One step forward two steps backs

[Webbo]

11 hours ago, UniFox21 said:

You mean Richarlison play acting from normal tackles, in tandem with the Everton dugout screaming for bookings.

That happens every week with every team. It's not a unique situation.

[UniFox21]

28 minutes ago, Webbo said:

That happens every week with every team. It's not a unique situation.

Doesn't make it any better man, hate seeing the coaching team spring up every few minutes or players rolling on the floor. 

Football shouldn't be about who can con the ref best to get ahead of the opposition 

[Webbo]

2 minutes ago, UniFox21 said:

Doesn't make it any better man, hate seeing the coaching team spring up every few minutes or players rolling on the floor. 

Football shouldn't be about who can con the ref best to get ahead of the opposition 

That's irrelevant. It happens every week. It's not hard to anticipate.

[UniFox21]

11 minutes ago, Webbo said:

That's irrelevant. It happens every week. It's not hard to anticipate.

In hindsight deffo, we all could potentially see it happening, just hoped Wes would have seen it too.

Just gets me annoyed how its now accepted as "normal" in todays game.

[RumbleFox]

1 hour ago, Bunyip said:

He's the manager. He's been in top flight management for years. If he didn't see the second Yellow coming when everyone in the ground could see it coming then he has no right to be the manager. He should not have to " learn " such basic man management.

Do you ever get bored of being so over the top reactionary and negative?  Do you ever re-read your posts and think "shit, I thought I came across as a realist but I just sound boring?".  Nowhere did I say he didn't see it, merely that it was a big call and he got it wrong but to suggest that people cannot still learn new things and continue to improve is both mental and deeply depressing.  I know you want him gone, I know that I don't.  I may be wrong, I often am, but to get quite so angry with him over the Morgan thing seems a little childish.  I thought we were all adults, capable of reason and constructiveness?

Edited 9 October 2018 by RumbleFox

[Babylon]

16 hours ago, AKCJ said:

It's not one step forward and two steps back. 

 

The problem is we’ve had a meteoric rise in terms of our ‘stature’ in English football over the last decade. We’re now at a spot where progressing to the next level is a massive, massive step.

 

Right now we’re a top 10 PL side. If you’d have told me that we’d be whinging about that 10 years ago when we were in League 1 (10 years ago this weekend Lloyd Dyer scored a last minute winner away at Huddersfield) I wouldn’t have believed you.

 

During those dark days under Levein, Kelly, Worthington, Allen, Megson and Holloway all we desperately wanted was to be back in the Premier League. Why is that not enough now?

 

We just need to keep it into perspective and realise that, despite the last freaky 10 years… some things take time! Lets keep finishing in the top 10-12 in the PL, keep developing these young players (who will be hit and miss), build these training facilities and put another tier on the East Stand and in 4/5 years’ time we’ll be seen as a very big club with some major pulling power and players will come to us as a club that’s got a proper chance of winning things regularly.

 

As much as some of the weirdos on here would hate to admit it, we need to follow Spurs’ example.
 

[RumbleFox]

16 hours ago, AKCJ said:

It's not one step forward and two steps back. 

 

The problem is we’ve had a meteoric rise in terms of our ‘stature’ in English football over the last decade. We’re now at a spot where progressing to the next level is a massive, massive step.

 

Right now we’re a top 10 PL side. If you’d have told me that we’d be whinging about that 10 years ago when we were in League 1 (10 years ago this weekend Lloyd Dyer scored a last minute winner away at Huddersfield) I wouldn’t have believed you.

 

During those dark days under Levein, Kelly, Worthington, Allen, Megson and Holloway all we desperately wanted was to be back in the Premier League. Why is that not enough now?

 

We just need to keep it into perspective and realise that, despite the last freaky 10 years… some things take time! Lets keep finishing in the top 10-12 in the PL, keep developing these young players (who will be hit and miss), build these training facilities and put another tier on the East Stand and in 4/5 years’ time we’ll be seen as a very big club with some major pulling power and players will come to us as a club that’s got a proper chance of winning things regularly.

