Doctors

[Parafox]

How?

You complained about the doctors pensions then said you didn't care how people invest their money... what do you think a pension scheme is?

[Captain...]

Of course not, no more than i care how anybody else chooses to invest their money.

So basically you are advocating the privatisation of the NHS.

[Bellend Sebastian]

I went to see a doctor once. He sorted out my gammy finger

[ADK]

Private pensions arnt funded by the taxpayer are they? I'm not sure if there are government incentives relating to private sector pensions but compared to public sector pensions, most money is either coming from employee as contributions or from the employer.

I believe 80% of doctors pensions come from the taxpayer therefore it's only fair for people to have an opinion.

[Corky]

It's one of the shittest programmes I've ever seen

I agree.

It's set in Birmingham yet about three of the characters are from there. How realistic is that?

Say what you like about Eastenders but most of the characters are Cockney through and through.

[Captain...]

Private pensions arnt funded by the taxpayer are they? I'm not sure if there are government incentives relating to private sector pensions but compared to public sector pensions, most money is either coming from employee as contributions or from the employer.

I believe 80% of doctors pensions come from the taxpayer therefore it's only fair for people to have an opinion.

But in the private sector doctors are able to earn much more money than in the public sector, by staying with the NHS they forfeit their right to do so, and so are rewarded handsomely at the end for their loyalty and good work.

Otherwise doctors would be leaving the NHS constantly every time a chance to go into a private practice comes up, with a good pension and loyalty reward they will stay with the NHS throughout their careers knowing that at the end of it they will be no worse off than their equivalent in the private sector.

[Bryn]

Nobody has given a reason why anyone needs a pension worth millions paid for by the taxpayer.

Doctors can just go on 5 cruises instead of 6 and own 3 cars instead of 4.

What ****ing planet are you on? Seriously? Do you actually think doctors live like Simon Cowell or something?

Our salaries provide comfort, the ones that are mega rich do private work. There's no ****ing way the average doctor lives a life that comfortable ffs. Get a grip and go do some research before you embarrass yourself any further.

[Bellend Sebastian]

I agree.

It's set in Birmingham yet about three of the characters are from there. How realistic is that?

I've been to Birmingham, and found it to be an exciting and lively metropolis. I can quite see how it could suck people in from other areas, like a big Brummie black hole.

As an aside, my other half is a doctor (but not a GP, a distinction probably lost on most of the hotheads on here) from Birmingham, but lives in Leicester! Fancy that

[steveherbe]

But it's not just NHS pensions that are shrinking. I've had a private pension plan for 30 years now, when it started out I was going to retire on Easy Street, Every year I pay more in, and it's worh LESS! HTF does that work? So now, in 4.5 years time when I retire, my hard earned pension will be worth somewhere south of the square root of fook all!! IMHO private pensions are the biggest rip off in this fooked up country. I'd have been better putting my pension savings (plus the governments contribution) into a long term savings account. So dont you NHS people come on here moaning, try having your own personal scheme with ZERO contributions from your employer. TF I won the Euro Millions jackpot last weekend, or I'd have been really screwed!!

[steveherbe]

What this dispute is about, if you'd care to check your facts is the reneging of an agreement by the government.

But mate, Governements have been doing this for years. When I started work at 16, I had an 'agreement' with the then government that when I reached 65 I could retire on a pension, for which I would pay a percentage of my wages. Over the years, that percentage has gone up (NI contributions), and now the bastards want to extend our working lives, maybe to 70. Luckily for me, I'll be retired before the retirement age goes up. But, Mrs Herb had the same implicit agreement when SHE started work, but has now been told she has to work not to 60, but to 65 at least. Things change, goalposts move, unfortunately thats the way it is. Revolution is the only way forward, Make Boris king and supreme leader, and we'll all live the good life.

[Captain...]

But it's not just NHS pensions that are shrinking. I've had a private pension plan for 30 years now, when it started out I was going to retire on Easy Street, Every year I pay more in, and it's worh LESS! HTF does that work? So now, in 4.5 years time when I retire, my hard earned pension will be worth somewhere south of the square root of fook all!! IMHO private pensions are the biggest rip off in this fooked up country. I'd have been better putting my pension savings (plus the governments contribution) into a long term savings account. So dont you NHS people come on here moaning, try having your own personal scheme with ZERO contributions from your employer. TF I won the Euro Millions jackpot last weekend, or I'd have been really screwed!!

Congrats on your Euro Millions win, have you thought about putting it into an off shore holdings company, I hear the K2 scheme is quite lucrative

Or will we be seeing you on the board at the KP in the near future?

[Captain...]

But mate, Governements have been doing this for years. When I started work at 16, I had an 'agreement' with the then government that when I reached 65 I could retire on a pension, for which I would pay a percentage of my wages. Over the years, that percentage has gone up (NI contributions), and now the bastards want to extend our working lives, maybe to 70. Luckily for me, I'll be retired before the retirement age goes up. But, Mrs Herb had the same implicit agreement when SHE started work, but has now been told she has to work not to 60, but to 65 at least. Things change, goalposts move, unfortunately thats the way it is. Revolution is the only way forward, Make Boris king and supreme leader, and we'll all live the good life.

Exactly, that is what this is, industrial action, if more people got together and told the government to fook off they might start listening, oh and I hope you are joking about Boris for king, unless you mean a different Boris to Johnson. Actually kings have no real power and are just figureheads who often put their foot in their mouth, Boris would be perfect.

