepting it for what it is and disregarding it as a natural part of humanity, just as we do with sexism and ageism.

[Dr The Singh]

I actually agree with alot of what cameron has said, although I don't think multiculturism has failed whole.

Keeping racism apart there are sections from all cutltures that have failed to integrate into the 'mainstream', or refuse to. There are many reasons as to and racism is just one, facing and being. These isolated factions can form a problem, they for one have no loyalty to our nation or our people, usually are not willing to cooperate with our society and hence are an easy force to manipulate and become anti society. Or they become protective of there own and believe all othera are alien.

There are sets of society that badger on about a 'better' way, better regime, better nation, and yet they have never been to that nation, way of life or unwilling to fook of to that world, and worse still they are anti to the nation they are in

[Dr The Singh]

I think racism is a much too broad term which encapsulates a natural preference towards familiarity and wrongly categorises it as evil. It is ultimately no different from sexism or ageism. We see no social problem with old people wanting to live together in old peoples homes and we do not take part in arguements over the morality of the fact that men tend to have more male friends and women often socialise with other women. Yet when this exact phenomenon is applied to race it is given the upmost importance. So when creating multiracial societies you can expect some natural tension, yes, and for me progress is not necessarily removing that tension but accepting it for what it is and disregarding it as a natural part of humanity, just as we do with sexism and ageism.

Preference and racism are to different things. Racisim a is a hatred or bias against a race, all races have old people and different sexes, but races are different to each other and are related colour and bloodline. I prefer white women to black sexually, but have no hatred to black

[breadandcheese]

I think it's lazy and dangerous just to shout racism at Cameron or anyone who questions multi-culturalism. It shuts down debate and leaves the ground open for nasty elements to exploit.

Cameron's speech seemed to tackle two major points. The first was who the state talks to and provides fund for. The second was a discussion on multi-culturalism, which Cameron decried as failing. Personally, I think it was a mistake to tackle the two points together as each could form the basis for its own talk.

I find it very difficult to disagree with Cameron on the first point and I'm not sure how anyone could disagree with it. The government or local authority should not provide funds to, or seek dialogue with those who do not share our libertarian values of democracy and freedom. I personally found it quite shameful a few years back that Ken Livingstone invited a speaker to this country and gave him a public platform when the speaker believed homosexuals an abomination who should be stoned to death. This should hold true for any religious or political group of any denomination.

At a time when there is legitimate criticism of us (as a country) for backing a dictatorial regime in Egypt when it contradicted the freedoms we subscribe to, I think it bizarre that anybody can disagree with Cameron when he says that the state should only engage with and support minority groups here in the UK who believe in our values.

The discussion on multi-culturalism was in my opinion misguided because it seemed to treat it as an absolute term, when it my opinion it is a constantly evolving concept with a spectrum of different levels. I think it's worthy of discussion but it depends in what framework. I think the mistake we make with multi-culturalism, as others have highlighted, is that we do not promote British concepts enough. By this, I don't mean an oath of allegiance or anything like that, but including in the curriculum lessons about how our society was formed and the concepts we exported to the world.

For example, our country gave birth to parliamentary democracy, was one of the most active in eradicating the slave trade, revolutionised the world through the industrial revolution, brought the concept of habeas corpus to law. These are things to be celebrated and the reason many immigrants were attracted to Britain in the first place. It's the reason many muslims, hindus, Africans and other members from colonial territories fought and died for Britain during the second world war. They were not conscripted. They volunteered because they believed in these British concepts. Yet, how many people learn of these items in our schools today. This I think is the fault because learning this alongside the tolerance and accepting of other cultures that has been built through multi-culturalism would lead to a better social cohesiveness.

[l444ry]

David Cameron has a point on failed multiculturalism - these Eton boys don't seem to mix well with the rest of the country. I think he must be referring to Baroness Sayeeda Warsi!!

[MC Prussian]

Multi-culturalism is a success - in parts.

You can ask yourself whether "total multiculturalism" can be achieved in the first place. Before that, you'd better explain to me what "total multiculturalism" is.

