THEFATBASTARD Posted 12 July 2012 Posted 12 July 2012 The cleaners of the government offices have left letters on the desk of the ministers they work for, asking for a living wage...£6.95 is shite in london...pitiful.. ..they start at 5am.... we are all in this together....
Rincewind Posted 12 July 2012 Posted 12 July 2012 Mi9nimum wage is £6.08. As long as they pay that they can shite all over anyone they want. For London that is awful. It's bad enough in Leicester. Are they part of the offices dept or is a cleaning company contracted to do it? If its agency pay will be crap. They ought to get together and form their own cleaning business then charge the dept more.
I am Rod Hull Posted 12 July 2012 Posted 12 July 2012 But their expense claims run into tens of thousands of pounds a year.....
Jon the Hat Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Why should government waste money on paying cleaners more? There are plenty of other places the money would be better spent. Linking completely unconnected salaries is meaningless.
jonthefox Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Why should government waste money on paying cleaners more? There are plenty of other places the money would be better spent. Linking completely unconnected salaries is meaningless. With all the money they waste i'm sure they could pay more. Im guessing these people are not directly employed by whitehall, but some agency. However, the money they pay is dreadful.The trouble we find nowadays though, is that there is someone somewhere willing to work for that.
FoxyPV Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 The govt will be able to do sweet fa about this. They will be tied into a contract with Maybin or some other company who pay their employees a pittance but charge the govt a fortune. They would have to wait until the contract is up and then specify this in the new contract. However this would then push the price of the contract up as the agency / company will still want to keep their profit margin.
davieG Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 They obviously don't work hard enough. Work hard and you to can become a banker.
Zingari Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Why should government waste money on paying cleaners more? There are plenty of other places the money would be better spent. Linking completely unconnected salaries is meaningless. Isn't there a whiff of the GS4 debacle about this though ? Is the government (or rather us ) paying out huge contract payments for inferior service and poorly paid and trained staff ? Surely there is no flippin need to sub contract out cleaning and maintenance because most places that I’ve worked at seem to manage it okay Couldn’t a department be set up with a budget to maintain gov. premises instead of using contractors ( who are probably friends of influential government ministers or civil servants) to cream off and pay pittances?
Captain... Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Isn't there a whiff of the GS4 debacle about this though ? Is the government (or rather us ) paying out huge contract payments for inferior service and poorly paid and trained staff ? Surely there is no flippin need to sub contract out cleaning and maintenance because most places that I’ve worked at seem to manage it okay Couldn’t a department be set up with a budget to maintain gov. premises instead of using contractors ( who are probably friends of influential government ministers or civil servants) to cream off and pay pittances? Of course and the lesson from this is don't be the mug doing the work, be the one negotiating the contracts.
Guest Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Nearly all businesses contract out cleaning. That's because it's not a core skill and the contracters can do it more cheaply. If the cleaners aren't earning enough they need to take it up with their employers or go get another more highly paid job. Soldier for example
Rincewind Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 When I was in security one of the companys placed me on a scrapyard site. I think I was on min wage which would be £4,50-£5 then. Anyway I was told by a foreman/boss at the site that they paid my company around £20 per hour for my services. I would imagine the worker's pay profit ration would be about the same for the cleaning contracteors. If they increased the wages they would put up their charges and may lose the contract. There are loads of cleaning companies and agencies paying crap wages because of the unemployment situation. Some companies don't even take people on full time permanent. It means they can pay less and not guarantee the same right that permanent workers have. Low paid workers have always been shafted but now it is worse than it has been for a quite few years.
Darkon84 Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 The cleaners of the government offices have left letters on the desk of the ministers they work for, asking for a living wage...£6.95 is shite in london...pitiful.. ..they start at 5am.... we are all in this together.... Yep, and I bet those same cleaners will be cleaning those letters out of the bin later, probably with a big turd curled out on top, just to make sure they dont try it again.
Captain... Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 When I was in security one of the companys placed me on a scrapyard site. I think I was on min wage which would be £4,50-£5 then. Anyway I was told by a foreman/boss at the site that they paid my company around £20 per hour for my services. I would imagine the worker's pay profit ration would be about the same for the cleaning contracteors. If they increased the wages they would put up their charges and may lose the contract. There are loads of cleaning companies and agencies paying crap wages because of the unemployment situation. Some companies don't even take people on full time permanent. It means they can pay less and not guarantee the same right that permanent workers have. Low paid workers have always been shafted but now it is worse than it has been for a quite few years. Well yes and no, it may seem like a lot, they pay £20 but you only get £5, but you will get sick pay and holiday pay in that as well as statutory rights amongst other things, the fact is it is cheaper for a company to pay £20 an hour than to hire someone directly and pay them £5 an hour because of all the red tape and workers rights surrounding taking on an employee. Not to mention admin and payroll HR, training etc Of course agencies cream a good bit off the top and probably pay lower wages but they now monopolise these markets and can do that.
