Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 Just now, toddybad said: Growth has been pretty route across much of the western world due to austerity politics. It's just that now the UK has slowing growth just at the point other countries are heading in the opposite direction. The crash was pretty bad across the Western world due to non austerity politics.
Guest Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 (edited) 39 minutes ago, Webbo said: If it's the choice between accepting the deal or leaving with no deal then, despite it being a waste of money, I'd accept that. If we get to vote whether to accept the deal or stay in then that's unacceptable because why would the EU give us any kind of decent deal? We just need to get on with it now. All us pensioners will be dead in 20 years time we can reapply then if we want to. Don't be bloody ridiculous. Deal or no deal isn't a choice. It has to include all options including remain. It's a democracy. If the deal is agreed or the vote is to not accept the deal so we have to go back to the table to get a better deal but still leave then fine but you can't remove the option to stay just because you don't like it. Once the terms are clear that might end up as the best option. Edited 14 January 2018 by Guest
Rogstanley Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 50 minutes ago, Webbo said: But when you said; Would it be correct to say that you were wrong? Did the UK out perform the EU during that time? The UK is in the EU. UK GDP growth has been middling at best since 2010. I would say among comparable countries we are near the bottom of the table so no, that would not be fair to say at all.
Guest Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 2 minutes ago, Webbo said: The crash was pretty bad across the Western world due to non austerity politics. The crash was nothing to do with monetary policy though. No matter how much you want to blame labour.
Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 1 minute ago, toddybad said: Don't be bloody ridiculous. Deal or no deal isn't a choice. It has to include all options unfolding remain. It's a democracy. If the deal is taken out the vote is to go back to the table to get a better deal but still leave then fine but you can't remove the option to stay just because you don't like it. Once the terms are clear that might end up as the best option. The EU want to keep us in as their cash cow and so that they can control us. If it's a choice between leaving or staying in they'll give us the worse deal possible. That's obvious.
Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 1 minute ago, Rogstanley said: The UK is in the EU. UK GDP growth has been middling at best since 2010. I would say among comparable countries we are near the bottom of the table so no, that would not be fair to say at all. So even counting our growth during 2012 they still managed to be in recession? They were doing worse than I thought.
Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 3 minutes ago, toddybad said: The crash was nothing to do with monetary policy though. No matter how much you want to blame labour. If you say so. The slow growth is nothing to do with austerity.
Rogstanley Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 1 minute ago, Webbo said: So even counting our growth during 2012 they still managed to be in recession? They were doing worse than I thought. Do you actually think these sort of comments come across as intelligent?
Rogstanley Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Webbo said: If you say so. The slow growth is nothing to do with austerity. LMAO Edited 14 January 2018 by Rogstanley
Guest Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 4 minutes ago, Webbo said: The EU want to keep us in as their cash cow and so that they can control us. If it's a choice between leaving or staying in they'll give us the worse deal possible. That's obvious. We don't have to say what the question is before any referendum. But the question does need to include all options. Besides which, of the vote is to agree the deal, say, it would end the controversy and arguments once and for all.
Guest Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 4 minutes ago, Webbo said: If you say so. The slow growth is nothing to do with austerity. Lmao. What is it to do with then?
Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 3 minutes ago, Rogstanley said: LMAO I think you're protesting too much.
Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 Just now, toddybad said: Lmao. What is it to do with then? If Labour did such a good job, why did you vote conservative in 2010?
Rogstanley Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 4 minutes ago, Webbo said: I think you're protesting too much. No, good job, you had me going there for a minute
Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 If we take Stroke's graph; and compare it to American growth in this graph here https://www.statista.com/statistics/188165/annual-gdp-growth-of-the-united-states-since-1990/ you'll see the UK had higher growth from 2013 to 2016. Now Obama pumped money into the American economy, so austerity outperformed fiscal stimulus for 4 of the 7 years shown.
