Parafox Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 1 minute ago, Swan Lesta said: I'm really not. I ask for a yes or no answer to the following then: Should an 11 year old girl be given the competency to consent to going on an adventure ride which if she stands up on for whatever reason may lead to her death? If every reasonable step has been made to ensure the safety of that child (I assume the HSE will be involved) and the ride has met all the safety standards required of it, then yes, I would believe that 11 year old understands the warnings and restrictions and possible outcomes of not heeding those warnings, has competency Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Innovindil Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 1 minute ago, Swan Lesta said: I'm really not. I ask for a yes or no answer to the following then: Should an 11 year old girl be given the competency to consent to going on an adventure ride which if she stands up on for whatever reason may lead to her death? Should she be given the competency to consent to crossing the road which if she crosses at the wrong time for whatever reason may lead to her death? Honestly, what a daft question. Drayton Manor have the responsibility to ensure the safety of their guests, as far as is reasonably practicable. Warning signs, warning tanoys, height restrictions, handle bars go as far as is reasonably practicable and has withstood 20 years of use. You can't make reactionary decisions based on one freak accident, it's ludicrous. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Just now, Parafox said: If every reasonable step has been made to ensure the safety of that child (I assume the HSE will be involved) and the ride has met all the safety standards required of it, then yes, I would believe that 11 year old understands the warnings and restrictions and possible outcomes of not heeding those warnings, has competency So as a paramedic you know that competency to consent to treatment falls for U16s from Gillick to Fraser guidelines.... and the wording relates to a full cognitive understanding of the potential outcomes inclusive of risks and harm. I don't believe an eleven year old in the throws of the adventure ride has the capacity to make those decisions nor do I believe that adults should allow her to be able to make those decisions. And that's where we differ and why I believe the ride needs adjustment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiffToff88 Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 I suppose people should also be strapped to their horses on a carousel too, just on the off chance that someone decides to try to stand up on their horse, slips off and breaks their neck... Drayton Manor have done everything possible to make sure that this ride is safe as long as people follow their extremely simple guidelines. The ride is extremely safe if you don't ignore the warnings. Just like my above example of a carousel. What other reasonable, practicable measures could possibly be put in place on the river rapids ride? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 4 minutes ago, Innovindil said: Should she be given the competency to consent to crossing the road which if she crosses at the wrong time for whatever reason may lead to her death? Honestly, what a daft question. Drayton Manor have the responsibility to ensure the safety of their guests, as far as is reasonably practicable. Warning signs, warning tanoys, height restrictions, handle bars go as far as is reasonably practicable and has withstood 20 years of use. You can't make reactionary decisions based on one freak accident, it's ludicrous. Its not though - more than one kid has ended up in the moving water. Is it a requirement of the ride that you can swim? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Just now, TiffToff88 said: I suppose people should also be strapped to their horses on a carousel too, just on the off chance that someone decides to try to stand up on their horse, slips off and breaks their neck... Drayton Manor have done everything possible to make sure that this ride is safe as long as people follow their extremely simple guidelines. The ride is extremely safe if you don't ignore the warnings. Just like my above example of a carousel. What other reasonable, practicable measures could possibly be put in place on the river rapids ride? Would you put 3 foot of moving water underneath a carousel? No of course you wouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie1999 Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 1 minute ago, Swan Lesta said: Would you put 3 foot of moving water underneath a carousel? No of course you wouldn't. What you're basically saying is the only way to prevent such an accident is for it not to be there in the first place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ramboacdc Posted 11 May 2017 Author Share Posted 11 May 2017 3 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said: Its not though - more than one kid has ended up in the moving water. Is it a requirement of the ride that you can swim? 2 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said: Would you put 3 foot of moving water underneath a carousel? No of course you wouldn't. obvious troll is obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest MattP Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Blimey Nick put the keyboard down, you are making Alf's massacre of me look like a MattP victory in these few pages. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 1 minute ago, yorkie1999 said: What you're basically saying is the only way to prevent such an accident is for it not to be there in the first place. Or to make a reasonable adjustment to prevent kids from falling into the water which I know is just crazy talk! