Where do we go from here?

[5waller5]

Yes NP needs to sort that out but 2 weeks prior against Blackpool, these issues werent there so surely there wasnt a massive issue there. These players need to take responsibilty. Surely Morgan and Moore should be marking Ebanks Blake and Doyle on EVERY set piece?

Well you'd have absolutely thought so, and most of us that have played football would have done exactly that - gone man for man. I've never been coached in zonal marking and don't know how how they are meant to combat what we saw yesterday - because that was a definite tactic of the opposition, probably as a result of studying our defensive line up at set pieces.

We seem to be out thought by the coaching teams of opponents. Our set pieces look lame in comparison, when do we get a corner and you think we have a great chance of scoring?? But when the opposition do that's what they think and to be fair they are often right.

NP has never been the man for the job IMO, we are just playing out what was always going to happen with his appointment - 12 months of him building a side which is average, and him showing his lack of tactical ability.

[chris_lcfc_85]

Well you'd have absolutely thought so, and most of us that have played football would have done exactly that - gone man for man. I've never been coached in zonal marking and don't know how how they are meant to combat what we saw yesterday - because that was a definite tactic of the opposition, probably as a result of studying our defensive line up at set pieces.

We seem to be out thought by the coaching teams of opponents. Our set pieces look lame in comparison, when do we get a corner and you think we have a great chance of scoring?? But when the opposition do that's what they think and to be fair they are often right.

NP has never been the man for the job IMO, we are just playing out what was always going to happen with his appointment - 12 months of him building a side which is average, and him showing his lack of tactical ability.

Well in fairness, whether he's right or not, he's the manager now and im still backing him to sort this out. We have an exciting young squad so im prepared to give him longer rather than seeing another manager walk through the door which is the circus of LCFC

[Babylon]

You have no idea how much I hate agreeing with Col City but ...... The defensive midfielder would mean that less balls get through to the centre halves, so they have less opportunities to spoon the ball to the forward, they'd also have an additional body nearby to help out when they do.

We can't protect the defence from everything, it's their job to defend. If they are incapable of doing the basics DM or no DM those mistakes will happen.

Moores spoon was nobodies fault but his own. If he was under pressure and had nobody to pass to, just kick the ball out of play. He chose the wrong option and played that option badly. That's his fault and his fault only.

[Babylon]

Yes and he's also the captain of a side that has shipped 6 goals already AND the defensive Marshall?

I've always liked Morgan but in his current role I'm afraid the 'defensive errors' you speak of rest ultimately with the manager and Morgan as the commander of the defence.

Finally... Compare this to Pearsons play off side and I'm afraid there must be SOMETHING that is sorely amiss with our away performances.

Right, so any INDIVIDUAL error that gets made it either a) down to the fact we don't have a DM. b) Down to Morgan not organising the defence and c) down to Pearson. And absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with poor individual decision making and play.

[accessory]

We can't protect the defence from everything, it's their job to defend. If they are incapable of doing the basics DM or no DM those mistakes will happen.

Moores spoon was nobodies fault but his own. If he was under pressure and had nobody to pass to, just kick the ball out of play. He chose the wrong option and played that option badly. That's his fault and his fault only.

But doesn't it also call into question the judgement of a manager who selected him ahead of a Euro 2012 centre-half?

[Guest Col city fan]

Right, so any INDIVIDUAL error that gets made it either a) down to the fact we don't have a DM. b) Down to Morgan not organising the defence and c) down to Pearson. And absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with poor individual decision making and play.

You know that's not what I'm saying.

If you read above you will see time and time again that I'm saying defensive errors WILL happen. They are an inevitable part of the game.

However, the fact that they are happening on such a frequent basis AND with Pearson now being in charge for some time, implies that the defence is not being marshalled in the same way, for example, as Brown did with Hobbs. OR it implies that that the formation we are playing away from home is not sufficiently defensive to support the back five. Drinkwater, for instance, IS NOT getting back quickly enough to win the 2nd ball.

Look at the stats man.. In the play off season we had the fourth meanest defence in the division. The defence (or the defensive side of the team) this season pales by comparison so far.

Grrrrrrrrr.....It's like pulling teeth and I'm giving up for the moment...

[chris_lcfc_85]

But doesn't it also call into question the judgement of a manager who selected him ahead of a Euro 2012 centre-half?

SSL is so bang average its crazy. Anyone who thinks he's the answer long term is sadly mistaken.

Whitbread needs to get fit!

