20 more men of mainly Pakistani Muslim background found guilty of grooming, raping and abusing kids.

[sm1]

31 minutes ago, Dr The Singh said:

It's already happened in Leicester but just not widely reported infact it lead to people taking matters intonthere own hands as the police and authorities were seen to be very slow to react.  Alternative media sources have massively reported it.

I know it's happened in Leicester and probably still is. The media doesn't want to touch the subject because it's undeniable, that the vast majority of this type of crime is being committed by Pakistani & Bangladeshi Muslim men.  I think the local case you're referring to is the young Sikh girl who was being abused on top of a Bangladeshi restaurant. The police were seen to be dragging their feet, so some Sikh men took matters into their own hands.  

[Guest MattP]

11 hours ago, sm1 said:

I know it's happened in Leicester and probably still is. The media doesn't want to touch the subject because it's undeniable, that the vast majority of this type of crime is being committed by Pakistani & Bangladeshi Muslim men.  I think the local case you're referring to is the young Sikh girl who was being abused on top of a Bangladeshi restaurant. The police were seen to be dragging their feet, so some Sikh men took matters into their own hands.  

According to the guys I knew at the time the police were barely even interested in it, something I can certainly believe now in hindsight even though I was sceptical at the time.

It's a shame people have to take the law into their own hands but on this occasion it was fully justified.

[ozleicester]

Why would we have such a biased thread title, its only intent is to inflame.

[Voll Blau]

1 hour ago, ozleicester said:

Why would we have such a biased thread title, its only intent is to inflame.

You should have seen it before it was edited. It is factually accurate mind.

[Dr The Singh]

2 hours ago, ozleicester said:

Why would we have such a biased thread title, its only intent is to inflame.

Saying that Oz, if it was mainly Sikh men, and as stats stated by many outlets that 90% groomers come from Islamic backgrounds, and 80% are Pakistani, were Sikh, I don't think I would be anyway in being inflamed.

 

Infact the gang leader in this case is a Sikh that converted to islam, so that say something.  And all Sikh outlets, organisations are questioning how this has happened.

 

BTW, he reverted back when he ended up in our courts, why, who knows.

 

 

[purpleronnie]

On ‎23‎/‎10‎/‎2018 at 22:59, sm1 said:

I know it's happened in Leicester and probably still is. The media doesn't want to touch the subject because it's undeniable, that the vast majority of this type of crime is being committed by Pakistani & Bangladeshi Muslim men.  I think the local case you're referring to is the young Sikh girl who was being abused on top of a Bangladeshi restaurant. The police were seen to be dragging their feet, so some Sikh men took matters into their own hands.  

There is a disproportionate percentage of Pakistani men in the gangs which is disgusting, but lets not forget the vast majority of sexual assaults are carried out by white men.  And paedophile rings are almost entirely white males.

 

I understand people may put this down to lack of policing the ethnic groups when it comes to these crimes but you would then have to leap to hearsay and speculation on what the 'real' percentages are.  There has also been reports that mention unconscious bias” in child protection agencies - which actually could be bias against ethnic groups and you also have to look at demographics of local areas to see whether it truly is disproportionate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited 25 October 2018 by purpleronnie

[Dr The Singh]

1 minute ago, purpleronnie said:

There is a disproportionate percentage of Pakistani men in the gangs which is disgusting, but lets not forget the vast majority of sexual assaults are carried out by white me.  And paedophile rings are almost entirely white males.

 

I understand people may put this down to lack of policing the ethnic groups when it comes to these crimes but you would then have to leap to hearsay and speculation on what the 'real' percentages are.  There has also been reports that mention unconscious bias” in child protection agencies - which actually could be bias against ethnic groups and you also have to look at demographics of local areas to see whether it truly is disproportionate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Weve got to compare apes with apples, grooming is a disrinct method, which is predominantly practiced from the Islamic.

 

This method is far different from majority abuse which is actually abuse by a family or trusted member.  Or the trusted care method by the churches.

[purpleronnie]

1 minute ago, Dr The Singh said:

Weve got to compare apes with apples, grooming is a disrinct method, which is predominantly practiced from the Islamic.