 

As much as some of the weirdos on here would hate to admit it, we need to follow Spurs’ example.
 

Great post.

 

In terms of "one step forwards, two steps back" a more realistic phrase would be "Gradual, small steps forward with a few wobbles but maintaining an overall forward motion then one insane world record breaking triple jump forwards then a wobble and a fall and a continuation of small steps forwards.  The starting point is still way in the distance behind us and the general trend is forwards but we got a bit disorientated there for a minute after the miracle leap".  But, you know, it's not quite as catchy.  I'd need to work on it a bit to be honest.  X

[Ric Flair]

17 hours ago, Babylon said:

But I'd imagine we all think the same about most players when they get an early booking. Doesn't matter if it's Wilf, Maguire, Chilwell... any early booking and I'm thinking "they'll get a red", you can't go subbing players just because they get a yellow. Morgan's two reds have been two of the softest reds you are ever likely to see, I have some sympathy. But he also needs to take some blame as when on a yellow just don't put a foot in, just shield the player.

I’d have reluctantly accepted it, even given it was his 2nd red in 3 games if it wasn’t for the final warning he got for a very needless foul near the half way line that was going out for a throw anyway. It was brainless and regardless of how soft the actual 2nd yellow was it seemed inevitable it was coming. Ill discipline from our most experienced player and captain, he’s let himself down. He’s cost us a point or possibly 3 after a fairly solid season amongst a shit defence. I have very little sympathy or desire for him to come back in now, he should be punished. Let’s see what Evans or Soyuncu do.

[RumbleFox]

3 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

I’d have reluctantly accepted it, even given it was his 2nd red in 3 games if it wasn’t for the final warning he got for a very needless foul near the half way line that was going out for a throw anyway. It was brainless and regardless of how soft the actual 2nd yellow was it seemed inevitable it was coming. Ill discipline from our most experienced player and captain, he’s let himself down. He’s cost us a point or possibly 3 after a fairly solid season amongst a shit defence. I have very little sympathy or desire for him to come back in now, he should be punished. Let’s see what Evans or Soyuncu do.

Yeah, I do think this gives us the perfect "excuse" to phase him out.  It is sad to see a player decline, especially one who has done as much for us as Wes but the time is now I think.  We need to stick Evans in and give him at least 5 or six games.  X

[Ric Flair]

4 minutes ago, RumbleFox said:

Yeah, I do think this gives us the perfect "excuse" to phase him out.  It is sad to see a player decline, especially one who has done as much for us as Wes but the time is now I think.  We need to stick Evans in and give him at least 5 or six games.  X

I actually feel bad for wanting him out, as let’s have it right he’s our most successful captain ever and has been colossal. It’s just hard to stomach seeing him in there when there appears to be a queue of defenders we’ve signed not getting a chance. I said last week I thought he’d have a good season and end up with a new contract, and that still might happen but right now he needs to be left out. 

[RumbleFox]

5 minutes ago, Ric Flair said:

I actually feel bad for wanting him out, as let’s have it right he’s our most successful captain ever and has been colossal. It’s just hard to stomach seeing him in there when there appears to be a queue of defenders we’ve signed not getting a chance. I said last week I thought he’d have a good season and end up with a new contract, and that still might happen but right now he needs to be left out. 

Yeah I feel the same and it is worth stating again, - he is our greatest ever captain.  But yo are right, he needs to be replaced and I have no issue with people saying that as I agree with it.  I think because I am one of the those "Puel In, positive" types that people assume I cannot criticise the team/manager/players.  I have no issue at all with it I just react badly to those which go beyond constructive criticism and either personally insult players or manager or seem to have an ongoing, incessant agenda of negativity.  Let's hope this is the start of a new chapter and that big Wes can stay as a club player and maybe lead our cup team to success.  X

[Babylon]

1 hour ago, Ric Flair said:

I’d have reluctantly accepted it, even given it was his 2nd red in 3 games if it wasn’t for the final warning he got for a very needless foul near the half way line that was going out for a throw anyway. It was brainless and regardless of how soft the actual 2nd yellow was it seemed inevitable it was coming. Ill discipline from our most experienced player and captain, he’s let himself down. He’s cost us a point or possibly 3 after a fairly solid season amongst a shit defence. I have very little sympathy or desire for him to come back in now, he should be punished. Let’s see what Evans or Soyuncu do.

