Ruud van Nistelrooy - New Manager - Official

[SafewayFox]

57 minutes ago, Guesty said:

If anything history looks more favourably on Cooper than this guy. Yes he questioned standards - but in the end, all he really did, was yap and yap - whilst fixing nothing on the pitch.

 

If it wasn't for Cooper we would probably have gone down as the worst ever team in the history of the Premier League. 

Please can this odd revisionism of Cooper stop.

 

Cooper was the manager that signed off on Ayew, Skipp and to a lesser extent Reid.

 

Like JJ and Abdul bailed out Marti earlier in the season, Mads did exactly the same for Cooper.

 

That loss against Chelsea was one of the most turgid performances that I can remember, genuinely pitiful.

[tinpot_fox]

5 minutes ago, SafewayFox said:

Please can this odd revisionism of Cooper stop.

 

Cooper was the manager that signed off on Ayew, Skipp and to a lesser extent Reid.

 

Like JJ and Abdul bailed out Marti earlier in the season, Mads did exactly the same for Cooper.

 

That loss against Chelsea was one of the most turgid performances that I can remember, genuinely pitiful.

What revisionism? I’ve always held the belief that yes, the signing may not have been good, the formations may have encouraged turgid football, but I always felt like we were more likely to nick a goal and get something out of the game (which we probably didn’t deserve from a neutrals perspective) during Coopers tenure. In my opinion The team under Van Nistelrooy just didn’t seem to have that.

[Mike the Metal Ed]

8 minutes ago, tinpot_fox said:

What revisionism? I’ve always held the belief that yes, the signing may not have been good, the formations may have encouraged turgid football, but I always felt like we were more likely to nick a goal and get something out of the game (which we probably didn’t deserve from a neutrals perspective) during Coopers tenure. In my opinion The team under Van Nistelrooy just didn’t seem to have that.

Because the fact we've hired nothing but dross since doesn't vindicate him. His summer transfer window has potentially hobbled the club for years 

[Guesty]

1 minute ago, SafewayFox said:

Please can this odd revisionism of Cooper stop.

 

Cooper was the manager that signed off on Ayew, Skipp and to a lesser extent Reid.

 

Like JJ and Abdul bailed out Marti earlier in the season, Mads did exactly the same for Cooper.

 

That loss against Chelsea was one of the most turgid performances that I can remember, genuinely pitiful.

I never said Cooper was great, but he was better than RvN. Mad's performances did bail him out somewhat. But look at his results compared to RvN's. It's not revisionism, it's reality.

 

The only thing people really hammer him for now is transfers. It seems out of our last few managers - he was the only one who controlled our transfers. None of our other managers get blamed for transfers - we blame Rudkin. But for Cooper we make an exception.

 

He probably just said we need experience. Which was correct. Then all Rudkin could find/offer him was that bunch of s**t. 

[JimJams]

Cooper was total dogshit. Set up to hold onto a 0-0 every game and when we inevitably conceded his gameplan went out the window and it was a free for all to see if we could score next which we generally didn't. Most gutless fxxking football you'll ever watch.

[Claridge]

20 minutes ago, SafewayFox said:

Please can this odd revisionism of Cooper stop.

 

Cooper was the manager that signed off on Ayew, Skipp and to a lesser extent Reid.

 

Like JJ and Abdul bailed out Marti earlier in the season, Mads did exactly the same for Cooper.

 

That loss against Chelsea was one of the most turgid performances that I can remember, genuinely pitiful.

He wasn't very good, but miles above anything we have had since, players are meant to do well and save a manager aren't they?

[Nobbyburton]

Does it genuinely make people feel better to suggest any of these previous managers  were any different? 

 

They're all different shades of shit. Absolutely nothing about any manager we’ve had since Enzo. None of them could motivate, change games, stop stupid mistakes, play attractive or winning football. 
 

I’d put Cooper to the very bottom of the list, purely for his transfers. The only one that had a tiny bit of money to spend and he does that. 

Edited 12 April by Nobbyburton

[CPepFox]

8 minutes ago, Guesty said:

The only thing people really hammer him for now is transfers. It seems out of our last few managers - he was the only one who controlled our transfers. None of our other managers get blamed for transfers - we blame Rudkin. But for Cooper we make an exception.

If I remember correctly, he was the last manager who we purchased players for and given lengthy contracts. Ayew, DeCordova Ried, Skipp who has worked out but not for the price tag we put on... 

 

Don't think we even brought in a player under RVN transfer window opportunity 

[Spanner73]

Still blaming all the previous managers that all worked under Aiyawatt !! 
 

Some of our fans are as thick as …. 
 

[Kitchandro]

1 minute ago, Spanner73 said:

Still blaming all the previous managers that were hired by Aiyawatt !! 
 

Some of our fans are as thick as …. 
 

