Did England accomodate David Beckham?

[Fox92]

I am certainly suggesting we would have been better when the idiot bought him back in he immediately started setting goals up the vast majority of our goals again. Of all Mclarens mistakes gutting him from the team was one of the biggest. It's a game of fine margins professional football and when you've got someone who can as a trademark, plant a ball on a strikers head from 40 yards away it is ridiculous not include them in your team.

 

David Beckham over rated only rated because of his fame talk it often football fans attempting to look clever for me, it's just not true, his game was far from complete but there are very few players who can even lay claim to having a better right foot in the history of world football.

McLaren should never have been England manager anyway. A half decent manager would have been able to drop Beckham and still qualify.

Yes he had a good right foot. Then what? He rarely used his left foot, he wasn't good in the air and he wasn't good at tackling. He wasn't a great great footballer, and he isn't anywhere near getting included in the list of the greatest players ever.

[Guest MattP]

McLaren should never have been England manager anyway. A half decent manager would have been able to drop Beckham and still qualify.

Yes he had a good right foot. Then what? He rarely used his left foot, he wasn't good in the air and he wasn't good at tackling. He wasn't a great great footballer, and he isn't anywhere near getting included in the list of the greatest players ever.

 

I really hope nobody actually is.

[Manwell Pablo]

McLaren should never have been England manager anyway. A half decent manager would have been able to drop Beckham and still qualify.

Yes he had a good right foot. Then what? He rarely used his left foot, he wasn't good in the air and he wasn't good at tackling. He wasn't a great great footballer, and he isn't anywhere near getting included in the list of the greatest players ever.

 

I dunno as I said at the time I think a lot of people woefully underestimated that qualifying group Mclaren included.

 

I worry about you I really do, Lionel Messi isn't particularly good in the air or good at tackling (although Beckham was actually very good at winning the ball especially for a attacking midfielder/winger, as some of his performances for PSG showed he could still do tackle well late on in his career) He's still arguable the best player ever . 

 

He's right foot wasn't good it was outstanding.

 

I am not claiming he would make a list of the greatest players of all time there are plenty better, read the discussion, I am disagreeing that he should of been sent into international exile so that Paul Scholes was happy. Two very different things.

[Leicesterpool]

Beckham for me was probably England's best player during the sven era, it was very rare for him to have a bad game. He was probably england's only world class player for years, it's just a shame he got treated harshly. I didn't think it was fair dropping him straight after he resigned as captain, he still had many good years in him! It just proves how stupid Steve McClaren was! 

[Corky]

Beckham for me was probably England's best player during the sven era, it was very rare for him to have a bad game. He was probably england's only world class player for years, it's just a shame he got treated harshly. I didn't think it was fair dropping him straight after he resigned as captain, he still had many good years in him! It just proves how stupid Steve McClaren was! 

 

Michael Owen was world class.

[Uncle Albert]

England and Sven Goran Eriksson couldn't move past 4-4-2 and the global phenomenon David Beckham post Japan and Korea 2002, where as all the major footballing nations dropped that system and moved on with the times, technical, intelligent football, that's what is needed at International football.

 

If people honestly think a flat four across midfield with David Beckham on the right, Gerrard and Lampard in the centre and God knows who on the left would have been more effective than a midfield 3 of Gerrard, Lampard and Scholes then you need to wake up, quickly. 

 

Much is said about the way Spain play football, especially the midfield 3 of Iniesta, Xavi and Alonso dominating games for Spain since 2008. I'm not saying Gerrard and Lampard are upto the level of Iniesta and Xavi but Scholes was. England should have had the best international midfield in World football between 2004-2008, yet we didn't. That's down to the management, Capello didn't need David Beckham, look at his qualifying campaign to get to South Africa, we were the highest goal scoring team in European qualification, Capello kind of opted for a 3 man midfield in Gerrard, Lampard and Barry, it worked! Gerrard did operate more from the left though.

[Leicesterpool]

Michael Owen was world class.

When he first came on the season he was, France 1998 i mean wow! Just wished Glenn Hoddle stayed on longer now, he certainly found some talent for that world cup! but Owen was a world class for a short period, going to Real Madrid finished him off. He was never the same player again!

[Guest MattP]

I dunno as I said at the time I think a lot of people woefully underestimated that qualifying group Mclaren included.

 

I worry about you I really do, Lionel Messi isn't particularly good in the air or good at tackling (although Beckham was actually very good at winning the ball especially for a attacking midfielder/winger, as some of his performances for PSG showed he could still do tackle well late on in his career) He's still arguable the best player ever . 

 

He's right foot wasn't good it was outstanding.