Indeed, I said it myself at the game. No matter how harsh it was, he made a mistake and it's time Evan's got his chance. Unless Evan's is a disaster, I'll be disappointed should Wes walk back in.

[NotTheMarketLeader]

On 07/10/2018 at 13:31, UniFox21 said:

It's the 2nd time we've lost at home, the first against a very good Liverpool team. How is it throwing points away?

 

Why should Puel sub our captain of 270+ appearances off after a booking, Wes has enough experience to know to avoid fouling. 

Some of you really do blame Puel for players mistakes 

I love this.

 

Puel has no responsibility for anything that goes / is wrong including player’s performances whom he himself selects ?

[NotTheMarketLeader]

12 hours ago, sacreblueits442 said:

.....numerous players have been pulled due to being on a yellow and looking in danger of being sent off. The big managers have pulled players just take a look at Clough and Ferguson. 

  It is common sense to pull a player when they have got themselves in a situation where they are being run by the game and they have become entrenched in playing the player and not running the game.

  There is an irrational argument being put forward as reasoning and it does not hold water.

Exactly....and the reason for that is that some people think Puel‘s performance in the last year is so fabulous that he can’t be criticised. We could never employ anyone that could do better, they would have us believe.

 

Quite why they operate under this premise, I know not why.

Edited 9 October 2018 by NotTheMarketLeader

[Babylon]

22 minutes ago, NotTheMarketLeader said:

I love this.

 

Puel has no responsibility for anything that goes / is wrong including player’s performances whom he himself selects ?

Well apparently he's not responsible for anything good that happens, so it should work both ways.

[Babylon]

11 minutes ago, NotTheMarketLeader said:

Exactly....and the reason for that is that some people think Puel‘s performance in the last year is so fabulous that he can’t be criticised. We could never employ anyone that could do better, they would have us believe.

 

Quite why they operate under this premise, I know not why.

Who are these people? Care to point them out, because all I see is a load of people willing to give him time because they can all see it's a work in progress and that with a very young team, there are going to be lots of ups and downs. I've not seen anyone not appreciating there are some issues.

 

What I see is a lot of people fighting back against over the top critisism of him. There is plenty of well rounded and fair critisism's on here that are accepted by most and they pass without comment more often than not.

Edited 9 October 2018 by Babylon

[murphy]

On 07/10/2018 at 08:18, Fox92 said:

It is as good as ours. I don't know why people don't see/acknowledge this. Is it because they're not a "big club" ?

I'm surprised you think that Bournemouth's squad is as good as ours.  They have a lot of English players yet no England internationals, we've got four plus one retired.  If you had to make a team from our combined squads, I would expect more Leicester players than Bournemouth.  Perhaps they are just better than the sum of their parts and we are not.

 

Going back to the OP, I would look at it a different way.  I would say two steps forward and one step back.  I think we are progressing.

[AKCJ]

2 hours ago, Babylon said:

You're welcome.

[UniFox21]

34 minutes ago, NotTheMarketLeader said:

I love this.

 

Puel has no responsibility for anything that goes / is wrong including player’s performances whom he himself selects ?

Well he doesn't get credit for when things go right

 

Don't be a moron. Puel has responsibility for how we play and what side he picks and you know that. It's the ridiculous things he gets blamed for which are out of his control, some people on here swarm him for the slightest mistake.

[RumbleFox]

35 minutes ago, NotTheMarketLeader said:

Exactly....and the reason for that is that some people think Puel‘s performance in the last year is so fabulous that he can’t be criticised. We could never employ anyone that could do better, they would have us believe.