Fixed it for you. Does that wording make you feel more comfortable admitting they were all terrible?

[Guesty]

Just now, CPepFox said:

If I remember correctly, he was the last manager who we purchased players for and given lengthy contracts. Ayew, DeCordova Ried, Skipp who has worked out but not for the price tag we put on... 

 

Don't think we even brought in a player under RVN transfer window opportunity 

I think we signed Coulibaly under RvN. Which just showed the problem was always above the manager. 

 

It's not like Cooper even started Skipp and Ayew every game. He probably started them 50% or less of the games he managed. So he can't have been that keen on them. I put all our transfer problems squarely at the feet of Rudkin - and none of our managers since Rodgers. 

[inckley fox]

There are two things that strike me now about Cooper and Ruud, when you place them in the context of the overall club management in the 2020s.

 

The first, as some have pointed out, is that recruitment has been consistently poor over that time under everyone, but that the main criticism of Cooper seems to be, specifically, his recruitment. While he most certainly did push for experience, and most certainly welcomed the signings of Reid and Ayew (and therefore deserves a share of the blame), I still think it's hard to say that he was wholly responsible for the poor 2024 recruitment, above all because it was exceptionally poor for many years before that and continued to be poor after that.

 

The second is that manager after manager seems to have been brought in to steady the ship and give a second chance to supposedly top drawer players who have fallen foul of the previous incumbent. We've seen that again and again, with the return of Soyuncu and Soumare under Smith, then Faes and Vestergard under Maresca, then Winks and co. under Ruud, Cifuentes and Rowett. Most of those managers have realised in time that the mandate they were brought in on (i.e. to take advantage of the squad's technically most gifted players, irrespective of their track record) was flawed, and that they should have learned their predecessors' lessons more quickly, but only Ruud went so far in his criticism of the culture and standards at the club. That he was right to do so is surely beyond question.

 

Another matter entirely is whether either of these managers were right for the club. And then there's the question as to whether you can mount a meaningful defence of what they did in charge. On both counts, it's a clear no.

 

For balance, I disagreed wholeheartedly that we were too good for Cooper. He was a good boss for Forest, among others, and it was no surprise to see him get another chance with a lower end PL club. The references to his looks and his links to Forest were totally irrelevant, much like the dodgy pre-season form, and I thought he came into an extremely tough set of circumstances with us: a side out of form for months, in need of a major tweak in playing style which the players were unlikely to embrace, with limited funds, and with a pending points deduction. Results were better than expected even if performances weren't, and many fans wanted him out because they thought that we should be a top-half side with the players we had. Most objective football fans thought we were deluded when we fired him and, given what happened next, you'll struggle to formulate much of an argument to the contrary.

 

In spite of all that, I'll try. I think he was the wrong appointment. We were too unimaginative in appointing him, too safe, too keen to opt for PL experience, too reluctant to allow a manager with ambition to get a grip on the club. The players were never going to buy into him and he was never going to have the mandate to put them in their place.

 

Like Ruud, and others thereafter, Cooper's appointment was a predictable symptom of an underlying chronic disorder. Of course he was the wrong man, because he was employed by the wrong people for the wrong reasons. And probably fired for the wrong reasons too. Ruud was appointed for his aura, by a man who knows less about our performances than your average fan. Cifuentes was willing to pay to come to us, had Barca links, and had a few nice videos about his clever football on Youtube.

 

But it doesn't mean that these 'wrong' appointments like Cooper and Ruud didn't occasionally get something right, or learn a lesson that their successors would have benefited from heeding. Nor, by the way, does it mean that they were among the main reasons for our decline.

[SafewayFox]

1 hour ago, Guesty said:

I never said Cooper was great, but he was better than RvN. Mad's performances did bail him out somewhat. But look at his results compared to RvN's. It's not revisionism, it's reality.

 

The only thing people really hammer him for now is transfers. It seems out of our last few managers - he was the only one who controlled our transfers. None of our other managers get blamed for transfers - we blame Rudkin. But for Cooper we make an exception.

 

He probably just said we need experience. Which was correct. Then all Rudkin could find/offer him was that bunch of s**t. 

We can’t blame any other managers for transfers as they haven’t been able to.

 

Cooper had a fit Mads, Ruud never did.

 

I thought how rank the Chelsea game was but then remembered Cooper’s mismanagement against Palace….his tactics and substitutions cost us the three points that day.

[Foxin_Mad]

2 hours ago, funkyrobot said:

Absolutely no evidence to back that up. RVN was an embarrassment at this club. Great player, terrible manager. 

There’s quite a lot of evidence he was better than Cifuentes, I mean a clown from a local clown show would be. RVN won a trophy in Holland what the **** has Cifuentes done? Even QPR fans thought he was wank. 

[SafewayFox]

1 hour ago, Claridge said:

He wasn't very good, but miles above anything we have had since, players are meant to do well and save a manager aren't they?

