Dave Richards- new chairman?

[Dan LCFC]

Not sure about the belittling thing - each to their own - must admit to feeling the need to shoot back sometimes perhaps irrationally when shot down but hey, its a message board

 

The hypocrisy re Nige is a bit rich....so because he is the best of a bad bunch that makes him great? Good? Slightly better? Still not good enough? Stalin was arguably a better leader than Hitler but I'm not sure either of them would be my choice...

 

Then you go and agree with me (which is nice). Nige has not got us near the Premier League - near would be losing narrowly at Wembley or finishing third by a point after a hard fought campaign and a bit of refereeing injustice in the last game sort of thing. Not getting promoted via the play offs is the same as not being promoted for finishing 16th ultimately - you are not promoted.

 

What happens if we get promoted is a moot point - we haven't been and while I hope we can do it this year, I still don't feel we saw enough in the second half of the season to suggest we are moving forwards...my opinion, that is all.

 

I can empathise with the first bit.

 

I didn't say it made him great. I said you continue to knock him whilst defending Sven - who definitely did worse for Leicester than Pearson has done. Sven never looked like achieving promotion for us.

 

I was also concerned about the second half season but I really don't see a fall like that happening again. A lot of it is just if we can get to a position where we can fall in the first place.

 

I'm not overly optimistic about things yet but that could definitely change in the next fortnight.

[seenitall]

Now, now - are you warming up to Pearson after all? Come over to the dark side, you know it makes sense!!! 

But on a serious note, I don't like fans slagging off a team and its manager in particular when we haven't even started the new season.

I do not appreciate and do not understand this very premature and irrational doom 'n gloom attitude and I often wonder what it takes to come to such a disastrous conclusion like yours.

 

Pearson has had 3 1/2 seasons with us so far and that's NOT a very significant period over the last ten years. Also, he's had more success than anybody else during that span. Why is this so hard to grasp?

 

Give the man the benefit of the doubt and let's enjoy the upcoming season. You may continue to slag him off should we finish in a worse position at the end of next season compared to last season's 6th place (and subsequent close sniff at a playoff final).

 

Oh, and don't put seenitall and yourself in the same category. At least you're trying to make a point. 

Pointless

[Dan LCFC]

The problem I have with this is it assumes Leicester have some right to get promoted from the Championship.

 

There is no doubt it has happened a lot in the past, and we have spent around half of our history in the top flight, but none of this actually matters that much anymore.  As an advert once said: "past performance does not predict future performance." or some such.

 

Football has changed over the last 20 years, and truth be told, Leicester have not been top flight regulars since the 60s.  We spent most of the 80s in the second flight, half the 90s in the second flight, and most of the naughties.  

 

Are people who see Leicester as a top flight club and anything else is failure just deluding themselves?

 

This.

 

Our fans' sense of entitlement since King Power have been around is a fvcking embarrassment.

[Deucalion]

We were in the top flight from 71-78, so most of the decade.

 

in 106 seasons of professional league football, we've spent 46 in the top  flight and 60 out of the top flight.

 

So in other words, since the 70s Leicester have lost their status as top flight regulars.

 

How many of those 60 seasons outside the top flight have been in the last 30 years?  We haven't been top flight regulars for a generation.

 

Don't get me wrong though.  Just because I think we should accept we are not going to walk the Championship doesn't mean I don't want us to get back into the top flight.  

 

If we do manage to establish ourselves in the PL, it won't be a case of fulfilling our destiny so much as changing our destiny.  And that seems a much more difficult thing to do and probably is a more healthy way of thinking about it.

[seenitall]

This.

 

Our fans' sense of entitlement since King Power have been around is a fvcking embarrassment.

 It is not a sense of entitlement - we have to earn it and deserve it. Our ambition as a club and everything the club stands for should be about getting there - the players we sign, the management team, the strip, the pitch - everything should say 'we want to be in the Premier League'. Most important should be the fans demanding this level of commitment from whoever owns us, all the players, the manager and his team and not saying 'ah well, we are lucky to be finishing 6th in Div 2' - we should be demanding more and more - we used to.

