Rincewind Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 Strangely enough the Secular Society defends religious freedom. There was a case where a street preacher was being shouted at by a couple of young girls and he responded verbally. they took him to court. The Secular Society funded his case because they said he had a right to express his views. They also oppose one faith schools. I might be less tolerant than I am supposed to be as a member. I dislike street preachers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 I'd find it a bit disconcerting if my tutor turned up in a skimpy bikini but I guess I could acclimatise and fit in with that cultural style I guess you could lose track of what the course was about though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 Would it be an appropriate form of attire for a training session aimed at 40 somethings females looking at returning to work after raising a family? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merging Cultures Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 Did you use the advanced search found by clicking on the little gear wheel at the side of the search box in the top right corner? Never noticed that before! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 Would it be an appropriate for of dress for a training session aimed at 40 somethings females looking at returning to work after raising a family? There's plenty of blokes that like to parade around in the pants and seemingly quite a few women with families that like to see them. But then men aren't allowed to be seen ogling like this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HuHV4gwSXn4 It's a crazy mixed up changing world hopefully it'll all level itself out either that, Sodom and Gomorrah or nuclear holocaust long after I've gone though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MooseBreath Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 As I said: Society, Governments, Corporations, Friends, Family, Religion, manipulate us to make choices I think 'manipulate' is a bit strong really. 'Mildy influence' seems fairer. At the end of the day we all make our own choices in this country. I think to imply that people are manipulated is a bit patronising. Sure there might be some particularly vulnerable people out there but I believe most of us, even women, are perfectly capable of independent decision making and in the case of women objectifying themselves, it's absolutely their choice. If I was a woman baring all in a cheap tart rag I reckon I'd find the implication that it wasn't my choice far more offensive than the expected objectification. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 Yes women on a girls night out can be worse than men. Like you said its a mixed up crazy world.(lyrics?) Some men would be embarrassed if they could hear what is said about them behind their backs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leicsmac Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 I think 'manipulate' is a bit strong really. 'Mildy influence' seems fairer. At the end of the day we all make our own choices in this country. I think to imply that people are manipulated is a bit patronising. Sure there might be some particularly vulnerable people out there but I believe most of us, even women, are perfectly capable of independent decision making and in the case of women objectifying themselves, it's absolutely their choice. If I was a woman baring all in a cheap tart rag I reckon I'd find the implication that it wasn't my choice far more offensive than the expected objectification. I'd like to believe that were true, but I think the media does a very good job of influencing a lot of people into a particular course of action that they desire. And that course comes directly from the media owners themselves, either in bed with or directly opposing the government of the day. If you get enough people onside for one decision, democracy will finish the job for you. I think it's the lack of informed choices that is the real problem - people either can't or won't access enough information to make an informed choice about something, and if that's the case they may as well have no choice at all. But that is of course up to them. Good grief, I'm becoming Zingari Mk II, aren't I? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merging Cultures Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 I think 'manipulate' is a bit strong really. 'Mildy influence' seems fairer. At the end of the day we all make our own choices in this country. I think to imply that people are manipulated is a bit patronising. Sure there might be some particularly vulnerable people out there but I believe most of us, even women, are perfectly capable of independent decision making and in the case of women objectifying themselves, it's absolutely their choice. If I was a woman baring all in a cheap tart rag I reckon I'd find the implication that it wasn't my choice far more offensive than the expected objectification. A good point well made. I agree, it does sound patronising to say that we are not able to make our own informed decisions. However, our decisions are obviously limited to what Government and Society allows through laws and norms. So, within the confines of those laws and norms, yes we can make decisions. Going further, our decisions are typically based on knowledge gained from mass media and literature which is created by people operating within the norms of society. We can and should question what we hear and learn. Unfortunately, not many people do. So, I disagree that most of us make truly informed decisions, me included. I don't know what I don't know. I am coming across as somewhat paranoid here! On the whole I think the Government is trying to improve the quality of life in the UK. Is there a governing class that deliberately keeps people dumb and in place? I don't think it is necessarily a deliberate action these days. I think media and companies are pitching their products at the lowest common denominator and the mass market. Not necessarily as a deliberate action to dumb people down, but I think that ends up being the situation. Which given how connected and reliant on media we all are these days ends up being a growing problem. Look at the rise of 'reality tv' etc. Media and companies are in the business of keeping people happy, which might be at the expense of us asking the right questions. Turn the TV off! /rant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 That is the thing with 'influencing' We do not know it is happening. From the moment we are born our lives are mapped out according to who we interact with. Parents schoolf-riends work colleagues and social contacts. Yes we have a choice as we develop but in a close-knit group with little contact with other choices you will be influenced more towards one direction. I was brought up in an open minded family. I was allowed the choice of my path.Sure I have had influences but as for others they are based on personal experience and friends and associates. Who knows what I would be if born 10 miles away and a few years later. I might even be a Forest fan. