It's a philosophy thing

[5waller5]

I'm not basing my opinion on one 0-0 draw.

No, you're basing it on a couple of seasons ago.

Fryatt scored 35 goals in the League One season and was well into double figures the next season before he was injured. I don't think that is nostalgia, just fact.

But on emotional reactions which distort reality, don't you think people are over-reacting to a season which has failed to live up to the hype get them into a negative frame of mind which is making them view things in an overly pessimistic way?

Some things have improved...just not quickly enough to get us into the playoffs.

Yep!!!

[Mark_w]

No, you're basing it on a couple of seasons ago.

I'm basing it on Nigel Pearson's entire record as a Championship manager, and comparing it to the other managers we've had in my life time.

[cc_star]

We play hoofball under Nigel - 5th place

We play 'incredible' football under Sousa and Sven - Not in the top 6.

I'll take hoofball please.

We don't play hoofball at all, we're too slow to get the ball forward too often

[5waller5]

I'm basing it on Nigel Pearson's entire record as a Championship manager, and comparing it to the other managers we've had in my life time.

His entire record is having 3 unsuccessful attempts at getting promotion. Not good enough for a team with our ambition and investment.

In fact, not good enough for MY team .... does that make me a bad fan? Not in my eyes. Just realistic enough to accept that the manager isn't good enough to lead my club forward.

Will he get a 4th chance??? To be honest I'm not bothered either way .... but I'm so bored a change would at least be more exciting (and maybe entirely counter-productive i accept).

[flowwolf]

Forget fashion for a moment (although it is an intriguing subject, I concur) - what about the football?

Again a plain standard design that lost a lot of it's aesthetic allure once in the air. I suggest a post dada design on one side and an advert for X factor on the other.

[cc_star]

They don't get much more fluid than Marshall, either side, down the middle, up front.

We need more like him & NP will get them.

Danns suspension & resulting injury has cost us, we were 3rd in the form tables & taken 7pts from 9 against teams above us & then Wellens & Danns were out (along with Gally with King only just returning from injury) & we fell apart.

Its terribly disappointing but it's not doom & gloom.

[Mark_w]

His entire record is having 3 unsuccessful attempts at getting promotion.

HA! The goal wasn't promotion on two of those occasions and the other one he picked up someone elses squad for half of the season!

[Kitchandro]

Swansea. Swansea. Swansea.

It seems to have been instilled into the over only a few seasons and their squad isn't exactly a group of world beaters (no offence meant) but they have still managed it.

I just look at us sometimes though and think "even if our players played a nicer style, it wouldn't work". So many poor first touches, so many poor passes, not enough good dribblers, nobody looking around before they receive the ball. The last one is a biggy, I see so many players at this level (Richie, I'm looking at you) that call for the ball, they want it into feet, they collect it, turn around then look up, only to realise there's nothing on in that direction and they have to turn around and go back. It's amateur at times.

Movement is another issue altogether. We expect them to be creative when there are no 3rd man runners (Eg. Once a player gives a pass, there should be another player running into the space created by the opposition player who's moved to close down the passer), there are no basic triangles, not even urgency to find space on a fundamental level.

It just seems to be play it by ear football and we don't have good enough players to make that work on a consistent basis, they need to be told how to play.

Agree with this pretty much.

We don't have the players to play good creative football. Yes part of it is down to philosophy but if you can't move the ball quick enough you won't get anywhere even with good intentions. Swansea have good technical players with pace and specific roles. We've got a load of slow players who daren't take anyone on or play a risky yet killer pass, and the ones that are quick are even worse on the ball than the slow ones.

The midfield desperately needs a creative spark and players who can pass the ball better. The amount of times we take 3 or 4 touches to get the ball under control is embarrassing, That is an indicator of where we are at the moment.

[Kitchandro]

Not for me I'm afraid. I think he looks clueless and beaten on the sideline. His team looks the same on the pitch. In 30 odd years of supporting LCFC I've never wanted a change of manager .... but i do now. We'll waste whatever time we give him IMHO he's just not up to it.

So you want Pearson out at this stage, yet you never wanted Sousa, Holloway, Taylor, Pleat, Levein, or Sven out? WTF? You didn't want Holloway out when we got relegated? You didn't want Taylor out when....well, when he signed Junior Lewis? After 3 years of finishing lower than we will this season and stagnating you didn't want us to sack Pleat?

But you want Pearson out now? I hate the phrase but when you really think about it, that can't be anything more than a knee-jerk reaction.

[Kitchandro]

I'm fed up of saying it but I just don't get the reasoning for being pro-Sven and anti-Pearson.