[Dan LCFC]

 It is not a sense of entitlement - we have to earn it and deserve it. Our ambition as a club and everything the club stands for should be about getting there - the players we sign, the management team, the strip, the pitch - everything should say 'we want to be in the Premier League'. Most important should be the fans demanding this level of commitment from whoever owns us, all the players, the manager and his team and not saying 'ah well, we are lucky to be finishing 6th in Div 2' - we should be demanding more and more - we used to.

 

A lot of people on here are convinced we should be in the Premier League because of our crowds etc... a lot have a sense of entitlement. Of course we should aim for promotion, but the attitude of a lot of our fans over the past couple of years has been embarrassing at times.

[wurmer]

A lot of people on here are convinced we should be in the Premier League because of our crowds etc... a lot have a sense of entitlement. Of course we should aim for promotion, but the attitude of a lot of our fans over the past couple of years has been embarrassing at times.

 

Again - people using the comments on these boards and the moan-in as being representative of the majority of Leicester fans.

 

They are not!

[Corky]

The least we should demand is a promotion battle, we've had plenty of promotions and near-misses as well as top flight football in our history.

 

Anything less than that is totally unacceptable.

[Webbo]

 It is not a sense of entitlement - we have to earn it and deserve it. Our ambition as a club and everything the club stands for should be about getting there - the players we sign, the management team, the strip, the pitch - everything should say 'we want to be in the Premier League'. Most important should be the fans demanding this level of commitment from whoever owns us, all the players, the manager and his team and not saying 'ah well, we are lucky to be finishing 6th in Div 2' - we should be demanding more and more - we used to.

You make it sound like the only reason we're not in the prem is because we don't want it. Who are we supposed to demand it off, the premier league? That'll work. The owners?It's not theirs to give although no one can claim they haven't tried. Such statements are just ridiculous.

[MC Prussian]

It is not a sense of entitlement - we have to earn it and deserve it. Our ambition as a club and everything the club stands for should be about getting there - the players we sign, the management team, the strip, the pitch - everything should say 'we want to be in the Premier League'. Most important should be the fans demanding this level of commitment from whoever owns us, all the players, the manager and his team and not saying 'ah well, we are lucky to be finishing 6th in Div 2' - we should be demanding more and more - we used to.

You make it sound as if we've never even tried to achieve promotion or getting into the playoffs, instead shying away from the challenge. You make the situation surrounding the club appear as if there was no desire to improve.

You, I, we all know that this isn't true. Especially not under Pearson.

Again, I ask myself why you're still slagging him off in particular? It makes no sense, as you keep contradicting yourself.

[Guest MattP]

 It is not a sense of entitlement - we have to earn it and deserve it. Our ambition as a club and everything the club stands for should be about getting there - the players we sign, the management team, the strip, the pitch - everything should say 'we want to be in the Premier League'. Most important should be the fans demanding this level of commitment from whoever owns us, all the players, the manager and his team and not saying 'ah well, we are lucky to be finishing 6th in Div 2' - we should be demanding more and more - we used to.

 

If our fans become more demanding I dread to think what will happen.

 

These 'non demanding fans' were demanding the removal of Martin O'Neill after 10 games because he hadn't got us in the top six. If we listened to some of more vocal demanding fans at this club we wouldn't have had a manager in a job for more than 6 months.

 

I stand shoulder to shoulder with our fans but a very small minority are so stupid they have to be brushed off and not listened to.

[Guest]

Again - people using the comments on these boards and the moan-in as being representative of the majority of Leicester fans.

They are not!

But it's not hard to equate the general sentiment on here into the atmosphere actually at home games. Quick to jump on every little mistake, no patience, general sense that 'we're better than this'.

[Raw Dykes]

You make it sound as if we've never even tried to achieve promotion or getting into the playoffs, instead shying away from the challenge. You make the situation surrounding the club appear as if there was no desire to improve.

You, I, we all know that this isn't true. Especially not under Pearson.

Again, I ask myself why you're still slagging him off in particular? It makes no sense, as you keep contradicting yourself.