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 There's plenty of influences from all directions and all views some may be stronger than others but on the basics of life you can still choose which path to follow. I was brought up in a very strict C of E environment with church 2 times every Sunday plus Sunday School but i'm about as far as you can get from being a religious person. Sure i've adopted aspects of that culture in the way i behave but I believe i would have chosen those principles from a non-religious family influence. I'm more concerned about the lack of / conflicting information on financial/political decision making hence why I have no trust in any political party or many of the government institutions with so many vested interests, self serving get rich quick by any means and passing the buck people. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 Much the way I think. There are some closed communities though of which it is hard to get out of. Although you say you were brought up as a strict Catholic you had the opportunity to meet others and think about other POV. Some do not have that chance. Even the Royals to some extent. They are brought up in a Royal Household follow the accustomed direction with school college without meeting the likes of you and me. Their lives are geared to be a Royal but they know little of any other way. I would be surprised if William for instance gave it all up to work in a chippy. he could not handle it as we could not handle or be a Royal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davieG Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 Much the way I think. There are some closed communities though of which it is hard to get out of. Although you say you were brought up as a strict Catholic you had the opportunity to meet others and think about other POV. Some do not have that chance. Even the Royals to some extent. They are brought up in a Royal Household follow the accustomed direction with school college without meeting the likes of you and me. Their lives are geared to be a Royal but they know little of any other way. I would be surprised if William for instance gave it all up to work in a chippy. he could not handle it as we could not handle or be a Royal. C of E not catholic, The Royal Family is an extreme example. The may not meet the likes of me and you but they do meet lots of people, like Matt and Moosy at their colleges. Of course there different levels in society but there are many example of people that have risen to the top from the bottom all though sadly the only ones who get publicised are theatrical and sports personalities along with the famous for being famous lot. Then you've got the likes of Tony Benn who gave up his hereditary peerage to follow his conscience, where did that influence come from/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rincewind Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 No expert on it. Wish I had studied this sort of thing then i could confuse everyone with big words and fancy talk. Perhaps he got along with servants better than his parents when growing up or maybe they installed part of it into him. He had a strong personality and was an intellegent thinker. That allows you to be more independant instead of accepting things. I was thinking more of something like the Rednecks on americas Bible Belt there are a few that get away from it but only if they are away from their home community for a while. In fact a few are questioning their teachings as more and more information and ways of finding it become wider. The internet is now available to almost anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 17 July 2014 Share Posted 17 July 2014 Ben's next trip on his tolerance walk was to the Bible Belt, he had seen the Westboro baptist church and that formed his considered opinion on the whole of the south, as he walked beyond the cars with painted flames and saw the odd old fella plucking away he knew that this sort of life wasn't for he, white trash was it? That's not a life for Ben anyway, Ben had now been to Mosque three times and was convinced with a bit more guidance his wife would soon be sent from the jungles of Nigeria, he had watched Boko Harem liberate the Christian schoolgirls (or were they Catholic, all the same to Ben) and was just waiting for his child bride. It didn't take him long, he uttered the work 'redneck' to a pretty young yokel after a morning on the moonshine - a bigoted insult no more for a Liberal like Ben and they gazed at him, gazed like a dhimmi who had just been told he couldn't shake the young girls hand due to religious reasons, an awkward elephant man type erection situation had been avoided though to the copious amount swallowed. The Church visit didn't go well, it was all questions and hyberbole from Ben, the site of women and men sitting together confused him, where are the womens rights to sit in the building next door away from the men?, why were their faces out blazing in the glorious Alabama sunlight? Surely this was not their choice, what women would want to be seen by another man? He wanted to ask but was unaware of the full facts, the mainstream news in Auburn made no mention of it, if they had wireless he would post it to his new blog. Next week, Ben visits San Francisco and gets a naughty surprise on the Castro that tests his new found faith. Inshallah he will avoid temptation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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