Rincewind Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 They won't be read by the ministers. They will be handed over to secraties who will determine them as not worthy of being read and bin them. After all they were written by the lower class.
Guest Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Yep, and I bet those same cleaners will be cleaning those letters out of the bin later, probably with a big turd curled out on top, just to make sure they dont try it again.
Zingari Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Nearly all businesses contract out cleaning. That's because it's not a core skill and the contracters can do it more cheaply. If the cleaners aren't earning enough they need to take it up with their employers or go get another more highly paid job. Soldier for example Yes , I’m well out of touch now Yes there has been a drift into sub contracting security , cleaning and gen. maintenance over the last few years , but I remain to be convinced that it is any cheaper or even as good as in-house . What is the point of paying that huge sum to GS4 and then having to use the army to fulfil the obligation . We were told that we didn’t want a military look about the games , but yesterday old Boris was bleating on abut it being an attractive addition the army was to the look of security now . Talk about politicians double speak
Guest Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Yes , I’m well out of touch now Yes there has been a drift into sub contracting security , cleaning and gen. maintenance over the last few years , but I remain to be convinced that it is any cheaper or even as good as in-house . What is the point of paying that huge sum to GS4 and then having to use the army to fulfil the obligation . We were told that we didn’t want a military look about the games , but yesterday old Boris was bleating on abut it being an attractive addition the army was to the look of security now . Talk about politicians double speak I don't think it's about quality Zin, It's about responsibility and administration. In theory a company specialising in building airplanes or banking does not have the know-how that a specialist company of cleaners has. So they sub contract. In reality they sub contract because of worker's rights and payroll issues as well as being able to fire the company so much easier than firing any employee.
Rincewind Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Well yes and no, it may seem like a lot, they pay £20 but you only get £5, but you will get sick pay and holiday pay in that as well as statutory rights amongst other things, the fact is it is cheaper for a company to pay £20 an hour than to hire someone directly and pay them £5 an hour because of all the red tape and workers rights surrounding taking on an employee. Not to mention admin and payroll HR, training etc Of course agencies cream a good bit off the top and probably pay lower wages but they now monopolise these markets and can do that. Yes I see your point. Plus they would not have to supply uniform and other equpment. One place I worked at did have in house security as well but they just did the normal 40 hours had weekends and Bank Holidays off and were paid more. In fack one of them said I was a fool for working for a company that is contracted out. Think I worked 10pm-9am and their security started around midday Our men mainly did weekends so in the week they had two rotating 8-9 hour shifts. Think they were on a couple of pound ph more than me plus all the benefits. With the GS4. I would imagine they would recruit mainly from the London area. I cannot see living expense would be paid for. How many people would apply for the job which would only last a few weeks and pay for accomondation and travel whilst there? I know its desperate times for the unemployed but would it be would they be better off? I thought they had enough and most work was done by volunteers? To hire just one company seems a little lacking in thinking. I am sure different locations could have been covered by different ompanies.
Trav Le Bleu Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Mi9nimum wage is £6.08. As long as they pay that they can shite all over anyone they want. For London that is awful. It's bad enough in Leicester. Are they part of the offices dept or is a cleaning company contracted to do it? If its agency pay will be crap. They ought to get together and form their own cleaning business then charge the dept more. I mgiht be wrong, but isn't minimum wage more in London, due to the increased cost of living, which is what this is all about of course.
Guest MattP Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 I have no idea why a cleaner would think they deserve anything more than minimum wage. You can hire an Eastern European for cheaper than that if you wish.
Guest MattP Posted 13 July 2012 Posted 13 July 2012 Are you being serious? Yes. It's the most basic of unskilled work, why does it deserve a higher wage than the minimum required.
Daggers Posted 14 July 2012 Posted 14 July 2012 What is the point of paying that huge sum to GS4 and then having to use the army to fulfil the obligation . Hang on a cotton-picking minute... I thought the private sector was brilliant at showing the public sector how efficient and well-run it is?
Daggers Posted 14 July 2012 Posted 14 July 2012 Yes. It's the most basic of unskilled work, why does it deserve a higher wage than the minimum required. Because everyone deserves a living wage - and if you aren't going to control prices of essentials then you have to control salaries. I don't expect you to understand that concept for a second.
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