Cameron's statement is more an example of perfect populism and an attempt at distracting from the real troubles in Great Britain, if you ask me.

And he and his staff know bloody well how effective messages like this are in times of (alleged) financial and political trouble.

It's not about ethnicity, it's about characters. And opinions. Everyone, regardless of their heritage, has one. And many of them clash on a daily basis.

I haven't heard of an English Prime Minister saying "Britishism" has failed, because Brits themselves can have a hard time living with each other.

It bugs me when when thick Politicians call multiculturalism a failure - they once called for cheap labour, not cultures.

You're digging your own grave, Cameron.

[Houdini Logic]

You're digging your own grave, Cameron.

More likely some Pole is to be honest

[Zingari]

More likely some Pole is to be honest

yeah , i really don't know how we used to manage

[Houdini Logic]

yeah , i really don't know how we used to manage

Think we used to use gypsies, but they left to pursue a career in Hollywood

[Stevosevic]

I agree a lot with what Cameron has said to be honest.

[Stevosevic]

Don't like curry or Pizza and like all real music lovers, I hate Hip Hop. And living in countesthorpe, there's very few non 'white british' to befriend

Tbh my point is that I could do without the benefits you mentioned for the downsides it brings. But yeah I take your point.

Possibly one of the most ridiculous things i have ever heard.

That's why Paul McCartney (and many others) has performed with Jay-Z a number of times, nothing better than two different genres coming together IMO.

[Fosse Boy]

EVERY day for the last 40 years, Sukhdev Sangha has watched the world go by from the window of his corner shop in Leicester.

And as he looks out onto the busy street today, the 67-year-old can hardly believe how things have changed.

One of the first immigrants to arrive in the city after coming from the Punjab in 1967, the Sikh stood out as one of the only faces of colour in a sea of white.

He and his wife were stared at as they walked down the street and he was barred from the first job he applied for – as a bus conductor – because he wore a turban.

But today people of every hue, every religion, pass by his shop window – and in every 10 faces, maybe one is white.

“And I believe multiculturalism has made Leicester a better place,” he says.

Along the busy street from his shop towards the city centre, a Hindu temple stands next to a mosque, a West Indian travel agent opposite a saree dress shop, and a group of schoolgirls wearing Muslim hijab head-coverings stand on a street corner tucking into fish and chips.

New estimates suggest children from white families are now in a minority in the city, making up only 47% of the under-16 population.

Leicester is set to become Britain’s first plural city, where no ethnic group will form a majority, by 2019, with Birmingham expected to follow five years later.

It is something Leicester East Labour MP Keith Vaz welcomes.

He said: “Leicester’s diversity and successful integration is a mark of its confidence in itself. Our communities have always got along with one another.”

One of the white faces on Sukhdev’s street today is Jeremy Prescott, director of the Rural Community Council. He says: “People here just get along, regardless of their colour or culture. Leicester is a proudly multicultural city and I think it’s all to its benefit.”

This city seems to be flying in the face of David Cameron’s speech at the weekend, when he claimed state multiculturalism had failed because different cultures had been encouraged to live separate lives.

At the last census in 2001, Sukhdev’s ethnic group – Indians – made up 26% of the population and whites 63%. The new census later this year is expected to show dramatic changes – yet he believes Leicester is a city which is comfortable with itself and its many different faces.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/features/2011/02/07/leicester-shows-we-can-live-together-even-if-david-cameron-talks-about-failure-of-multiculturalism-115875-22904514/

[Zingari]

So , Keith Vaz , the bloke at the corner shop, and lots of people that moved into Leicester think that multi culturalism is working just fine ,

jolly good , but that's pretty much to be expected though really .

But looking at the shear numbers and shift in dynamics , one would have to assume that a sizeable

number of residents ( probably at least around 100 thousand )must have relocated .

In the interests of fairness , why not ask their opinion on the issue ?

Basically, if you ask the right questions to the right people , you can pretty much get whatever response you want.

David Cameron and the likes of Angela Merkel maybe be completely wrong for all I know , but surely they must be allowed to exress their views and responded to sensibly,