Strokes Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 15 minutes ago, Webbo said: If we take Stroke's graph; and compare it to American growth in this graph here https://www.statista.com/statistics/188165/annual-gdp-growth-of-the-united-states-since-1990/ you'll see the UK had higher growth from 2013 to 2016. Now Obama pumped money into the American economy, so austerity outperformed fiscal stimulus for 4 of the 7 years shown. I like the quote ‘’UK GDP growth has been middling at best since 2010’’ best. According to that graph 2010 was 1.9%, which has been bettered or matched 3 out of 8 of those years. @Rogstanley you make such a shit fake socialist
Guest Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 (edited) 1 hour ago, Webbo said: If Labour did such a good job, why did you vote conservative in 2010? I've said this before. Sometimes a government runs out of ideas. It happened to Labour. Cameron actively went out of his way to push the buttons of the centre left in opposition but as soon as he was elected turned into somebody that pushed through hugely regressive social policies and a poorly thought through economic proposition. At the time I didn't recognise the dangers of that economic proposition and regret my vote in hindsight. You didn't answer the question though. You keep saying that policies which reduce government spending (much of which goes to business) and keep down pay (which means people spend less in local businesses) are not anti growth. I want you to explain to me why you think growth is slower than elsewhere and slowing further. If I'm wrong, explain how you've come to that conclusion. Edited 14 January 2018 by Guest
Rogstanley Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 43 minutes ago, Strokes said: I like the quote ‘’UK GDP growth has been middling at best since 2010’’ best. According to that graph 2010 was 1.9%, which has been bettered or matched 3 out of 8 of those years. @Rogstanley you make such a shit fake socialist I used 2010 because that's the year the conservatives came to power and 'middling' relates to how UK growth compares to other countries. It's actually a very generous description. 1
Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 1 hour ago, toddybad said: I've said this before. Sometimes a government runs out of ideas. It happened to Labour. Cameron actively went out of his way to push the buttons of the centre left in opposition but as soon as he was elected turned into somebody that pushed through hugely regressive social policies and a poorly thought through economic proposition. At the time I didn't recognise the dangers of that economic proposition and regret my vote in hindsight. You didn't answer the question though. You keep saying that policies which reduce government spending (much of which goes to business) and keep down pay (which means people spend less in local businesses) are not anti growth. I want you to explain to me why you think growth is slower than elsewhere and slowing further. If I'm wrong, explain how you've come to that conclusion. Because we've had decent growth since those policies were introduced. The evidence is there.
Buce Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 Trump row could kill off swift post-Brexit trade deal, says former UK envoy Donald Trump’s deteriorating relationship with Britain is likely to kill off any lingering cabinet hopes of a swift post-Brexit trade deal with the United States, a former British ambassador to Washington has warned. Sir Nigel Sheinwald said that a series of controversial interventions by the US president in British issues meant that the remote prospect of a quick transatlantic deal, heralded by pro-Brexit cabinet members, should now be “put out of our minds” for good. His intervention comes as a new poll highlights the British public’s opposition to Trump in the wake of his decision to cancel a trip to the UK, with fewer than a fifth of voters (18%) believing he is a friend of Britain. Almost three-quarters of voters (72%) also believe that the US president is a risk to international stability, according to a new Opinium poll for the Observer. A similar proportion (71%) believe he is untrustworthy. Two in five voters believe that Trump should not be visiting Britain at all. The dim view taken by the British public over the outspoken president comes after Whitehall insiders suggested that the clashes he has had with Britain over the last year contributed to his decision to cancel a visit to open the new US embassy in London. A mass protest had also been expected during Trump’s visit, which would have marked a further embarrassment for the president. The special relationship between the UK and US has taken a series of hits since Theresa May became the first foreign leader to visit President Trump at the start of last year. Trump has attacked the London mayor, Sadiq Khan, re-tweeted posts by a British far-right group, and publicly turned on May for criticising his comments. Trump confirmed on Twitter last week that he had cancelled a trip to open the new US embassy in Vauxhall because he disagreed with the process of moving it from Mayfair to an “off location” south of the Thames. While he blamed the Obama administration, the deal was signed under George W Bush’s presidency. In an extraordinary intervention, the US embassy itself took the step of releasing a detailed statement correcting