[Rincewind]

I think I have just escaped having to work to 67. But the time I can draw pension credits and get a free bus pass has changed. I have no pension scheme. Well I do but it's frozen. Took one out years ago then was told what I would need to pay into it was more of my earnings than I could afford and what I was paying was a waste of time. SoI'll just cut down on luxuries and manage on the state pension. I expect some will call me a scrounger now.

I don't even know if I can draw on the plan that I have but I never declare it or inquired about it. I forget about iyt until the yearly statement arrives which I cannot understand. When it matures I expect they'll let me know and it'll be a nice surprise or disappointment.

[steveherbe]

Captain S, all rather tongue in cheek really, if only I had won the jackpot, rather than the measily £10 our 21-strong syndicate really netted! Are you really in valencia? Going to the race? Lucky bugger if you are.

[Captain...]

Captain S, all rather tongue in cheek really, if only I had won the jackpot, rather than the measily £10 our 21-strong syndicate really netted! Are you really in valencia? Going to the race? Lucky bugger if you are.

No longer in Valencia, left over a year ago just not got round to changing my profile, I've been in the City when the race was on a couple of times and watched them fly past from the beach, but never actually been inside, was quite tough to get tickets as it was a new race circuit so they were all signed up by the aficionados very quickly.

[Parafox]

But mate, Governements have been doing this for years. When I started work at 16, I had an 'agreement' with the then government that when I reached 65 I could retire on a pension, for which I would pay a percentage of my wages. Over the years, that percentage has gone up (NI contributions), and now the bastards want to extend our working lives, maybe to 70. Luckily for me, I'll be retired before the retirement age goes up. But, Mrs Herb had the same implicit agreement when SHE started work, but has now been told she has to work not to 60, but to 65 at least. Things change, goalposts move, unfortunately thats the way it is. Revolution is the only way forward, Make Boris king and supreme leader, and we'll all live the good life.

I agree with much of this and yes, things do change. My gripe is with those that come on here knowing NOTHING about doctors salaries or pension schemes except what they read in the Sport and then start saying "pensions should be cut, they get too much", "no-one deserves that much when they retire". Actually yes, some people do.

Well, I earn the going rate for my job as a Paramedic as do doctors for whatever their role is. If I/they went private I/they would be paid surprisingly more, but I/they would then have to contribute to a private pension scheme, so effecively, my/their salary is adjusted (lowered) to take account of the FSPS.

[AoWW]

Nobody has given a reason why anyone needs a pension worth millions paid for by the taxpayer.

Doctors can just go on 5 cruises instead of 6 and own 3 cars instead of 4.

Oh my.

[MooseBreath]

All this support for doctor's pensions, yet we all support income tax as a proportion of income rather than a flat fee? Bizarre. Really bizarre.

[ADK]

I know i really don't get it. People are not very consistent.

[Captain...]

All this support for doctor's pensions, yet we all support income tax as a proportion of income rather than a flat fee? Bizarre. Really bizarre.

Please explain the link?

[MooseBreath]

Please explain the link?

If a fair way of putting money into the public pot is as a proportion of salary then how is it fair that money taken out of the pot is so massively disprortionate?

You're saying that it's fair for us all to contribute proportionately but when it comes to receiving, people who provide 'more important' services should get the bulk of it while the rest are left with next to nothing.

If we applied the same logic to income tax then workers who provide a 'less important' service would have to pay almost all of the tax while doctors would have to pay next to nothing.

I don't see how you can argue that proportional contributions are fair in one direction but not in the other.

[Captain...]

If a fair way of putting money into the public pot is as a proportion of salary then how is it fair that money taken out of the pot is so massively disprortionate?

You're saying that it's fair for us all to contribute proportionately but when it comes to receiving, people who provide 'more important' services should get the bulk of it while the rest are left with next to nothing.

If we applied the same logic to income tax then workers who provide a 'less important' service would have to pay almost all of the tax while doctors would have to pay next to nothing.

I don't see how you can argue that proportional contributions are fair in one direction but not in the other.

But this is not about income, it is about offering a competitive package to attract and keep the best doctors.

They also get a similar package to other civil servants but because they earn more, they make greater contributions and as it is a final salary scheme and they generally end up with a very decent final salary.

There seems to be some misunderstanding here, doctors don't just receive a pension, they are not taking it out of the "public pot", they make contributions throughout their working life, this is their money they get back, but the state like most employers also make a contribution to match it.

They get the same state pension as everyone, and get a doctor's pension, and could have a private pension on top if they wanted, but like all pensions they make contributions and it is linked to earnings, they make a lot of money so contribute a lot to their pension, so expect to get a lot back.

The scheme they get is a good one, but no different to others offered by employers.

As I have said I would have no problem with a review of it, but that was done 4 years ago, and this government agreed not to touch it.

[Webbo]

There seems to be some misunderstanding here, doctors don't just receive a pension, they are not taking it out of the "public pot", they make contributions throughout their working life, this is their money they get back, but the state like most employers also make a contribution to match it.

Most?

[Captain...]

Most?

Everywhere I have worked have offered a pension scheme, and most of my friends have a similar scheme where you contribute up to 10% of your salary to a pension scheme they will match it.

I guess I am thinking mainly of office jobs, but it is not an unusual arrangement and one that doctors would expect.

Or did you mean it should read all? http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-11627135

But then not everyone is eligible, so I will stick with most.