Harry - LCFC Posted 4 December 2014 Posted 4 December 2014 Another failure to indict a policeman for the death of an unarmed man. Sure, this guy talked back to the policemen. He was fed up of being harassed. As I see it, he had his hands up when he was swarmed by police. He said repeatedly he couldn't breathe, as the policeman puts him in a banned choke hold. The NYC Office of the Chief Medical Examiner ruled it a homicide and said death was caused by “compression of the neck [choke hold], compression of chest and prone positioning during physical restraint by police.” So, we know how he died and the video shows us who did it. How does that not make it to trial? The Grand Jury needed 12 votes, and was comprised of 14 white and 9 'non-white' people. That's how it didn't make it to trial. This one looks really clear cut. On the face of it, the only way that someone could have come to that conclusion was to ignore the evidence.
MC Prussian Posted 4 December 2014 Posted 4 December 2014 Anybody else already mentioned the Tamir Rice incident in Cleveland? Bored black kid toys around with a harmless air gun, police pull up, shoot him within seconds upon arrival. Find it hard to believe? There's even a surveillance video: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/11/26/tamir-rice-video-shows-co_n_6227552.html The cop who shot Rice was declared "mentally instable" and "unable to carry a firearm" two years ago and, as a consequence, released from his duties: http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/2014/dec/03/officer-who-fatally-shot-tamir-rice-had-been-judged-unfit Then the Cleveland police department re-hires him without having read the memo by their colleagues in Independence, OH.
Merging Cultures Posted 4 December 2014 Posted 4 December 2014 This one looks really clear cut. On the face of it, the only way that someone could have come to that conclusion was to ignore the evidence. At least for criminally negligent homicide/manslaughter. The policeman didn't intend to kill him, but he was certainly negligent. As were the other officers involved.
David Guiza Posted 4 December 2014 Author Posted 4 December 2014 http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/nyregion/fatal-police-encounters-in-new-york-city.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur&bicmp=AD&bicmlukp=WT.mc_id&bicmst=1409232722000&bicmet=1419773522000&_r=0 Interesting article for anyone who wants to read it. A couple of roudy students getting pushed by Warwickshire Police is about as violent as it gets over here most years.
Merging Cultures Posted 4 December 2014 Posted 4 December 2014 http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2014/nyregion/fatal-police-encounters-in-new-york-city.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur&bicmp=AD&bicmlukp=WT.mc_id&bicmst=1409232722000&bicmet=1419773522000&_r=0 Interesting article for anyone who wants to read it. A couple of roudy students getting pushed by Warwickshire Police is about as violent as it gets over here most years. And a reminder about UC Davis and how the US treat students... http://www.theguardian.com/world/2011/nov/20/uc-davis-pepper-spray-video The cop got $38,000 disability settlement btw after getting depression and anxiety (brought on by death threats). http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/10/23/pepper-spray-cop-settlement_n_4152147.html
Stadt Posted 4 December 2014 Posted 4 December 2014 What happened today was quite disgusting but I think it was more to do with him being absolutely massive rather than black, I could be wrong but I don't think it was racially motivated at all.
Benji Posted 4 December 2014 Posted 4 December 2014 Regardless of colour and intent the video is pretty damning. The guy puts his hands up and gets jumped on from behind and pushed into the ground with enough force to eventually kill him. I'm sure the guy was no saint but this is about as clear cut as it gets - genuinely shocked when you take a step back and think this is the USA we're talking about.
Harry - LCFC Posted 4 December 2014 Posted 4 December 2014 The US seems to be so much worse when it comes to dealing with crime and indeed crime itself. 400 police shootings a year I think, compared to zero in the UK. Murder rate four times higher than ours. Don't know any statistics off hand but their prison population is enormous.
Bettsj2 Posted 4 December 2014 Posted 4 December 2014 The guy says he can't breathe but they dont let him go. To not find anything wrong with that just doesnt make sense.
Steve_Guppy_Left_Foot Posted 5 December 2014 Posted 5 December 2014 And Obama thinks the answer is to make police wear cameras? Why bother when you can kill people on camera and get away with it, it'd change nothing.
Harry - LCFC Posted 5 December 2014 Posted 5 December 2014 And Obama thinks the answer is to make police wear cameras? Why bother when you can kill people on camera and get away with it, it'd change nothing. Obtaining more evidence can only be a good thing IMO. Trials will be more likely to result in the correct decision. If a case wrongly fails to make it to a trial the public will see what's happening and will put pressure on the courts to make the right decision.
leicsmac Posted 5 December 2014 Posted 5 December 2014 So...none of our friendly board members who like authority stepping in to defend the cop on this one? /rodinwater
notnow john Posted 5 December 2014 Posted 5 December 2014 O.k I'll try. The police didn't kill him,the manner of his arrest may have been a contributory factor. If you are being choked you cannot speak. He died later of a heart attack. So if you're morbidly obese you should be immune from arrest, just in case.
leicsmac Posted 6 December 2014 Posted 6 December 2014 O.k I'll try. The police didn't kill him,the manner of his arrest may have been a contributory factor. If you are being choked you cannot speak. He died later of a heart attack. So if you're morbidly obese you should be immune from arrest, just in case. Kudos to you for taking it on. However...the coroner from New York who examined the body disagrees with you on the cause of death. I quote, “compression of the neck [choke hold], compression of chest and prone positioning during physical restraint by police.” His weight may well have been a contributing factor, though. It's not murder as the police clearly didn't intend for him to die during arrest...but I think this fits the definition of manslaughter perfectly.
FoxesAreBlue Posted 6 December 2014 Posted 6 December 2014 I've not seen the case at all, but it is harder to breather if you are lying down on your lungs. Try it yourself... Lie completely prone on the floor for a minute and concentrate on your breathing, then lie on your side (recovery position style) you will notice the difference, it's definately easier on your side and I image that an obese, unfit person who would have more weight on his lungs in a prone position could possibly struggle.
Benji Posted 6 December 2014 Posted 6 December 2014 O.k I'll try. The police didn't kill him,the manner of his arrest may have been a contributory factor. If you are being choked you cannot speak. He died later of a heart attack. So if you're morbidly obese you should be immune from arrest, just in case. No, if you're morbidly obese or perfectly healthy you should be arrested in an appropriate way. A chokehold from behind when you're unarmed, hands in the air and being accused of illegally selling untaxed cigarettes (a minor crime in the grand scheme of things) is hardly an appropriate way of arresting someone. Had he been waving a gun then fine, do whatever you can to get him to the floor, but this cop had clearly just had enough and took matters into his own hands which has now unfortunately fuelled the race card being used by demonstrators. Which is very depressing all round. I mean at this point in the arrest, what value is there in strangling the guy?
ADK Posted 6 December 2014 Posted 6 December 2014 Isn't it similar to what happened with Ian Tomlinson?
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