Freedom Speech

[Ky Le Don]

With more and more videos and posts being removed on a daily basis on media platforms I ask what are your opinions on free speech? Does this exist?

Some content doesn't fit into the main stream view but should we not be able to dissect information ourselves and come to our own conclusions?

or should we just be told what we should hear? I hope this post doesn't break any rules.

 

Hope all are well...  <3

 

 

[Ky Le Don]

Freedom of Speech*

[Innovindil]

2 minutes ago, Ky Le Don said:

should we not be able to dissect information ourselves and come to our own conclusions?

For the most part, yes. But we've seen in the last few years there is a large segment of people willing to dive headfirst into absolute nonsense like anti-vax bullshit. Either we go all out to protect people from their own stupidity, or we go full who gives a crap and let them Darwin themselves from existence. Trouble is we can't guarantee the only people they'd hurt would be themselves. Imo, too much effort has gone into ridding large parts if not all of the world from some horrible illnesses to let it be unraveled by an idiotic few.

[Webbo]

7 minutes ago, Innovindil said:

For the most part, yes. But we've seen in the last few years there is a large segment of people willing to dive headfirst into absolute nonsense like anti-vax bullshit. Either we go all out to protect people from their own stupidity, or we go full who gives a crap and let them Darwin themselves from existence. Trouble is we can't guarantee the only people they'd hurt would be themselves. Imo, too much effort has gone into ridding large parts if not all of the world from some horrible illnesses to let it be unraveled by an idiotic few.

If you stop people posting anti vax stuff stuff it doesn't stop them from thinking it. We can all make up our own minds, who gets to decide what's right and what's wrong?

[Collymore]

[Innovindil]

1 minute ago, Webbo said:

If you stop people posting anti vax stuff stuff it doesn't stop them from thinking it. We can all make up our own minds, who gets to decide what's right and what's wrong?

It stops them spreading it, which is the point. The people in charge get to decide what's right and wrong, as it's always been. 

 

Take a glance at all the shite going round social media on the kung flu, it puts potentially hundreds of thousands of people at risk, "we can all make up our own minds" is fine for the most part, but not when making up your own mind can kill someone else.

[Voll Blau]

5 minutes ago, Webbo said:

If you stop people posting anti vax stuff stuff it doesn't stop them from thinking it. We can all make up our own minds, who gets to decide what's right and what's wrong?

Well it does stop said cretins from spreading their empirically disprovable bollocks to others though.

 

People have the right to decide for themselves whether they want to believe some mental, and potentially fatal, theories. But you're being naive if you think there's no harm in letting people spread that kind of shit.

[Webbo]

1 minute ago, Voll Blau said:

Well it does stop said cretins from spreading their empirically disprovable bollocks to others though.

 

People have the right to decide for themselves whether they want to believe some mental, and potentially fatal, theories. But you're being naive if you think there's no harm in letting people spread that kind of shit.

Well I'm open minded. I'm happy to listen to what people have to say and decide for myself. I'm not anti vax btw.

[Webbo]

8 minutes ago, Innovindil said:

It stops them spreading it, which is the point. The people in charge get to decide what's right and wrong, as it's always been. 

 

Take a glance at all the shite going round social media on the kung flu, it puts potentially hundreds of thousands of people at risk, "we can all make up our own minds" is fine for the most part, but not when making up your own mind can kill someone else.

You don't think banning someone from saying something makes people suspicious?

[Innovindil]

Just now, Webbo said:

Well I'm open minded. I'm happy to listen to what people have to say and decide for myself. I'm not anti vax btw.

Yes, but not everyone else has the brain cells to separate harmless conspiracy theories with potentially dangerous ones. No one wants people to be banned from talking about aliens and shite like that, but people should absolutely be shielded from things like anti-vax. 

[Innovindil]

Just now, Webbo said:

You don't think banning someone from saying something makes people suspicious?

Not if they are told/shown why it is banned, I'd hope.

[LiberalFox]

Freedom of speech to me means you aren't restricted by the threat of state imprisonment or sanction for expressing your opinions.

 

It doesn't mean youtube or facebook or wherever is legally bound to allow whatever content you upload to be hosted on their site. 

 

What people are actually debating isn't freedom of speech in the classic sense, but that entities like youtube or facebook effectively become gatekeepers of what is socially acceptable.

