VW

[Leeds Fox]

What's been going on with their emission results 'rigging' in the U.S?

I've only caught bits in the news and the Internet articles I've seen aren't clear and contain as much speculation as facts.

[Unabomber]

basically if you have shares in vw i feel bad for you son i got 99 problems but a polo aint 1

[Bellend Sebastian]

They've been caught putting software in the engine management systems that can detect when an emissions test is being done which then makes the engine temporarily puff out less pollution than it would otherwise.

Cue massive recall, huge fines and maybe even criminal charges

[Will1981]

Skoda, Seat and Audi will also have the same software.

[Carl the Llama]

Kia are still cool though, right?

[Jattdogg]

Complete ban on sales in north america is in order for a few years.

Same should go for any manufacturer guilty of similar criminal offenses. How GM is still allowed to sell cars is beyond me after ignition gate.

[Guest]

I could see a lot of lawsuits coming up over this.

 

VW is not a very likable company at the moment, and hasn't been for quite a while. Suzuki is probably glad their partnership never took hold.

[Jattdogg]

Well anyone who owns Affected VW models just lost all resale value. Id imagine they would want full sticker value back based on fact the cars were sold on promise of clean diesel and low emissions. I'm sure people looked into this as one of their decisions for purchasing.

[ozleicester]

This is an example of the power of money over people.

 

Major corporations care about nothing but profit and are prepared to throw anyone and everyone to the wolves to gain an extra few millon in their back pockets, these are the CEO's that people defend and tell us are worth their multi million dollar pay packets, lying cheating bastards,

 

Put a cap on CEO salaries  introduce/increase super profits taxation, increase the powers of investigation. PROTECT WHISTLE BLOWERS!!

 

That so many people could be involved in such an outrageous act of corporate bastardry and cover up, should be a warning sign to everyone that no company can be trusted.

[stix]

I just don't understand how they got it SO wrong. I read yesterday that the cars affected are pumping out FORTY TIMES the legal emissions limit, that sounds ridiculous!

Surely, if VW can't get their cars any cleaner than 40 times the limit, other manufacturers must be using the same kind of tactics??

[Julian Joachim Jr Shabadoo]

On Watchdog a few months back they did a feature about certain Fiat 500s that couldn't climb hills because in order to meet emissions standards, they knowingly added a flat spot in the rev range to drop emissions (and power). It seemed like a scam and potentially dangerous but never caused a huge uproar - how is this so different? It's all over the news

[yorkie1999]

I think other manufacturers will get sucked into this, bmw and merc both produce powerful diesel engines and you can't get power without high emissions. The other thing is the US has far lower emissions limits than we do, so car manufacturers may be ok here, but have to alter the mapping in the ecu to get by the regs. I bought a ktm enduro bike a few years ago, and that came with a kit you had to fit yourself to give it full power for exactly the same reason, so its not just VW who are bending the rules.

[Basingstoke Fox]

I'm interested to see if this will affect UK cars as I could potentially be affected. I currently only pay £30 per year on a Golf for VED (road tax) due to the reported low emissions. However if the software is updated to provide a true representation of the emissions and they're actually much higher, I'll expect Volkswagen to sort the engine so that it actually provides the required output, so I don't have to pay any extra.

 

Having such low emissions for a 2.0 TDI did seem too good to be true, I guess it probably was.

[Guest]

I'm interested to see if this will affect UK cars as I could potentially be affected. I currently only pay £30 per year on a Golf for VED (road tax) due to the reported low emissions. However if the software is updated to provide a true representation of the emissions and they're actually much higher, I'll expect Volkswagen to sort the engine so that it actually provides the required output, so I don't have to pay any extra.

 

Having such low emissions for a 2.0 TDI did seem too good to be true, I guess it probably was.

Then the question is, how much will this affect performance? 

 

Honestly gobsmacked that any company would think this is a good idea, that they would never get caught. But equally surprised that it took an independent study to accidentally stumble across it. Regulators never do "real world" emissions testing, only in easily recognisable lab conditions?

[simmo1977]

I've not tested my VW yet, if anyone knows where I plug a computer into my 1972 beetle I'd appreciate it.

 

Can't believe I bought it under false pretenses.

[Basingstoke Fox]

Then the question is, how much will this affect performance? 

 

Honestly gobsmacked that any company would think this is a good idea, that they would never get caught. But equally surprised that it took an independent study to accidentally stumble across it. Regulators never do "real world" emissions testing, only in easily recognisable lab conditions?

 

A good point. Ultimately, I would expect the performance and emissions to reach the figures that they said it would do when they sold it.