 

Quite why they operate under this premise, I know not why.

You sound like a conspiracy theorist?  No one is against you, there is no agenda.  People just see things differently.  I like Puel, I want him to stay but I am happy to listen to valid, constructive criticism.  The problem is that often the criticism is not valid nor constructive.  The downside is that sometimes this means that well meaning criticism can be lost amongst the bile and if I have ever done this I am sorry and I regret it but just as the "Puel In" folk need to make sure they listen and respond correctly then so do the "Puel out" folk.  Those folk are equally as guilty of not quite listening or equating any defence of the team or manager with being OTT positive.  I can say Puel made and error, I can admit he should have taken Wes off but what I do find unfair is to then extrapolate that to the nth degree and say he should be sacked.  Nor do I think it is a reason to be personally insulting to Puel (or Wes) which many on here have been.  X

Edited 9 October 2018 by RumbleFox

[leicesterlad1989]

44 minutes ago, NotTheMarketLeader said:

Exactly....and the reason for that is that some people think Puel‘s performance in the last year is so fabulous that he can’t be criticised. We could never employ anyone that could do better, they would have us believe.

 

Quite why they operate under this premise, I know not why.

If what you say it true, which I highly doubt, what makes you think that your over the top response is any better?

 

Maybe people are balanced with their opinions and are willing to give the manager a chance rather than chop and change every year. Maybe people believe that a club captain, on a final warning, should be mature enough to not get himself sent off rather than blaming the manager for not substituting him.

 

Just out of interest, who do you think could do a better job?

[lgfualol]

Surprised Puel didn't get the blame for Vardy's mental tackle and red against Wolves.

 

"bloody Puel, should have subbed Vardy as he was frustrated"

Edited 9 October 2018 by lgfualol

[UniFox21]

1 minute ago, lgfualol said:

Surprised Puel didn't get the blame for Vardy's mental tackle and red against Wolves.

 

"bloody Puel, should have subbed Vardy as he was frustrated"

Could clearly see the anger in his face a few minutes before that tackle was made. Pathetic to not sub him

[NotTheMarketLeader]

1 hour ago, leicesterlad1989 said:

If what you say it true, which I highly doubt, what makes you think that your over the top response is any better?

 

Maybe people are balanced with their opinions and are willing to give the manager a chance rather than chop and change every year. Maybe people believe that a club captain, on a final warning, should be mature enough to not get himself sent off rather than blaming the manager for not substituting him.

 

Just out of interest, who do you think could do a better job?

My post is not particularly in relation to the the Wes situation in terms of the sending off - which  is going over the top - more to balance that which says Puel has no responsibility for players which he selects once they are on the pitch.

 

That view is nonsensical, he has total control over the team, is responsible for their behaviour and team results.

 

There is far more to criticise than not subbing Wes; why are we in the position of playing him in a role he is unsuited to when the manager has had two transfer windows would be one for starters. 

[NotTheMarketLeader]

2 hours ago, RumbleFox said:

You sound like a conspiracy theorist?  No one is against you, there is no agenda.  People just see things differently.  I like Puel, I want him to stay but I am happy to listen to valid, constructive criticism.  The problem is that often the criticism is not valid nor constructive.  The downside is that sometimes this means that well meaning criticism can be lost amongst the bile and if I have ever done this I am sorry and I regret it but just as the "Puel In" folk need to make sure they listen and respond correctly then so do the "Puel out" folk.  Those folk are equally as guilty of not quite listening or equating any defence of the team or manager with being OTT positive.  I can say Puel made and error, I can admit he should have taken Wes off but what I do find unfair is to then extrapolate that to the nth degree and say he should be sacked.  Nor do I think it is a reason to be personally insulting to Puel (or Wes) which many on here have been.  X

Conspiracy theorist? 

 

Im making the point that any criticism of CP is shot down in flames and those with views who don’t rate him seem to be treated as heritics ?.

 

Also pease see my reply to Leicesterlad

Edited 9 October 2018 by NotTheMarketLeader