You say Pearson has failed to get us up. At least we've been in the top 6 once. Under Sven we didn't once venture that high in a year. It's not good enough to say you believe Sven would have taken us up if you can't back it up with anything reasonable, like facts, or at least some examples of consistently promising performances.

You say Sven was sacked too early after a year. Yet you're desperate for Pearson to be out after 6 months despite us averaging similar points and playing now worse (anyone with a decent memory can remember how boring and uninspiring we were under Sven this season).

Saying you think Sven should have been given more time is one thing. Saying you don't think Pearson is the man for the job is another. But I've never heard any logical arguments from the Sven apologists for wanting Pearson sacked.

Pearson has done nothing wrong that Sven was not also guilty of. And that includes things related to hoofball and dressing room unrest.

[Zingari]

we were doing philosophy football years ago

[fleckneymike]

This is precisely the problem.

It's not about being a Sven supporter or a Pearson supporter, it's about supporting a style of football.

Placing your faith in a manager is pointless because they come and go, placing your faith in a style and philosophy of football helps the club long term as it dictates the squad you assemble rather than allowing a manager who might up and leave to dictate the squad. We keep on 'supporting' the manager rather than supporting the club.

Edited to say I don't support the style of football Pearson advocates (I know this seems hypocritical having just said It's not about been pro Sven or pro Pearson).

[davieG]

Whichever style we choose at least lets try and stick with it, all this chopping and changing of managers and players that are bought for one style and then have them trying to play a style that is completely alien is the cause of our inconsistency and ability to play as team.

Is it any wonder that very few Academy players make the step up when it must be totally confusing to those running the Academy re what type of players and skills they should be looking for in players and how to develop them.

We need a strategy that has longevity to it so that everyone from the youngest right through to the 1st team squad are all singing the same tune in the same style.

I'd prefer it not to be hoof ball but then I don't own the club.

[Webbo]

Do we really play hoofball? I'll admit there is the occasional long ball, especially,but not always, from goal kicks but most of the time we try to pass the ball.

[fleckneymike]

Whichever style we choose at least lets try and stick with it, all this chopping and changing of managers and players that are bought for one style and then have them trying to play a style that is completely alien is the cause of our inconsistency and ability to play as team.

Is it any wonder that very few Academy players make the step up when it must be totally confusing to those running the Academy re what type of players and skills they should be looking for in players and how to develop them.

We need a strategy that has longevity to it so that everyone from the youngest right through to the 1st team squad are all singing the same tune in the same style.

I'd prefer it not to be hoof ball but then I don't own the club.

That is precisely the problem and is precisely what I am advocating. Very few City academy players go on to bigger and better things and very few make the step up. We have, and continue to, waste millions on buying other club's players to suit the current manager rather than hiring a manager to suit the players.

[fleckneymike]

Do we really play hoofball? I'll admit there is the occasional long ball, especially,but not always, from goal kicks but most of the time we try to pass the ball.

We play more long passes than I would like.

If we're all honest Kasper's long (if erratic) goal kick is one of our tactics. Our style of play isn't quite Mickey Adams style football but it is as equally rigid. In Pearson's first term it was like watching table football with a very rigid system where you seldom saw full back over lapping. He has admittedly loosened the style slightly but it still relies heavily on one winger and one midfielder playing wide and slightly tucked in.

[shade]

so what's everyone's personal philosophy, play good exciting football and finish third and lose in the play offs OR play dull grinding football and finish second? assuming you HAD to watch every match?

[5waller5]

That is precisely the problem and is precisely what I am advocating. Very few City academy players go on to bigger and better things and very few make the step up. We have, and continue to, waste millions on buying other club's players to suit the current manager rather than hiring a manager to suit the players.

Agreed entirely. Which is why i didn't want Pearson in the first place, gave him a chance, and now believe we need to get rid before he gets rid of the better footballers at the club and replaces them with the "hungry young lads" willing to play his dire football as a stepping stone in their career.

so what's everyone's personal philosophy, play good exciting football and finish third and lose in the play offs OR play dull grinding football and finish second? assuming you HAD to watch every match?

Play good football every time.

[fleckneymike]

so what's everyone's personal philosophy, play good exciting football and finish third and lose in the play offs OR play dull grinding football and finish second? assuming you HAD to watch every match?

Play good football

[Out Foxed]

I'm looking at the table from that season when Nigel got a full summer transfer window to build his own squad. You probably don't remember, not many of our fans seem to have memories.

we actually played good football at times (on the deck) that season but most people try to pretend it was all hoofball, it wasn't.

[SMX11]

I think we have an ability problem. We can't play like Swansea because we don't have their players simple as that and trying to mimic them with our current players would be naive (Sousa & Sven).