 

I was considering remapping the engine recently, but will hold off for now as I don't want to give them an easy way out if they dispute it at all.

[Guest]

The leaders of the western world are dirty cheating liars. Throw your porsches away.

[Bellend Sebastian]

Why this is important:

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/nearly-9500-people-die-early-in-a-single-year-in-london-as-a-result-of-air-pollution-study-finds-10390729.html

 

And that's just in f***** London.

 

I drive a petrol car, so although I won't poison everyone, I am doing my bit to ultimately make the earth uninhabitable by pumping out lovely clouds of CO₂ whenever I go for a leisure drive.

 

Bloody cyclists, slowing people down occasionally but not actually killing us.  No wonder they think they own the place etc

[yorkie1999]

On the plus side, at least VW will have plenty of cheap labour in the future.

[yorkie1999]

Why this is important:

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/nearly-9500-people-die-early-in-a-single-year-in-london-as-a-result-of-air-pollution-study-finds-10390729.html

 

And that's just in f***** London.

 

I drive a petrol car, so although I won't poison everyone, I am doing my bit to ultimately make the earth uninhabitable by pumping out lovely clouds of CO₂ whenever I go for a leisure drive.

 

Bloody cyclists, slowing people down occasionally but not actually killing us.  No wonder they think they own the place etc

Hang on, Weren't the government pushing diesel engined cars a few years back saying they were far cleaner with lower emissions, hence the reason 2.0L diesels have a low tax bracket. All stinks of money making in the background.

[Frank to be]

Can't believe it took so long for the chief to resign. Did he really think he was just going to carry on as normal? You've just cheated millions of people and the planet earth mate.

[Bellend Sebastian]

Hang on, Weren't the government pushing diesel engined cars a few years back saying they were far cleaner with lower emissions, hence the reason 2.0L diesels have a low tax bracket. All stinks of money making in the background.

What happened was, and it's spectacular oversight, that everybody got so excited about global warming (and rightly so) there has been a massive move towards diesel vehicles. The problem with this brilliant plan is that although diesels do generally produce far less CO₂ (the main 'greenhouse' gas) they produce a lot more pollutants that are directly hazardous - Nitrogen Dioxide is I believe the bad one that's a big constituent of smog and the one that gives people asthma and reduces life expectancy.

I don't think it's really a money making thing (except perhaps on the part of motor manufacturers) more a lack of foresight

Edit: It's Nitrogen Dioxide, not Nitrous Oxide (that's the laughing gas that comes in the tiny metal bottles). Might be quite nice if they were pumping that out

[yorkie1999]

What happened was, and it's spectacular oversight, that everybody got so excited about global warming (and rightly so) there has been a massive move towards diesel vehicles.  The problem with this brilliant plan is that although diesels do generally produce far less CO₂ (the main 'greenhouse' gas) they produce a lot more pollutants that are directly hazardous - Nitrous Oxide is I believe the bad one that's a big constituent of smog and the one that gives people asthma and reduces life expectancy.

 

I don't think it's really a money making thing (except perhaps on the part of motor manufacturers) more a lack of foresight

 Interesting this has come out into the public domain and it could open a huge can of worms. It is basically remapping the ecu software to put less fuel into the engine.  What i would like to know is, how do i know that the car i have bought can do the claimed mileage the manufacturer states, what stops them from remapping the software to give lower fuel consumption during government tests. I have never seen any car do the stated mileage, whatever i do to adjust my driving to gain more mpg. 

[davieG]

On Watchdog a few months back they did a feature about certain Fiat 500s that couldn't climb hills because in order to meet emissions standards, they knowingly added a flat spot in the rev range to drop emissions (and power). It seemed like a scam and potentially dangerous but never caused a huge uproar - how is this so different? It's all over the news

That sounds like the Vauxhall Meriva I've just bought, I've had some crap cars but for pulling ability, not women although it's probably rock bottom for that it's appalling.

 

It's alright in some gears and some situations but going from 3rd to 4th and 4th to 5th it's like I've just put the brakes on.

[Guest]

 Interesting this has come out into the public domain and it could open a huge can of worms. It is basically remapping the ecu software to put less fuel into the engine.  What i would like to know is, how do i know that the car i have bought can do the claimed mileage the manufacturer states, what stops them from remapping the software to give lower fuel consumption during government tests. I have never seen any car do the stated mileage, whatever i do to adjust my driving to gain more mpg. 

As far as I'm aware the claimed MPG is done entirely by the manufacturer, not government or independent regulators. So it's probably meaningless. :-/