Cooper miles above anything since?

 

That’s a very big stretch.

 

The sad reality is that every manager since Enzo has been honking.

 

Cooper however has hurt us longer term than the others.

[Lambert09]

In the most damaging Leicester city mangers list cooper is top 3. 
 

ruud didn’t add to our woes,  he wasn’t a good manager but all the problems were already at the door when he arrived. 
 

 

[ajthefox]

Cooper, RvN and Cifuentes were all shite and share some blame.

 

But none of them deserve a share comparable to Rudkin and Aiyawatt because each of them turned out to be the equivalent of putting a plaster on an amputated limb.

[trooky]

Cifuentes is the worst of the bunch along with the current twat in charge because they've failed miserably in the championship with the same PL players assembled by Cooper and relegated by RVN. 

 

I personally think we would gave done better with RvN this season because he was a bit of a bastard and wouldn't accept the shit we've had to endure this season. 

 

He's also a much bigger name in the game and would have recruited better with loans or free's compared to Cifuentes. 

 

The ultimate blame is with Top and Rudkin for so many horrendous decisions and the players for lacking any bottle for the fight. 

[Dan]

Van Nistelrooy's record was so abject that you just can't really build any case for him. But the bar is so low that I do get it. He's the one manager since Maresca that hasn't tried to placate these players. That obviously did backfire on him, but the more time passes the more I think he could point to being dealt a terrible hand more than being totally useless. And lets be fair - as crap as he was, he was steady if unspectacular at PSV, so not a complete joke figure of a manager.

[Guesty]

33 minutes ago, SafewayFox said:

We can’t blame any other managers for transfers as they haven’t been able to.

 

Cooper had a fit Mads, Ruud never did.

 

I thought how rank the Chelsea game was but then remembered Cooper’s mismanagement against Palace….his tactics and substitutions cost us the three points that day.

We signed Coulibaly In January that season on a 4 and half year deal. In what was another baffling signing. That wasn't Cooper's fault.

 

This season our free transfer and loan signings have made little sense. Rudkin and the same recruitment team looked at Ayew and Daka this January and thought: 'They're good enough, what we need is Joe Aribo on loan'. I put all our transfers issues at the door of Rudkin, who has been here throughout - and who's transfer strategy seems to be what ever football agents offer him.

 

I do agree Mad's was a big loss. But at the same time: who will history look back worse on: I think it's RvN. He went scoreless and winless for 8 consecutive home games setting an English Football League record. Whereas Cooper kept that same squad out of the relegation zone (with awful, turgid football). They were both poor managers, handcuffed by an even worse DoF. 

[trooky]

1 hour ago, Dan said:

Van Nistelrooy's record was so abject that you just can't really build any case for him. But the bar is so low that I do get it. He's the one manager since Maresca that hasn't tried to placate these players. That obviously did backfire on him, but the more time passes the more I think he could point to being dealt a terrible hand more than being totally useless. And lets be fair - as crap as he was, he was steady if unspectacular at PSV, so not a complete joke figure of a manager.

You can't build a case for either of Cifuentes or Rowett either, so why waste compensation on RVN and Cifuentes when we don't have the money.

 

That's my case for keeping RvN and we would also of had a proper pre-season schedule instead of wasting it. 

 

Just one of the many ridiculous decisions by Topkin. 

Edited 12 April by trooky

[Stadt]

What transpired under RVN would have happened under Cooper too. Copper just benefitted from a few screamers and a bit more confidence at the start of the season.

[Claridge]

1 hour ago, SafewayFox said:

Cooper miles above anything since?

 

That’s a very big stretch.

 

The sad reality is that every manager since Enzo has been honking.

 

Cooper however has hurt us longer term than the others.

big stretch, how? we weren’t in the bottom 3 of the premier league.massive difference to the ones we have had since.Not a massive fan, but there is no way we are where we are if Cooper was in. charge

[SafewayFox]

3 hours ago, Guesty said:

I never said Cooper was great, but he was better than RvN. Mad's performances did bail him out somewhat. But look at his results compared to RvN's. It's not revisionism, it's reality.

 

The only thing people really hammer him for now is transfers. It seems out of our last few managers - he was the only one who controlled our transfers. None of our other managers get blamed for transfers - we blame Rudkin. But for Cooper we make an exception.

 

He probably just said we need experience. Which was correct. Then all Rudkin could find/offer him was that bunch of s**t. 

Ignore this post as a duplicate.

 

But my point still remains, Cooper set us back more than any other recent managers.

Edited 12 April by SafewayFox
Duplicated post

[TommyK]

One thing you can say about Cifuentes is that he was at least looking towards the future. Numerous young players had there chance under him and he was weeding out the shit like Faes and Winks.  Under Rowett all those "experienced professionals" are back in the team.