[cecchini]

Watched the game from the Britannia Pub in Luxembourg (Barman is a wolves fan - so you can imagine how i felt)

I felt that we had no real strategy or ideas on how to get a goal. SOme poped some long rangers (konchesky's goal was great) others tried to walk it in, but there is no real playmaker. Lots of individual talent, but no team.

well that's what i saw.

[accessory]

You know that's not what I'm saying.

If you read above you will see time and time again that I'm saying defensive errors WILL happen. They are an inevitable part of the game.

However, the fact that they are happening on such a frequent basis AND with Pearson now being in charge for some time, implies that the defence is not being marshalled in the same way, for example, as Brown did with Hobbs. OR it implies that that the formation we are playing away from home is not sufficiently defensive to support the back five. Drinkwater, for instance, IS NOT getting back quickly enough to win the 2nd ball.

Look at the stats man.. In the play off season we had the fourth meanest defence in the division. The defence (or the defensive side of the team) this season pales by comparison so far.

Grrrrrrrrr.....It's like pulling teeth and I'm giving up for the moment...

We also played 4-3-3/4-5-1 for much of that season, partly because King often struggled when playing in a two-man centre midfield.

Maybe it's something the manager should reconsider.

[accessory]

SSL is so bang average its crazy. Anyone who thinks he's the answer long term is sadly mistaken.

Whitbread needs to get fit!

SSL > Moore by a country mile.

Whitbread's been trying to get fit for the past five years. Anyone who thinks he can be the answer to our defensive woes is seriously deluded.

[cc_star]

But doesn't it also call into question the judgement of a manager who selected him ahead of a Euro 2012 centre-half?

Didn't he get injured for Ireland?

Anyone who thinks they know better than a manager who's seen him every day since he came back needs their own judgement questioning... and even if he is fit, so what? He's as average as they come and has made plenty of individual errors himself... You're completely deluded if you think he's solve anything

[chris_lcfc_85]

SSL > Moore by a country mile.

Whitbread's been trying to get fit for the past five years. Anyone who thinks he can be the answer to our defensive woes is seriously deluded.

Not much difference between the two but Moore has alot more time on his side to get better.

SSL is weaker than Fryatt was and gets beat in the air more than any centre back i've seen for years. He does the read the game better than Moore but he's got more years of experience in fairness.

Whitbread played over 20 games for Norwich last season in the Prem and they were disappointed to see him leave

[Babylon]

You know that's not what I'm saying.

If you read above you will see time and time again that I'm saying defensive errors WILL happen. They are an inevitable part of the game.

However, the fact that they are happening on such a frequent basis AND with Pearson now being in charge for some time, implies that the defence is not being marshalled in the same way, for example, as Brown did with Hobbs. OR it implies that that the formation we are playing away from home is not sufficiently defensive to support the back five. Drinkwater, for instance, IS NOT getting back quickly enough to win the 2nd ball.

Look at the stats man.. In the play off season we had the fourth meanest defence in the division. The defence (or the defensive side of the team) this season pales by comparison so far.

Grrrrrrrrr.....It's like pulling teeth and I'm giving up for the moment...

What kind of ****ing idiotic players do we have if they need to be told by Morgan at each set piece to stay with their man. Or to not pump the ball directly to their player instead of taking the easier option.

And you will see time and time again I've stated we need to defend better as a unit. But apparently all I do is "bleat" about individual errors. Where as you seem to excuse them to suit your DM argument.

[indierich06]

Yes and he's also the captain of a side that has shipped 6 goals already AND the defensive Marshall?

I've always liked Morgan but in his current role I'm afraid the 'defensive errors' you speak of rest ultimately with the manager and Morgan as the commander of the defence.

Finally... Compare this to Pearsons play off side and I'm afraid there must be SOMETHING that is sorely amiss with our away performances.

I don't think you can really fault Morgan for any of the goals we've conceded so far - he can only do so much. He's not helped by having to carry the entire defence and help out Liam Moore who has clear talent, but is a developing player. When Whitbread comes into the defence and provides a bit of experience, the pressure will be off Morgan a bit and I think we'll start to see much more assured defensive displays.

[Happy Fox]

What kind of ****ing idiotic players do we have if they need to be told by Morgan at each set piece to stay with their man. Or to not pump the ball directly to their player instead of taking the easier option.

And you will see time and time again I've stated we need to defend better as a unit. But apparently all I do is "bleat" about individual errors. Where as you seem to excuse them to suit your DM argument.