the president. The highly unusual move is a sign of the tensions between Trump and his international diplomats. Sheinwald, the British ambassador to the US from 2007 to 2012, said he had always believed that a swift trade deal with the US was unlikely, but that the latest episode should end hopes by some Brexiters that it could be done by Brexit day in March 2019. “Given that Trump’s attitude to the UK seems to have changed for the worst over the last year, at least in a superficial and tonal way, I think that takes out another of the arguments for thinking that this would be a great positive for the UK in the post-Brexit world,” he said. “It will be important for us to get a deal with the Americans, but it will take a long time. “If you’re a Liam Fox [the international trade secretary], who has staked so much on the American deal being easy and within our reach around the same time as Brexit, then the way in which the bilateral relationship has atrophied and the tone has changed in the last year since May’s first visit is quite a big blow. “It means we should put out of our minds the idea that just around the corner when we leave the EU there is a magical deal with the US that is going to solve all our trade and industrial problems. Absolutely not.” Sir Christopher Meyer, another former British ambassador to the US, said that he believed the current cooling of relations made little difference, as the chances of a swift deal had always been far-fetched. Sadiq Khan, who welcomed Trump’s decision to shelve his trip to the UK, was targeted by pro-Trump protesters yesterday as he gave a speech in central London. His address was delayed by a few minutes after a demonstration by a group called the White Pendragons. They were escorted out of the venue by police. After Trump’s recent declaration that he believed he was a “stable genius”, many British voters compare themselves favourably against the president’s intellect. Almost half (47%) believe they are more intelligent than Trump, according to the Opinium poll. More than two-fifths (44%) believe Trump is less intelligent than the average person. A fifth (18%) believe he is more intelligent than average. In terms of overall party support, the poll showed that Labour and the Tories are now neck-and-neck on 40% support. It means Labour has relinquished a two-point lead from a month ago. The Liberal Democrats continue to struggle on just 6% support. Vince Cable, the Lib Dem leader, has a lower net approval rating (-19%) than either Jeremy Corbyn (-10) or Theresa May (-17%). May’s lead over Corbyn on who would make the best prime minister has fallen very slightly, from six points to five points. https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/jan/13/trump-tension-risk-quick-us-uk-trade-deal
Guest Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 34 minutes ago, Webbo said: Because we've had decent growth since those policies were introduced. The evidence is there. But growth is less than it was with different policies and less than most of europe. So why do you think that is?
Webbo Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 5 minutes ago, toddybad said: But growth is less than it was with different policies and less than most of europe. So why do you think that is? Partly Brexit, which has nothing to do with austerity and partly as I explained before we're at a different stage in the economic cycle. Obama pumped money into the economy, we didn't and yet our economy out grew theirs for 4 years out of 7. So why do you think that is?
Guest Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 14 minutes ago, Webbo said: Partly Brexit, which has nothing to do with austerity and partly as I explained before we're at a different stage in the economic cycle. Obama pumped money into the economy, we didn't and yet our economy out grew theirs for 4 years out of 7. So why do you think that is? Because that isn't true. He oversaw spending cuts until his final year in office.
Rogstanley Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 (edited) 2 hours ago, Webbo said: Partly Brexit, which has nothing to do with austerity and partly as I explained before we're at a different stage in the economic cycle. Obama pumped money into the economy, we didn't and yet our economy out grew theirs for 4 years out of 7. So why do you think that is? Can you explain in detail what stage of the “economic cycle” the uk is at, what stage the eurozone is at, how each has come to be at that stage and why that has impacted upon growth rates? Also please explain how the fact that Germany’s growth post recession was much, much stronger than ours doesn’t show that absolutely everything you have said on this subject today is completely fabricated, hopeless bollocks? Edited 14 January 2018 by Rogstanley
Guest Posted 14 January 2018 Posted 14 January 2018 5 minutes ago, Rogstanley said: Can you explain in detail what stage of the “economic cycle” the uk is at, what stage the eurozone is at, how each has come to be at that stage and why that has impacted upon growth rates? Also please explain how the fact that Germany’s growth post recession was much, much stronger than ours doesn’t show that absolutely everything you have said on this subject today is completely fabricated, hopeless bollocks? Bless him, he tries. I don't know why. But he tries.
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