 

It's the names! They're not famous enough! How can we ever expect to be promoted with a bunch of anonymous no-mark nobodies?

 

I know you will deny it, seenitall, but this is the truth, isn't it? You equate fame with ability, and you think the club could show more ambition by simply hiring the most famous players and coaches available.

 

You don't seem to be able to grasp that the most famous players or managers aren't always the best, even though we've seen a very good example of that with our own eyes at our own club in the very recent past. You also don't seem to realise that we don't have unlimited resources, and that we have to cut back spending. While bigger names aren't necessarily better than no-name players, they do cost more.

 

I'd much rather we looked for cheap, young players who might one day turn out to be big names (not that their level of fame matters to me one jot, but the club will be making a profit off them if they do become a big name). I think it makes so much more sense to invest in these sorts of players than PL rejects who cost a fortune, and tend to be less motivated.

 

Again, I know you'll disagree that this is the reason, and you might even believe that, but this is the only conclusion I can come to after your claim that the club lacks ambition, and feel lucky to be in the 2nd tier.

[seenitall]

It's the names! They're not famous enough! How can we ever expect to be promoted with a bunch of anonymous no-mark nobodies?

 

I know you will deny it, seenitall, but this is the truth, isn't it? You equate fame with ability, and you think the club could show more ambition by simply hiring the most famous players and coaches available.

 

You don't seem to be able to grasp that the most famous players or managers aren't always the best, even though we've seen a very good example of that with our own eyes at our own club in the very recent past. You also don't seem to realise that we don't have unlimited resources, and that we have to cut back spending. While bigger names aren't necessarily better than no-name players, they do cost more.

 

I'd much rather we looked for cheap, young players who might one day turn out to be big names (not that their level of fame matters to me one jot, but the club will be making a profit off them if they do become a big name). I think it makes so much more sense to invest in these sorts of players than PL rejects who cost a fortune, and tend to be less motivated.

 

Again, I know you'll disagree that this is the reason, and you might even believe that, but this is the only conclusion I can come to after your claim that the club lacks ambition, and feel lucky to be in the 2nd tier.

Fantastic sentiments but you cannot name one instance since we sold Emile Heskey where our scouting and development of players system has created a future football star. Our players generally get sold on to smaller clubs or go to big clubs and fade away to never be heard of again. Lennon did OK but in Scotland, Savage had an average career and was possibly the only other name to really become something (ish).

The players coming up from lower leagues is a fantastic plan but it requires great scouting (ours is hit and miss) lots of patience (we need to get up too quickly) and usually a blend of older experienced players mixed with new raw talent.

Ironically in central defense and attack we seem to have those players but our midfield lacks an experienced head and having a young hungry team is only any use if theyare a good young hungry team......

We have spent arguably £10m on strikers in the past three years (Beckford £4m, Waghorn £3m and Vardy £1m and Wood £2m and paid wages to Nugent Futacs and Schlupp - £80k a week maybe with the others added in so £4m a year - value for money?

We could have signed 2 £5m guys on £40 k a week and maybe scored some goals too - instead we have Beckford now worth £1m and you would be lucky to raise another £3m from the others - how is this working for us?

The players who came to us with small but real reputations have been reduced to bargain basement sales (Mils, Beckford, Danns,Peltier with Vardy, Wood, Marshall (£1m) Whitbread, Futacs, Waghorn all looking worth leas than when they arrived. Fewer, quality players might have made the difference, we will never know.

I am sure the stattos will argue the financials until Christmas but we rarely sign quality, especially from the lower leagues and most of our team now consists of failed Prem players that you hate so much.

[Guest MattP]

I am sure the stattos will argue the financials until Christmas but we rarely sign quality, especially from the lower leagues and most of our team now consists of failed Prem players that you hate so much.

 

Kasper

De Laet

Morgan

Keane

Konchesky

James

King

Knockaert

Marshall

Nugent

Wood

 

Only Nugent and Konchesky out of the whole lot have been given a chance to show what they can do in the Premier League.