 

This method is far different from majority abuse which is actually abuse by a family or trusted member.  Or the trusted care method by the churches.

I understand the differences, I just don't really understand the differences in reactions by the public.

 

It's all heinous.

[Dr The Singh]

Just now, purpleronnie said:

I understand the differences, I just don't really understand the differences in reactions by the public.

 

It's all heinous.

The reactions are because of the impacts, this type of gang mentality causes for more harm to those children.  My Mrs works for notts mental health service in the children's sector, this type of abuse in children are causing more sections then any other.

[Guest MattP]

4 minutes ago, purpleronnie said:

I understand the differences, I just don't really understand the differences in reactions by the public.

Seriously? 

 

These things were allowed to happen over decades because councils were scared about upsetting communities - the girls were effectively sacrificed on the altar of political correctness. You had fathers telling the police it was happening and they themselves being threatened with arrest.

 

I'm surprised we didn't have some serious civil disobedience over it once the information came out.

[purpleronnie]

4 minutes ago, Dr The Singh said:

The reactions are because of the impacts, this type of gang mentality causes for more harm to those children.  My Mrs works for notts mental health service in the children's sector, this type of abuse in children are causing more sections then any other.

Do you think that's why the public are reacting like they are though?  How many would know this type of abuse causes more harm than any other sexual abuse?

[purpleronnie]

Just now, MattP said:

Seriously? 

 

These things were allowed to happen over decades because councils were scared about upsetting communities - the girls were effectively sacrificed on the altar of political correctness. You had fathers telling the police it was happening and they themselves being threatened with arrest.

 

I'm surprised we didn't have some serious civil disobedience over it once the information came out.

It's not the reactions towards the police that I don't understand that's a given.

[Guest MattP]

Just now, purpleronnie said:

It's not the reactions towards the police that I don't understand that's a given.

But you don't understand the reaction towards the men who did the kidnapping, drugging, beating, trafficking raping and then launched an organisational campaign against the families of the victims of mass intimidation to threaten them into making sure no one knew about it? In addition to that the victims were also targeted because of their race. 

 

The only comparison with this sort of thing where the authorities also were compliant was the Catholic Church and the BBC and people were just as angry at those. 

[purpleronnie]

Just now, MattP said:

But you don't understand the reaction towards the men who did the kidnapping, drugging, beating, trafficking raping and then launched an organisational campaign against the families of the victims of mass intimidation to threaten them into making sure no one knew about it? In addition to that the victims were also targeted because of their race. 

 

The only comparison with this sort of thing where the authorities also were compliant was the Catholic Church and the BBC and people were just as angry at those. 

No I understand the outrage, its completely horrendous, my question was relating to the outrage of this abuse over other abuse's like other large paedophile gangs that have been arrested in the past without such a huge reaction. 

 

Maybe the added tragedy of police failures adds to the reactions.

 

 

 

[Guest MattP]

2 minutes ago, purpleronnie said:

No I understand the outrage, its completely horrendous, my question was relating to the outrage of this abuse over other abuse's like other large paedophile gangs that have been arrested in the past without such a huge reaction. 

 

Maybe the added tragedy of police failures adds to the reactions.

It certainly does, it was entirely preventable and the class issue is also another factor. This would never have been allowed to happen to middle class kids in Westminster.

 

The race element will also play a part, would white men have got away with grooming Muslim children over decades because the authorities feared community relations being upset? We both know the answer to that.

 

The real tragedy is this is still going on.

[Alf Bentley]

29 minutes ago, purpleronnie said:

There is a disproportionate percentage of Pakistani men in the gangs which is disgusting, but lets not forget the vast majority of sexual assaults are carried out by white me.  And paedophile rings are almost entirely white males.

 

 

Turn yourself in, paedo! 

 

25 minutes ago, Dr The Singh said:

Weve got to compare apes with apples, grooming is a disrinct method, which is predominantly practiced from the Islamic.

 

 

Speciesist! 

[Dr The Singh]

52 minutes ago, purpleronnie said:

Do you think that's why the public are reacting like they are though?  How many would know this type of abuse causes more harm than any other sexual abuse?