 

I am not claiming he would make a list of the greatest players of all time there are plenty better, read the discussion, I am disagreeing that he should of been sent into international exile so that Paul Scholes was happy. Two very different things.

 

Surprised you have said that given you watch Spanish footy, Messi is actually pretty good in the air and scores an incredible amount of headers for a man of his size.

 

Good diving heading last night and that superb hanging header in the Champions League final spring to mind.

[Uncle Albert]

Has somebody really just posted that David Beckham was world class? He was a good footballer, nothing more, nothing less.

 

What a last minute equalising goal v Greece can do for your footballing career..

Paul Scholes was world class, David Beckham was not.

[ScouseFox]

David Beckham was world class. 

[Manwell Pablo]

England and Sven Goran Eriksson couldn't move past 4-4-2 and the global phenomenon David Beckham post Japan and Korea 2002, where as all the major footballing nations dropped that system and moved on with the times, technical, intelligent football, that's what is needed at International football.

 

If people honestly think a flat four across midfield with David Beckham on the right, Gerrard and Lampard in the centre and God knows who on the left would have been more effective than a midfield 3 of Gerrard, Lampard and Scholes then you need to wake up, quickly. 

 

Much is said about the way Spain play football, especially the midfield 3 of Iniesta, Xavi and Alonso dominating games for Spain since 2008. I'm not saying Gerrard and Lampard are upto the level of Iniesta and Xavi but Scholes was. England should have had the best international midfield in World football between 2004-2008, yet we didn't. That's down to the management, Capello didn't need David Beckham, look at his qualifying campaign to get to South Africa, we were the highest goal scoring team in European qualification, Capello kind of opted for a 3 man midfield in Gerrard, Lampard and Barry, it worked! Gerrard did operate more from the left though.

 

Not really, I doubt any of them have setup as many goals for England as Beckham, It wasn't Gerard or Lampard that dragged us through to the 2006 quarters, I do remember their embarrassing showing at 2010 though. You want to talk about continually being disappointing when it mattered have a look at those pair. Beckham did a job, continually, whenever called upon. Rarley disappointing in a England shirt   

 

if your ditching wingers for forwards you need some stability in midfield who exactly is going to hold in front of the back four in this little formation? Paul "Worst tackler in Premier League History" Scholes? As someone has pointed out this is not FIFA.

 

EDIT: Just seen the Spain thing....... I'll think you'll find Spain played 4-4-2 most of the time in 2008-10 with Villa and Torres up mixing up the likes of Silva and Iniesta on the wings. Sometimes they played 4-5-1 and whenever they played 4-3-3 they included Senna or more recently Busquets. They're tactically diverse I've seen them play 4-5-1 4-4-2 4-3-3 even the 4-6-0 over the last 4 years they aren't stuck to one formation....tbh the idea that there is one complete and ideal right formation and one right team for the English national team to play is why a lot of England fans annoy me. 

[Manwell Pablo]

Surprised you have said that given you watch Spanish footy, Messi is actually pretty good in the air and scores an incredible amount of headers for a man of his size.

 

Good diving heading last night and that superb hanging header in the Champions League final spring to mind.

 

He's not "particularly" good in the air not incapable, don't get me wrong unmarked on his head he'd probably score you don't get many pro footballers who are bad at heading a ball when free, he's not going to come screaming into the box out jump a six foot defender and power a header into the top corner from a set piece is he. Got nothing on the likes of Ronaldo. 

[Guest MattP]

Has somebody really just posted that David Beckham was world class? He was a good footballer, nothing more, nothing less.

 

What a last minute equalising goal v Greece can do for your footballing career..

Paul Scholes was world class, David Beckham was not.

 

Agree. Ridiculous to label him World Class.

He's not "particularly" good in the air not incapable, don't get me wrong unmarked on his head he'd probably score you don't get many pro footballers who are bad at heading a ball when free, he's not going to come screaming into the box out jump a six foot defender and power a header into the top corner from a set piece is he. Got nothing on the likes of Ronaldo. 

 

That's down to his height rather than anything. I think he's more than adequete in the air, you just won't see it unless he is unmarked.

 

Loads of pro footballers are garbage in the air when unmarked. Just watch any game.

[Uncle Albert]

Gerrard would easily of been able to be the holding force in that midfield, with his passing qualities as well.

Gerrard who's goal was one of the reasons England made it out of that World Cup group v Sweden? Or the same David Beckham who couldn't last 120 minutes v Portugal..

Look at the amount of goals Frank Lampard has contributed for England and Gerrard for that matter.

