Holland v Costa Rica

[CosbehFox]

As I've said before (conveniently overlooked), the Dutch have been in the position they were in last night, a number of times. They have lost in many quarters and semis with teams equally as good as last night's team. They are known as bottlers. Yet last night, they had 'the right players' to win on penalties.

I think its all crap. They could and should have put the game to bed in 120 minutes but didn't. Then they go into penalties and finally triumph. That's how I saw it.

Have this bunch of players lost on penalties before? I don't know the answer but they had three guys who've taken penalties at the highest level. Too much is made of past history when it's a different set of players.

Question here - if you had Van Persie, Robben, Snedjier and then even Hunterlaar as well. You'd surely be confident of winning?

[Guest Col city fan]

They hit the bar!

And the Costa Ricans had the best chance of extra time saved by the Dutch keeper!

Risky... it should have been over by then!

[DANGEROUS TIGER]

For fooks sake! This is an internet forum. I'm not talking to you am I, I'm interpreting what you read..

For any side to be as confident as to leave it, leave it, leave it (because that's kinda what the Dutch did).. having made sod all chances in extra time, because they were confident of winning on penalties IS risky. Remember the Costa Rica penalty shout? Which was a good shout.. that could have finished the game.

To be alleging (how I'm reading it) that the Dutch were so confident that they would ultimately win (in this case on penalties) is not wise. It's not clever to do that is it. What would make more sense would have been to have taken one of the few chances they made in open play.

Am I missing something here? Cos I cant for the life of me see your logic.

Go on Col, you tell the geezer.

[Dan]

If penalties was such a lottery then why would a mentally weak side in England continue to lose shoot-out after shoot-out?

[Donut]

Penalties arent as random as people suggest i dont think.

Take for example England v Italy at euro 2012. Italy taught us a lesson that night and did everything but score. When the game went to penalties, was it really a flip of a coin that Italy or England could win the shootout? It was always highly likely that Italy would win the shootout given the way the night had gone.

Similarly, look at the penalty shootouts in this world cup so far. Costa Rica and Greece you could argue are evenly matched teams, so perhaps that was a flip of a coin, but Brazil v Chile. Despite the excellent world cup the Chileans had, there was always a feeling Brazil would overcome them to progress to the next round. So when it went to penalties, it wasnt highly surprising they did win the shootout. Likewise last night. everyone fancied the Dutch, and when it went to penalties, i think the majority of people would have thought Holland would win.

Watching a number of shootouts in the past, too many to list every single one, it seems in the majority of cases, the "fancied" team does win through in the end.

Example: Leicester have held Man City to a 0-0 draw after extra time in a cup tie. Penalties are to be taken. You would STILL most definitely fancy Man City to get through the shootout.

Whether this is because the "fancied" team has better technicians in it that are more comfortable taking the penalties, whether the "fancied" team has covered less ground in the game and kept the ball better and arrived at the shootout fresher, whether the "fancied" team has handled more pressure situations in the past, or just whether an aura exists around the team that intimidates the oppositon and carries the fancied team through, there is definitely something.

Most likely a combination of all 3, but it feels that way to me.

[Dan]

I flipped a coin ahead of that shoot-out funnily enough. Heads for Italy and tails for Italy.

[Mike Oxlong]

Holland haters are sluts.

Best team won.

[A fox for life]

Anyone else annoyed that liniker didn't mention that Oneil did the same thing! He must have relised surely

[RonnieTodger]

Don't understand the whole "harsh on Cillessen" thing. If a keeper is better suited for penalties, you bring him on. It was clear to see Cillessen wasn't too fussed, anyway. If (we made it through and) England brought off Sturridge and put Lambert on to take a penalty, despite Sturridge being our best striker - would anyone moan? I don't think so. I remember Sturridge missing a penalty for Britain against Korea and Lambert's record is perfect.

You do what you need to do to win.

[ScouseFox]

cillessen is fúcking shite anyway

[Dan]

Don't understand the whole "harsh on Cillessen" thing. If a keeper is better suited for penalties, you bring him on. It was clear to see Cillessen wasn't too fussed, anyway. If (we made it through and) England brought off Sturridge and put Lambert on to take a penalty, despite Sturridge being our best striker - would anyone moan? I don't think so. I remember Sturridge missing a penalty for Britain against Korea and Lambert's record is perfect.

You do what you need to do to win.

This. Found the whole reaction to everything farcical and largely dictated by Costa Rica being the major underdog.

Would Cillessen rather have played and not saved any, or done that?

His reaction after suggested he was prepared for it.

[kingcarr21]

Didnt like the way Krul was acting to Costa Rica. No sense of sportsmanship at all. But the Ref should of intervened.

[Guest Col city fan]

Ugh, I ****ing hate the term "lottery" in relation to penalties. Worst cliché in football.

Penalties level the playing field and give lesser teams a chance because you don't need to be Messi or Ronaldo to score one. To that extent, as a fan, it can feel like flipping a coin. Anyone could score or miss.

But as a player it most certainly is not luck. It's bottle, focus, determination, technique, mind games, decision making. If it was luck, Lampard would have a success rate more like David Nugent and managers wouldn't give a shit which five they sent up.

There was nothing lucky about last night. The Dutch took excellent, well composed penalties and their manager completely psyched out the Costa Ricans by sending on his tallest keeper as a "specialist" even though we know he has no track record of being one.

Not according to Louis?