That is the key thing it doesn't help when we lump up the ball to Nugent or Vardy who are poor aerially we are wasting our time doing that.

[indierich06]

But doesn't it also call into question the judgement of a manager who selected him ahead of a Euro 2012 centre-half?

SSL has said himself in post match interviews that he's not fully match fit yet, why would we pick an unfit player?

[Mack]

I've had a good think about this overnight and this morning.

The we are 'Playing well and losing' thing just does not wash.

If there is one thing you would expect from a Pearson team is a stingy defence and a hard to beat mentality.

But we are gifting teams one or two goals a game and making the most elementary defensive errors.

When you add that to a current drought of goals from the strikers, and Vardy looking out of his depth, we are in trouble.

I like Pearson but if I am totally honest I only see this ending one way with our owners.......

[seenitall]

I'm not a bloody football manager col I don't know how you stop individuals from making basic errors. Perhaps better coaching with regards their decision making. And "bleating" hardly.

Look at the reviews Peltier and Mills have had so far at their clubs. Reviews very similar to we gave them here.

As for loving Morgan, where you get this from? Because I said I didn't think his pace is that big an issue (it hasn't been). He's been the best of our back 4 by a country mile so far though.

But supposedly, Nigel Pearson is a football manager, perhaps he has the answers?

[Guest Col city fan]

What kind of ****ing idiotic players do we have if they need to be told by Morgan at each set piece to stay with their man. Or to not pump the ball directly to their player instead of taking the easier option.

And you will see time and time again I've stated we need to defend better as a unit. But apparently all I do is "bleat" about individual errors. Where as you seem to excuse them to suit your DM argument.

Oh stop bleating..

Least I'm trying to come up with some sort of answer right or wrong. You ain't.

[accessory]

SSL has said himself in post match interviews that he's not fully match fit yet, why would we pick an unfit player?

He was fit enough to complete two full games for Ireland during the break.

An "average" player would not have appeared in Euro 2012.

Suffice to say I have more respect for Giovanni Trappatoni, one of the most successful defensive coaches in the history of the game and someone who clearly rates SSL, than the views of anyone on this thread.

[Corky]

He was fit enough to complete two full games for Ireland during the break.

An "average" player would not have appeared in Euro 2012.

Suffice to say I have more respect for Giovanni Trappatoni, one of the most successful defensive coaches in the history of the game and someone who clearly rates SSL, than the views of anyone on this thread.

The same SSL that was bullied by fourth division strikers from Burton?

[chris_lcfc_85]

He was fit enough to complete two full games for Ireland during the break.

An "average" player would not have appeared in Euro 2012.

Suffice to say I have more respect for Giovanni Trappatoni, one of the most successful defensive coaches in the history of the game and someone who clearly rates SSL, than the views of anyone on this thread.

Yes they would and did. Maybe they dont have any more options..... Im not saying SSL is poor, just saying he's very average and is NOT the answer to our defensive options, he's just too weak and gets beaten too easily in the air

[Ric Flair]

Playing well and losing offers me no comfort if it happens regularly, it's a classic hallmark of a team destined for mediocrity/failure. Our home form is fairly decent so 2 wins and they'll have put themselves back in the hunt, but we've got to start picking points up away from home even if we have to grind it out.

[fox in the sox]

It has become obvious that we do not have the amazing players that the media seem to think we have. Each time we are on Sky they are going on about the quality we have but it is clear now that the quality is not there. They are still thinking about the money that was spent last season - but most of that was wasted. A lot of the big signings were sold in the summer and replaced with youngsters who may turn out to be good but will not perform consistently at the moment. Again yesterday they were saying we should get at least 30 goals out of Nugent, Vardy and Beckford but I can't see that happening. Nugent has never scored loads of goals, Beckford had one good season and Vardy is untried. There's still a lack of quality in midfield and we have a 19 year old in the heart of defence. Overall we look like a mid-table team again. I do not blame NP for this but the only option I can see is to find a manager who can get more out of the team than the sum of the parts...they are not easy to attract.

[indierich06]

He was fit enough to complete two full games for Ireland during the break.

An "average" player would not have appeared in Euro 2012.

Suffice to say I have more respect for Giovanni Trappatoni, one of the most successful defensive coaches in the history of the game and someone who clearly rates SSL, than the views of anyone on this thread.

I take issue with this, there were plenty of average players on show for Ireland, Greece, Poland, Ukraine, Denmark, Sweden, Czech Republic... Each of these smaller teams have some quality players, but outside of those few quality players, there are a lot of average ones too.