Your first part, I have theories but just that.

 

Your second sentence is proven by the info ive give you.

[Dr The Singh]

36 minutes ago, Alf Bentley said:

 

Turn yourself in, paedo! 

 

 

Speciesist! 

I saw the film species and I had nothing against her and would nominate myself as a host....all lies

[purpleronnie]

1 minute ago, Dr The Singh said:

Your first part, I have theories but just that.

 

Your second sentence is proven by the info ive give you.

I know you stated that's the case but the second part isn't proven because your partner knows, how would the general public know?

[Dr The Singh]

12 minutes ago, purpleronnie said:

I know you stated that's the case but the second part isn't proven because your partner knows, how would the general public know?

To be clear, in notts NHS mental service, out of all of the paedo cases that have been sectioned (I hope u understand) grooming cases outway all of em.  That is a fact, considering the paedo cases are mostly family or trusted members, this shows that grooming g causes more harm then most

Edited 25 October 2018 by Dr The Singh

[sm1]

18 hours ago, purpleronnie said:

There is a disproportionate percentage of Pakistani men in the gangs which is disgusting, but lets not forget the vast majority of sexual assaults are carried out by white men.  And paedophile rings are almost entirely white males.

 

I understand people may put this down to lack of policing the ethnic groups when it comes to these crimes but you would then have to leap to hearsay and speculation on what the 'real' percentages are.  There has also been reports that mention unconscious bias” in child protection agencies - which actually could be bias against ethnic groups and you also have to look at demographics of local areas to see whether it truly is disproportionate.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I'm afraid this is totally rubbish, although the girls groomed and raped have almost exclusively been white. The number of people arrested and charged for street grooming in Rotherham, Rochdale, Derby, London, Stoke, Newcastle, Birmingham, Oxford are in the many 100s, and this is only the last couple of years. The abusers before this have never been charged. On top of this, these are just the ring leaders or major players, the smaller participants are never charged. The true numbers are astonishing, in the many 1000s. Plus these are just the cities where the gangs have been identified, cities like Leicester where this problem exists aren't even publicised. I know from having working within various youth services, years ago, that the specific crime of street grooming which revolved around taxi drivers and fast food outlets, existed for decades. Now if the police wanted to get to the bottom of this, they could have done and stopped the abuse. They did nothing because of 2 reasons, one the girls were very young and seen as unreliable, and the other was the ethnicity of the perpertrators. The Rotherham case highlighted not only the inadequacity of the police, but also that Pakistani councillors activily tried to hide and obstruct the true identity of the rapists. If we want to stop this abuse, first thing we need to do is admit there is a problem instead of blaming police or child services as having a "bias against ethnic groups". This is the precise reason why nothing was done for so long, rapists hiding behind their colour and community and blaming the authorites for being bias and racist. Thankfully the muslim community is taking this crime seriousley and people like Julie Siddiqi and imams like Alyas Karmani, along with organistaions like ISB and TAG, are tackling the issue head on. 

[Dr The Singh]

21 minutes ago, sm1 said:

I'm afraid this is totally rubbish, although the girls groomed and raped have almost exclusively been white. The number of people arrested and charged for street grooming in Rotherham, Rochdale, Derby, London, Stoke, Newcastle, Birmingham, Oxford are in the many 100s, and this is only the last couple of years. The abusers before this have never been charged. On top of this, these are just the ring leaders or major players, the smaller participants are never charged. The true numbers are astonishing, in the many 1000s. Plus these are just the cities where the gangs have been identified, cities like Leicester where this problem exists aren't even publicised. I know from having working within various youth services, years ago, that the specific crime of street grooming which revolved around taxi drivers and fast food outlets, existed for decades. Now if the police wanted to get to the bottom of this, they could have done and stopped the abuse. They did nothing because of 2 reasons, one the girls were very young and seen as unreliable, and the other was the ethnicity of the perpertrators. The Rotherham case highlighted not only the inadequacity of the police, but also that Pakistani councillors activily tried to hide and obstruct the true identity of the rapists. If we want to stop this abuse, first thing we need to do is admit there is a problem instead of blaming police or child services as having a "bias against ethnic groups". This is the precise reason why nothing was done for so long, rapists hiding behind their colour and community and blaming the authorites for being bias and racist. Thankfully the muslim community is taking this crime seriousley and people like Julie Siddiqi and imams like Alyas Karmani, along with organistaions like ISB and TAG, are tackling the issue head on. 