 

Of course 20 years or so ago, ordinary members of society had far fewer available means to publish opinions to a wide audience, so I'd argue that even for those with "extreme" views

 

it has never been easier to share your opinions with others. 

 

 

[Webbo]

1 minute ago, Innovindil said:

Not if they are told/shown why it is banned, I'd hope.

We'll decide what's good for you?

 

Trust people, it's democracy.

[Voll Blau]

4 minutes ago, Webbo said:

Well I'm open minded. I'm happy to listen to what people have to say and decide for myself. I'm not anti vax btw.

Sound. Get cracking on the wacko Holocaust denials or whatever then lads. We're open minded on Foxestalk...

[st albans fox]

A lot of people need protecting from themselves ..........

 

and social media has made it way too easy for this section of society to be affected ......

 

it’s possibly the biggest threat to our way of life over the next twenty years ......

[Webbo]

1 minute ago, Voll Blau said:

Sound. Get cracking on the wacko Holocaust denials or whatever then lads. We're open minded on Foxestalk...

You've heard these holocaust deniers, you've not been convinced.

[Innovindil]

4 minutes ago, Webbo said:

We'll decide what's good for you?

 

Trust people, it's democracy.

They already do. See shite like national action and other nazi groups banned. Do you think the nonsense they spew should still be allowed on social media? Hell, do you think people are suspicious of why they are banned? 

 

Course not, because they are dangerous.

[StanSP]

Freedom of speech is fine, to an extent. 

 

Just don't be afraid to face the consequences when you say something that either hits too close to the bone, offends someone in a serious way, or that it becomes something like hate speech. 

 

Anyone has the freedom to 'say' what you want. But you have to be ready to face the aftermath of it all. And if that results in a ban on here or something like FB/Twitter, then so be it...

[Webbo]

1 minute ago, Innovindil said:

They already do. See shite like national action and other nazi groups banned. Do you think the nonsense they spew should still be allowed on social media? Hell, do you think people of suspicious of why they are banned? 

 

Course not, because they are dangerous.

I see extreme right and extreme left groups and I think , like 99% of the population, that they're twats. As long as you're not inciting violence. 

 

If you don't believe that people should be able to say things you hate, you don't believe in freedom of speech.

[VLC86]

If you use freedom of speech to spout some vile homophobic/racist or otherwise offensive crap then in all fairness you’re a willy puller.

 

I remember them sort of defences for that Aussie rugby player and it was pretty disgusting in all fairness.

[Innovindil]

Just now, Webbo said:

I see extreme right and extreme left groups and I think , like 99% of the population, that they're twats. As long as you're not inciting violence. 

 

If you don't believe that people should be able to say things you hate, you don't believe in freedom of speech.

I do believe people should be able to say things I hate. Hell, people on here say things I hate almost every day. I do believe, they shouldn't be able to say things that can KILL. 

 

Not a subtle difference.

[Strokes]

29 minutes ago, Webbo said:

If you stop people posting anti vax stuff stuff it doesn't stop them from thinking it. We can all make up our own minds, who gets to decide what's right and what's wrong?

I’d quite like that job 

[Webbo]

4 minutes ago, StanSP said:

Freedom of speech is fine, to an extent. 

 

Just don't be afraid to face the consequences when you say something that either hits too close to the bone, offends someone in a serious way, or that it becomes something like hate speech. 

 

Anyone has the freedom to 'say' what you want. But you have to be ready to face the aftermath of it all. And if that results in a ban on here or something like FB/Twitter, then so be it...

Just to add I'm not talking about privately owned forums like this one. The owner has the right to delete/ban people on his forum.

[bovril]

I was going to post something along the lines of what Liberal Fox has posted above that what some people class as freedom of speech now is something which has only existed for the last 20 years, the ability to publish whatever they want online. I guess the issue with the net is that it's seen as public space in a way that a pub or newspaper - who can choose who to let in or what to publish - aren't. 

[Strokes]

2 minutes ago, bovril said:

I was going to post something along the lines of what Liberal Fox has posted above that what some people class as freedom of speech now is something which has only existed for the last 20 years, the ability to publish whatever they want online. I guess the issue with the net is that it's seen as public space in a way that a pub or newspaper - who can choose who to let in or what to publish - aren't. 

People used to preach in public places, it’s nothing new. It’s just we can see their full blown conversations now. Keep em where we can see them, I say.