Two Police Women Killed in Manchester

[Craig]

It would appear that he/an accomplice reported a burglary and then attacked the officers when they arrived at the address.

[The Year Of The Fox]

Handed themselves into the police haven't they?

RIP

[Larry_LCFC]

I think the complete lack of respect in this thread by a few is utterly sickening. This isnt about what you think of the police, this is about two young women being brutally murdered doing their job and protecting the public from harm. RIP to them both.

[Guest MattP]

I think the complete lack of respect in this thread by a few is utterly sickening. This isnt about what you think of the police, this is about two young women being brutally murdered doing their job and protecting the public from harm. RIP to them both.

Threads develop into political debate sometimes, it happens.

If I wanted to read 500 pages of people saying RIP I'd go onto a Liverpool forum.

[Larry_LCFC]

Threads develop into political debate sometimes, it happens.

If I wanted to read 500 pages of people saying RIP I'd go onto a Liverpool forum.

You genuniely make me sick.

[Guest MattP]

You genuniely make me sick.

You aren't even angry, can tell it's all completely false.

Go on this www.mumsnet.com

[Guest MattP]

Cvnt with a fair point. I wouldn't trust your average police officer with a gun either

I can't believe anybody would after what we have seen over the last ten years in this country, the way the Police force has carried out any governments ordered with force, no consideration for democracy and without even thinking has been staggering.

[Larry_LCFC]

You aren't even angry, can tell it's all completely false.

Go on this www.mumsnet.com

You need to grow up and think before you open your mouth. Would you be such a dick if one of those killed was a member of your family. You're are a sad little man with no respect for anyone.

[ADK]

I'm not sure quite what the fuss is about, noone said that the two women deserved to die, it was simply brought up that this may encourage a debate on police officers carrying guns. Obviously it is a sad incident.

[Bellend Sebastian]

I predict thread locked by 7.30 pm

[Guest MattP]

You need to grow up and think before you open your mouth. Would you be such a dick if one of those killed was a member of your family. You're are a sad little man with no respect for anyone.

Your reaction to this thread has been absolutely unbelievable. Never seen anything like it.

[Parafox]

I can't believe anybody would after what we have seen over the last ten years in this country, the way the Police force has carried out any governments ordered with force, no consideration for democracy and without even thinking has been staggering.

Firstly, due respect to the officers murdered in the line of duty. Unsuspectingly attending a routine call to a report of a burglary in progress.

Secondly, if you're going to make statements like this, you need to back it up with evidence and proof.

[Guest MattP]

Firstly, due respect to the officers murdered in the line of duty. Unsuspectingly attending a routine call to a report of a burglary in progress.

Secondly, if you're going to make statements like this, you need to back it up with evidence and proof.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cases_of_police_brutality_in_the_United_Kingdom

[Parafox]

Mmmm, wikipedia... stalwart of truth.

The information in there is not in dispute, but when all is said and done, the police are employees of the government, so ultimately it's the government who should be held responsible for the actions carried out by the police on their behalf.

Police will not be routinely armed as that would lead to an increase in armed criminals.

[purpleronnie]

Good, police do not need to be armed in this country...thankfully.

[Tielemans63]

It would appear that he/an accomplice reported a burglary and then attacked the officers when they arrived at the address.

Did anyone else hear this and was reminded of the storyline in Good Cop? For anyone who didn't see it, some gangsters in Liverpool ring up the police complaining that there's a house party going on in the early hours. Two officers are called out thinking it's a minor disturbance but when one goes into the house the gangsters basically beat him to death. It's not inconceivable a nutcase like Cregan saw it and thought it looked like a good way of luring police officers to their death. It could be a complete coincidence but it does seem strange.

I'm not making excuses for anybody but I said to my wife at the time that I thought the BBC were giving people ideas with that storyline. Still, I guess that could be said of any crime / police drama type-programme.

[Bellend Sebastian]

A Police Federation survey in 2006 found that 82 per cent of officers did not want to be routinely armed. No doubt that figure would change after something like today's events (temporarily at least) but that would seem a pretty good indicator of their general feelings on it

[acooling08]

A Police Federation survey in 2006 found that 82 per cent of officers did not want to be routinely armed. No doubt that figure would change after something like today's events (temporarily at least) but that would seem a pretty good indicator of their general feelings on it

That astounds me to be honest.

I would not feel safe at all being called to disturbances, muggings, burgularies etc knowing that if somebody came at me with a knife, I'd be fvcked.

The thing is with a gun is that you will 99% of the time not use it, but it acts as a hell of a deterrant.

[Voll Blau]

I would not feel safe at all being called to disturbances, muggings, burgularies etc knowing that if somebody came at me with a knife, I'd be fvcked.

Don't become a copper then?

[purpleronnie]

Yes police officers are polled and they always come out overwhelming not to be armed. Which is great. It would no doubt make the situation much worse as its simply not needed, the last time 2 officers were killed was around 50 years ago...police murders havent increased in that time. Infact the shootings have actually decreased by a large amount compared to the 1980's.....sadly people always assume things are worse but the statistics simply show otherwise.

If they were armed it would be such a huge undertaking I'm not sure that it would be possible, the size of every force would have to increase for a start...it just wont happen, I cant see it ever happening, and I think we should be thankful that we live in a acountry where police dont need to be armed.

[Zingari]

I'm not sure of all the details in this horrific case , but I doubt if it would have changed much even if they had been armed .

[Bob Weasel Fox]

Firstly, due respect to the officers murdered in the line of duty. Unsuspectingly attending a routine call to a report of a burglary in progress.

Secondly, if you're going to make statements like this, you need to back it up with evidence and proof.

This

[Saxondale]

The thing is with a gun is that you will 99% of the time not use it, but it acts as a hell of a deterrant.

It doesn't though. Look at the USA - coppers are armed there and they have a lot more gun-related and violent crime than us.

[Bob Weasel Fox]

It doesn't though. Look at the USA - coppers are armed there and they have a lot more gun-related and violent crime than us.

Like others have said i think a previous poll of officers stated about 82% wanted to remain unarmed, which is thankfully how Great Britain should be policed generally speaking

[Ilkeston_Fox]

First of all, my thoughts and respects go out to the family members, friends and colleagues of the officers who sadly lost their life in the line of duty today.

I'm sure that most police officers themselves wouldn't want to be armed. What I think a lot of people fail to see/recognise is that the police don't generally get to deal with nice fine upstanding members of the community such as you or I, they have the 'pleasure' of dealing with the lowest of the low aswell.

If you see someone you don't like the look of, you get to walk the other way or cross the road and keep out of their way - the police don't. This country like it or lump it is fast becoming like America in the attitude of the younger generation (not all of course). But the ones that think it's ok to drive around with a knife in the door pocket of a car, or a baseball bat in the footwell etc won't think twice about clonking someone over the head, meaning life is becoming cheaper and cheaper.

I was on duty on Monday evening, was called to a disturbance and low and behold, young lad with a knife - and the attitude/backchat to match. It's becoming much more common for your everyday officer. In a sense, the police are fighting against the criminal mentality of a USA style attitude without enough tools to do the job. I personally think that more tasers should be available to officers - with the proper degree of training of course. There can be fewer than 20 taser trained officers on duty at any given time to cover the whole county! That's outrageous in my humble opinion. They are truly effective and deterring a potential offender, just by drawing them - which happens far more often than them actually being discharged.

To add insult to injury, the HomeSec and PM have expressed their sorrow, regret and respect to the officers today - yet they still cut the front line staff by 20% - it's only going to get worse! How much more of an advantage do you give to the criminals?