Leeds open legal proceedings

[fox_favourite]

2 minutes ago, Long Eaton Fox said:

If the 6 point deduction was applied to our championship winning season then we would be still 1 point ahead of leeds. No difference. We get promoted they finish third

Also they forget they had a very slow start, which also cost them. That wasn't our fault. 

[Long Eaton Fox]

Also we would not have got relegated last season with 6 more points.

[ShadowKing]

So who can Leicester sue to offset this loss? Everton? Forest? Manchester City? Chelsea?

[Foxmeister]

4 hours ago, st albans fox said:

At this time, neither club have been found guilty of any psr breaches. 

Isn’t there a time bar on these things ??

The limitation period only starts from when the claimant becomes aware of the breach so, were they to be found guilty, it would be 3 years from the  date of that judgment.

[ClaphamFox]

1 hour ago, Long Eaton Fox said:

If the 6 point deduction was applied to our championship winning season then we would be still 1 point ahead of leeds. No difference. We get promoted they finish third

This is what makes Leeds' case very difficult to prove. Burnley's entire case against Everton centred on material facts—ie, if Everton's six-point deduction had been imposed in 22/22, Everton would have gone down and Burnley would have stayed up. Leeds cannot make the same argument for 23/24 because we'd still have finished ahead of them even with the deduction, as you say. Leeds must therefore be planning to argue that the advantage we gained from our PSR breach was worth more than the six points imposed by an independent panel, then upheld by an appeal board. This takes it out of the realm of material facts and into one of speculation and subjective judgment. Their case is clearly much, much weaker than Burnley's.

[Foxmeister]

2 hours ago, Terraloon said:

Sorry what would be your starting point ?
 

As St Albans says at this time neither club has been found guilty of any PSR excesses. 
 

LCFC issues have been confirmed by various panels who say that LCFC exceeded the allowable sums . As I said in my earlier post the wording in Chelsea’s settlement agreement and sanctioned by a formal IC makes it clear that what you are dealing with isn’t a PSR matter but a matter of payments not made in accord with process , even then that settlement agreement makes it absolutely clear that had Chelsea not co operated indeed they themselves put forward and agreed to scenarios around those payments that weren’t able to be proved even to the level of beyond reasonable doubt.
 

 

Beyond reasonable doubt is the highest standard of proof applied in criminal cases. These cases are civil matters decided on the balance of probabilities. 

[Long Eaton Fox]

So basically by appealing  and delaying the charge we've made things  worse for ourselves. No title but promotion, and the championship not league 1. Thanks board!

[Stopharage]

If they win, immediately go into administration. Offer them a penny in the pound. 
 

Just forget about all of other ramifications. We’re nothing but petty. 

[Long Eaton Fox]

4 minutes ago, Stopharage said:

If they win, immediately go into administration. Offer them a penny in the pound. 
 

Just forget about all of other ramifications. We’re nothing but petty. 

I think you get a 20 point deduction for administration.

[Terraloon]

23 minutes ago, Foxmeister said:

Beyond reasonable doubt is the highest standard of proof applied in criminal cases. These cases are civil matters decided on the balance of probabilities. 

Sorry I have no idea why I put beyond reasonable doubt. 
 

On that point one thing that has intrigued me is the Man City CAS outcome. 
 

Both at UEFA and CAs they apply the burden of proof as being Comfortable Satisfaction. I wrongly had assumed that would be similar to Balance of Probability so to a degree I didn’t question the assumption being made that if there is the same evidence that a PL commission would probably reach the same conclusion if there wasn’t any more evidence.

However I have done a little more reading and Comfortable Satisfaction is believed to be a higher level of proof.

[Terraloon]

22 minutes ago, Stopharage said:

If they win, immediately go into administration. Offer them a penny in the pound. 
 

Just forget about all of other ramifications. We’re nothing but petty. 

The main ramification would be it is that owing money to Leeds would be classified as a football creditor. That in effect would have to be paid at 100p in the £

[Foxmeister]

1 hour ago, Terraloon said:

Sorry I have no idea why I put beyond reasonable doubt. 
 

On that point one thing that has intrigued me is the Man City CAS outcome. 
 

Both at UEFA and CAs they apply the burden of proof as being Comfortable Satisfaction. I wrongly had assumed that would be similar to Balance of Probability so to a degree I didn’t question the assumption being made that if there is the same evidence that a PL commission would probably reach the same conclusion if there wasn’t any more evidence.

However I have done a little more reading and Comfortable Satisfaction is believed to be a higher level of proof.

Yes, its wording would suggest that. It suggests a sort of intermediate level, maybe around the 75% mark. I doubt Leeds would be able to demonstrate they would have been promoted if we hadn’t broken the rules on that basis.

[TeamRocket]

If Leeds win this i expected King power group to go sue others! Honestly this is going to get messy really quickly. 

[Clever Fox]

I'd say the fact Leeds have left it this long will work against them.

[Claudio Fannieri]

I wouldn’t be shocked if this ends up being settled out of court and us making a fairly nominal compensation payment. Not sure Leeds have anywhere near as strong a case as Burnley did with Everton given our points deduction was less than the number of points we finished ahead. 

 

this needs shutting down quickly before it gets out of hand and every club is suing each other for each and every wrong doing. 

[Chrysalis]

Not sure how we make the payment though, KP are out of cash and it be down if the family will put it in.
I am not going to defend the financial mismanagement, but I also cant see what the point is of what Leeds are doing, they sitting pretty in the EPL, and we had a points gap exceeding our penalty.  It is as if there is some kind of resentment and they just want to dig in, and bring our woes back in to the forefront as well.