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiffToff88 Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 4 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said: Would you put 3 foot of moving water underneath a carousel? No of course you wouldn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 1 minute ago, ramboacdc said: obvious troll is obvious. Not at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiffToff88 Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 7 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said: Or to make a reasonable adjustment to prevent kids from falling into the water which I know is just crazy talk! There's nothing unreasonable about telling them to remain seated. What more can they do? Seatbelts or lap bars would cause problems if the boats were to capsize. The park rely on the common sense of their customers to keep themselves safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 2 minutes ago, MattP said: Blimey Nick put the keyboard down, you are making Alf's massacre of me look like a MattP victory in these few pages. Waded in like Col City with no real input then Matt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Just now, TiffToff88 said: There's nothing unreasonable about telling them to remain seated. What more can they do? Seatbelts or lap bars would cause problems if the boars were to capsize. The park rely on the common sense of their customers to keep themselves safe. The boars should not be able to capsize. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 2 minutes ago, TiffToff88 said: There's nothing unreasonable about telling them to remain seated. What more can they do? Seatbelts or lap bars would cause problems if the boars were to capsize. The park rely on the common sense of their customers to keep themselves safe. No they don't - strapping in on a roller coaster is not optional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TiffToff88 Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Just now, Swan Lesta said: The boars should not be able to capsize. You're right, they shouldn't. But planes shouldn't be able to crash, sharks should't be able to attack people swimming in the sea, but these things still happen. As far as i'm aware, there has never been an incident of one of these boats capsizing, at least in the UK. But anything can happen at any time. Just imagine for a moment that it's decided that the best course of action is to strap people into their seats on these rides, then one day, another freak accident happens, where a boat somehow does capsize, and all 8 people on board drown because they're unable to get out of their seats. Can you imagine the uproar if that happened? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 1 minute ago, TiffToff88 said: You're right, they shouldn't. But planes shouldn't be able to crash, sharks should't be able to attack people swimming in the sea, but these things still happen. As far as i'm aware, there has never been an incident of one of these boats capsizing, at least in the UK. But anything can happen at any time. Just imagine for a moment that it's decided that the best course of action is to strap people into their seats on these rides, then one day, another freak accident happens, where a boat somehow does capsize, and all 8 people on board drown because they're unable to get out of their seats. Can you imagine the uproar if that happened? Sure- Si the ride needs to be designed so the boats can't go over or that their is a gyroscopic release mechanism for the lap bar in the event that the boat did go beyond a certain angle. The technology is available to make that death preventable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sk3since03 Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Personally i think Richie Wellens is to blame Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Just now, sk3since03 said: Personally i think Richie Wellens is to blame It wouldn't surprise me if he was working at the Park. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DJ Barry Hammond Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Is this the actual inquest? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yorkie1999 Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 4 minutes ago, Swan Lesta said: Sure- Si the ride needs to be designed so the boats can't go over or that their is a gyroscopic release mechanism for the lap bar in the event that the boat did go beyond a certain angle. The technology is available to make that death preventable. Looking at this picture from alton towers, they do appear to be strapped in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Just now, yorkie1999 said: Looking at this picture from alton towers, they do appear to be strapped in. As they are on other more modern water park rides around the globe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 8 minutes ago, yorkie1999 said: Looking at this picture from alton towers, they do appear to be strapped in. As they are on other more modern water park rides around the globe. if must just be a coincidence that another rapids ride has closed today at Thorpe Park.... So all, do we think Rumba Rapids has child security? Think it's the first time they have had a discussion about installing preventative measures such as lap belts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wymsey Posted 11 May 2017 Share Posted 11 May 2017 Might be right in thinking the seats on the ride had no adjustable seatbelts, and just 'black chairs' facing each other? With a ride that is bumpy and has twists and turns, particularly in windy weather etc, this should be a requirement clearly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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