[seenitall]

Only Knocky King and Morgan have not been on the books at Premier League teams and released or sold on....knocky is French, Morgan is the only Pearson signing of this reign who has clearly improved and King is a perferct example of someone we have brought through the ranks but is yet to be high quality enough to be in demand for Prem teams. James shows promise but he is far from the messiah he is being heralded at on here.....

[Guest MattP]

I think it's hard to call them 'failed Premiership players' when they have been released because they couldn't get a game at Manchester United!

[Raw Dykes]

Fantastic sentiments but you cannot name one instance since we sold Emile Heskey where our scouting and development of players system has created a future football star. Our players generally get sold on to smaller clubs or go to big clubs and fade away to never be heard of again. Lennon did OK but in Scotland, Savage had an average career and was possibly the only other name to really become something (ish).

The players coming up from lower leagues is a fantastic plan but it requires great scouting (ours is hit and miss) lots of patience (we need to get up too quickly) and usually a blend of older experienced players mixed with new raw talent.

Ironically in central defense and attack we seem to have those players but our midfield lacks an experienced head and having a young hungry team is only any use if theyare a good young hungry team......

We have spent arguably £10m on strikers in the past three years (Beckford £4m, Waghorn £3m and Vardy £1m and Wood £2m and paid wages to Nugent Futacs and Schlupp - £80k a week maybe with the others added in so £4m a year - value for money?

We could have signed 2 £5m guys on £40 k a week and maybe scored some goals too - instead we have Beckford now worth £1m and you would be lucky to raise another £3m from the others - how is this working for us?

The players who came to us with small but real reputations have been reduced to bargain basement sales (Mils, Beckford, Danns,Peltier with Vardy, Wood, Marshall (£1m) Whitbread, Futacs, Waghorn all looking worth leas than when they arrived. Fewer, quality players might have made the difference, we will never know.

I am sure the stattos will argue the financials until Christmas but we rarely sign quality, especially from the lower leagues and most of our team now consists of failed Prem players that you hate so much.

As MattP pointed out, I wouldn't put players like James and Marshall in the same category as players like Beckford or Konchesky just because we bought them from PL clubs. Players like James might as well be signings from the lower leagues, because they'll cost about the same, and haven't yet made a name for themselves. I'm more excited by the signing of a young player I've never heard of (I'm not bothered what division the selling club is in) than an average PL player dropping down a division.

Most of what you wrote aids my argument, and I don't think you quite got what that was. I'm not saying we have been any good at using the transfer market to make a profit since the Heskey sale - I don't think we have, although there were some promising players signed the season just gone. I'm saying that finding cheap future potential stars is the way forward, and what I want to see the club aiming for. It's players like James, De Laet, Drinkwater, Marshall, Wood and Knockaert that I want to see more of - they won't cost a fortune, and there's a chance they could turn out to be very good players one day. If they don't, then there's no real loss since not much money has been spent. The potential is either a top player in the team, or several millions in the bank. In short, there's very little risk, and potentially massive rewards.

It's signings like Beckford and Mills that I don't ever want to see us make again, especially at this level. You always have to pay way over the odds to get these sort of players, and this can give the player overinflated ideas about their ability and make them complacent. They will usually be dropping down a level, which can't be good for the player's motivation. They also don't keep their value. They are always going to lose the club money.

There are so many advantages to looking for future big names, over buying older players with ready-made reputations, but the main one is that it's sustainable. The club could make a good profit if they could buy low and sell high more often than not.