Add Paul Scholes in to that and you would have such a much better midfield. Oh wait Spain, France, Germany and Holland base their midfield on FIFA..

[ScouseFox]

Well I'd wager Gerrard wouldn't have scored very many England goals at all playing the defensive midfield role in your magnificent formation. 

[Dan]

I knew this would split peoples opinions.

 

Beckham in general does. I do like the bloke but we've had far better footballers, Scholes being one of them (and he was definitely valued less than Beckham).

[emmo1987]

Diamond

-----scholes-----

-Beckham--Lampard-

-----Gerrard-----

or

Sinclair Gerrard Hargreaves guppy

[The Year Of The Fox]

I wouldn't say we ever tried to accommodate Beckham. He was rarely a liability for us. Rooney on the other hand....

[Guest MattP]

I wouldn't say we ever tried to accommodate Beckham. He was rarely a liability for us. Rooney on the other hand....

 

Brazil QF in 94 he probably cost us the game along with Seaman. Played unfit and ducked out of a tackle that led to them equalising.

 

Also worth remembering that was the game where tactical genius Sven played Scholes on the left wing to accomodate Nicky Butt and the unfit Beckham in the centre, just before at 2-1 down he took off Michael Owen for Darius Vassell, I kid you not.

 

Here's one to make you feel old as well, David Seaman was 50 last week.

[The Year Of The Fox]

Brazil QF in 94 he probably cost us the game along with Seaman. Played unfit and ducked out of a tackle that led to them equalising.

 

Also worth remembering that was the game where tactical genius Sven played Scholes on the left wing to accomodate Nicky Butt and the unfit Beckham in the centre, just before at 2-1 down he took off Michael Owen for Darius Vassell, I kid you not.

 

Here's one to make you feel old as well, David Seaman was 50 last week.

I remember the game though it was 02 not 94 though I assume you meant 04!

 

Can't remember the Scholes on the left thing though.

 

But yeh Beckham avoiding that challenege that led to their equaliser on the half way line and his red in 98 have been his only downfalls.

[Guest MattP]

I remember the game though it was 02 not 94 though I assume you meant 04!

 

Can't remember the Scholes on the left thing though.

 

Yep!

 

I didn't to be fair until the other week, watched it on an ESPN classic re run and couldnt believe what I was seeing, Scholed shifted out left and Trevor Sinclair, Kieron Dyer and Beckham trying to create our chances.

[Kitchandro]

We certainly accomodated Beckham for about 3 years whilst he was playing crap and Sven didn't have the balls to drop him.

[Manwell Pablo]

Gerrard would easily of been able to be the holding force in that midfield, with his passing qualities as well.

Gerrard who's goal was one of the reasons England made it out of that World Cup group v Sweden? Or the same David Beckham who couldn't last 120 minutes v Portugal..

Look at the amount of goals Frank Lampard has contributed for England and Gerrard for that matter.

Add Paul Scholes in to that and you would have such a much better midfield. Oh wait Spain, France, Germany and Holland base their midfield on FIFA..

 

 

No he's not he's not a holding midfield player or anything like one. You need to be able to do a bit more than pass. There were questions around their defensive abilitys when playing the more solid 4-4-2 formation when you let your wingers of the hook defensively and play three players like Scholes Lampard Gerrard it's a FIFA formation. When you've got a proper defending holding midfielder like a Khderia, De Jong, Senna or a Busquets then it's something a sane football manager might consider in real life. Anyway as I've told you I think you'll find they've all switcher their formations on numerous occasions since 2002 and Spain won 2008 and 2010 and played 4-4-2 in points in both tournaments. 

 

He got injured Actually your right because he occasionally gets injured your right should never of played international football, ridiculous lofty. Dress it up anyway you want he turned up more often or not when we needed him unlike those two. I've looked how many goals they've scored seems he's made more than either have scored.....so not seeing your point.

[Manwell Pablo]

We certainly accomodated Beckham for about 3 years whilst he was playing crap and Sven didn't have the balls to drop him.

 

When? He went in 2006, we won three games at 2006 without David Beckham we'd of won none of them.

[Bert]

Beckham had one thing in his locker that no-one else could even get close to at the time. Set pieces.

There's no question in my mind that Paul Scholes could've played behind the striker in a 4-4-1-1 and it could've worked. Beckham was a great asset for us until he stepped down as captain. He loved playing for us and rightly so.

Think it's unfair to say he cost Scholes a good international career. We were playing 4-4-2 at the time - Beckham played wide right not Central midfielder. Let's not forget the great understanding Becks and G.Nev had with each other. That played a big part in it all for me.

Absolutely criminal that Scholes was sacrificed though.