Absolutely true, the SAS ( Sikh Awareness Society) are dealing with 200 cases of mainly Sikh, few Hindus and white girls that are being groomed.

 

The Sikh Channel are also actively involved in exposing groomers under the guise of being Sikh girls.

[purpleronnie]

4 hours ago, sm1 said:

I'm afraid this is totally rubbish, although the girls groomed and raped have almost exclusively been white. The number of people arrested and charged for street grooming in Rotherham, Rochdale, Derby, London, Stoke, Newcastle, Birmingham, Oxford are in the many 100s, and this is only the last couple of years. The abusers before this have never been charged. On top of this, these are just the ring leaders or major players, the smaller participants are never charged. The true numbers are astonishing, in the many 1000s. Plus these are just the cities where the gangs have been identified, cities like Leicester where this problem exists aren't even publicised. I know from having working within various youth services, years ago, that the specific crime of street grooming which revolved around taxi drivers and fast food outlets, existed for decades. Now if the police wanted to get to the bottom of this, they could have done and stopped the abuse. They did nothing because of 2 reasons, one the girls were very young and seen as unreliable, and the other was the ethnicity of the perpertrators. The Rotherham case highlighted not only the inadequacity of the police, but also that Pakistani councillors activily tried to hide and obstruct the true identity of the rapists. If we want to stop this abuse, first thing we need to do is admit there is a problem instead of blaming police or child services as having a "bias against ethnic groups". This is the precise reason why nothing was done for so long, rapists hiding behind their colour and community and blaming the authorites for being bias and racist. Thankfully the muslim community is taking this crime seriousley and people like Julie Siddiqi and imams like Alyas Karmani, along with organistaions like ISB and TAG, are tackling the issue head on. 

I'm only going by the published reports most of them are 4-5 years old, not easy to find more recent stat's, but they show paedophile rings were almost (and some entirely) white.

 

There are differences in grooming gangs and paedophile rings.

Edited 26 October 2018 by purpleronnie

[sm1]

Grooming gangs are paedophile rings too. It's just that they don't hide behind a computer screen or social media. These gangs are a blatant, coordinated ring of 100s if not 1000s of men,  who abuse and then pass girls on to other paedophiles, sometimes even transporting them to other cities. The details are truly sickening. I'm glad Dr the Singh that some channels are highlighting this. What I would say is that the methods to identify and prosecute have changed markedly and the days of these gangs doing as they please,  are hopefully over. 

[Buce]

47 minutes ago, sm1 said:

Grooming gangs are paedophile rings too. It's just that they don't hide behind a computer screen or social media. These gangs are a blatant, coordinated ring of 100s if not 1000s of men,  who abuse and then pass girls on to other paedophiles, sometimes even transporting them to other cities. The details are truly sickening. I'm glad Dr the Singh that some channels are highlighting this. What I would say is that the methods to identify and prosecute have changed markedly and the days of these gangs doing as they please,  are hopefully over. 

 

It might seem like a trivial point, but Ronnie is correct - these so-called grooming gangs are not paedophiles (some of them may be incidentally, of course, but this particular offending doesn't fit that description). Paedophilia is a specific attraction to pre-pubescent children, not just any child beneath the age of consent. If the age of consent is to be used as the yardstick, anybody attracted to a seventeen-year-old would be a paedophile in several US states. The age of consent is an arbitrary definition of a child, not a universal one and, in fact, the UK age of consent is set relatively high, even by European standards - 14 in Portugal, Italy [13 if the age difference is less than 3 years], Germany, Switzerland, Austria and many others, 15 in most of the rest.

I'm not trying to excuse or trivialise the offence, but this type of offending is not the same as paedophile rings which (whether you like it or not) largely consist of white males.

Edited 26 October 2018 by Buce