[seenitall]

As MattP pointed out, I wouldn't put players like James and Marshall in the same category as players like Beckford or Konchesky just because we bought them from PL clubs. Players like James might as well be signings from the lower leagues, because they'll cost about the same, and haven't yet made a name for themselves. I'm more excited by the signing of a young player I've never heard of (I'm not bothered what division the selling club is in) than an average PL player dropping down a division.Most of what you wrote aids my argument, and I don't think you quite got what that was. I'm not saying we have been any good at using the transfer market to make a profit since the Heskey sale - I don't think we have, although there were some promising players signed the season just gone. I'm saying that finding cheap future potential stars is the way forward, and what I want to see the club aiming for. It's players like James, De Laet, Drinkwater, Marshall, Wood and Knockaert that I want to see more of - they won't cost a fortune, and there's a chance they could turn out to be very good players one day. If they don't, then there's no real loss since not much money has been spent. The potential is either a top player in the team, or several millions in the bank. In short, there's very little risk, and potentially massive rewards.It's signings like Beckford and Mills that I don't ever want to see us make again, especially at this level. You always have to pay way over the odds to get these sort of players, and this can give the player overinflated ideas about their ability and make them complacent. They will usually be dropping down a level, which can't be good for the player's motivation. They also don't keep their value. They are always going to lose the club money.There are so many advantages to looking for future big names, over buying older players with ready-made reputations, but the main one is that it's sustainable. The club could make a good profit if they could buy low and sell high more often than not.

As usual you surmise that I don't agree with you.....of course, if we had a great academy, brilliant scouts, a manager prepared to play young raw talent coupled with the skills to turn them into future stars, what is not to love about that?

Only we have not invested in any of these areas, no nurturing young talent, no real record of bringing it through to the first team, no scouting of players such as Izzet or Lennon or even Elliot, let alone a Heskey or Lineker. The last few quality players we have brought in from home grown have been sold on for nothing (Stearman, Gradel, even Schlupp was touted out this season) and only King has stayed the course but has been good/average/slightly above average over the past few years.

No one would be against this if we could make it work but pinning a promotion challenge on Nige and Shakey and Walsh doing a Clough or even an O Neill seems foolhardy, especially when you cannot point to any one of their signings or a signing that they have handled going on to greatness with us or anyone else.

Great idea but we don't have the time for it even if we had the skillset (which I don't believe we do)

[MC Prussian]

As usual you surmise that I don't agree with you.....of course, if we had a great academy, brilliant scouts, a manager prepared to play young raw talent coupled with the skills to turn them into future stars, what is not to love about that?

Only we have not invested in any of these areas, no nurturing young talent, no real record of bringing it through to the first team, no scouting of players such as Izzet or Lennon or even Elliot, let alone a Heskey or Lineker. The last few quality players we have brought in from home grown have been sold on for nothing (Stearman, Gradel, even Schlupp was touted out this season) and only King has stayed the course but has been good/average/slightly above average over the past few years.

No one would be against this if we could make it work but pinning a promotion challenge on Nige and Shakey and Walsh doing a Clough or even an O Neill seems foolhardy, especially when you cannot point to any one of their signings or a signing that they have handled going on to greatness with us or anyone else.

Great idea but we don't have the time for it even if we had the skillset (which I don't believe we do)

See, you're contradicting yourself again.

On one hand, you advocate a strong youth setup, but on the other hand, you come to the conclusion that "we don't have the time for it".

Your desperate craving for instant success is blinding your understanding of common sense and common practice.

 

How is one supposed to develop young talent if you don't invest a lot of money and time into it?

The whole idea of a youth academy is to observe, accompany and nurture up-and-coming talent over a longer span of time (ideally, four or five or even more years).

 

Maybe there are a few more gems coming through our ranks in the near future, but you cannot expect a club like Leicester to "produce" top-notch footballers on a regular basis.

Looking into the LCFC past, there's been one every few odd years. You can only unravel a gem like Shilton, Banks, Lineker or Heskey once in a decade (if you're lucky).

 

At the moment, we have two academy products in the first team with King and Schlupp. King has played a more defensive-oriented role last season, but was very effective as a CM/CDM.

It took me a while to get over it that Pearson shifted the system and focus in the scoring department to the strikers. Him and Schlupp are still quite young and can only get better.

 

I think we're about average when it comes to having youngsters coming through the ranks - I could also say a lot of other clubs are doing much worse in this matter.

Also, I'd like to add that we've faced a couple of really tumultuous years recently - a development that didn't do our youth academy that good. For a successful youth setup, you need stability and stable forces.

I do hope that we're now at the start of a more stable phase with positive growth.