Ex-troops without degrees to train as teachers

[davieG]

Former armed forces personnel without degrees will be fast-tracked into teaching in England under a new government programme.
The Troops to Teachers scheme will help "highly skilled" former military personnel become teachers within two years.
Education Minister David Laws said ex-members of "our inspiring armed forces" could make great teachers.
Teaching unions doubted whether two years' training would be enough.
According to the Department for Education (DfE), service leavers without degrees "will be the only people able to start training as a teacher without a degree and be qualified within two years".
'Outstanding' potential[/size]
The DfE stressed that the scheme would use a rigorous assessment, selection and recruitment process to identify those "with the potential to become outstanding teachers".
From January 2014 those selected for the scheme will earn a salary, training four days a week on-the-job in classrooms around England and one day at university.
After two years' training they will count as 'newly qualified teachers' and will have gained an honours degrees in education, specialising either as secondary school subject teachers or as primary teachers.
Continue reading the main story “Start Quote

"We know that our highly-skilled servicemen and women can inspire young people and help raise educational attainment." ”

David LawsEducation Minister
A DfE spokesman stressed that top military specialists often have relevant experience, particularly in science and technology which could help redress the shortage of teachers in some subjects.
Many military personnel also have experience of "teaching, instructing, mentoring and coaching" which would count as credits towards the degree, says the government.
The government also wants to attract former service staff who have degrees into teaching, and is offering a range of training options to them under the scheme.
Mr Laws said military values such as leadership, discipline, motivation, and teamwork would benefit children.
"We want to capture the ethos and talents of those leaving the armed forces and bring this experience into teaching. We know that our highly-skilled servicemen and women can inspire young people and help raise educational attainment."
Defence Secretary Philip Hammond said both veterans and their young pupils would gain from the scheme.
"A career in the armed forces provides skills and experience you cannot gain anywhere else and I would encourage anyone leaving the services to take the opportunity to pass on their invaluable knowledge".
'Learning ethos'[/size]
Teachers' leaders offered a cautious welcome to the contribution that ex-forces personnel could make to teaching, but Chris Keates of the NASUWT warned of a difference between maintaining military discipline and ensuring good behaviour in classrooms.
"To say you can simply transfer the skills from one to the other is an oversimplification of the complexities of dealing with pupil behaviour in schools," she said.
Brian Lightman, of the Association of School and College Leaders, said one day a week at university was not enough for trainee teachers without degrees.


 

Head teacher Mike Tull: "Discipline within a military context is fundamentally different to within a school or a classroom context"

"There is no doubt that some ex-military personnel have the potential to make excellent teachers, but they need the right preparation and support.
"From what we've seen so far, this programme lacks both... a military ethos belongs in the military. Schools need a learning ethos."
Christine Blower, of the National Union of Teachers, said: "Teaching is a wonderful profession and we welcome applicants from all walks of life who feel they can make the commitment to teach, including ex-military personnel.
"However, teaching involves a complex mix of knowledge, skills and understanding of child development and trainees need both a high level of education themselves and thorough teacher training before they can take on the demands of educating our young people.
Russell Hobby, of the National Association of Head Teachers, said: "It seems predicated on the notion that military service automatically makes someone a good teacher, whereas the reality is, some will make brilliant teachers and some won't."
Shadow education secretary Stephen Twigg said Labour supported re-training troops as teachers but said the government had been too slow to do it.
"It has taken three years for Michael Gove just to launch this scheme, and during that time only a handful of volunteers have come forward".

[leicsmac]

So, let me get this straight. Teachers must have firsts to ensure we have the best, and they are trying to make it a masters-only profession. But if you were a soldier you will automatically have the subject knowledge and skills base without the training...I think that's quite a dangerous assumption to make.

 

Teaching training is no picnic, so I do wonder how this 'fasttrack' scheme will work effectively.

[MPH]

Sounds like a quick fix by the government to make up for the shortage in teachers...

[ADK]

Why do i get the feeling this is designed to shift the demographic of teachers towards more "Tory" values.

[MooseBreath]

Teacher training is no picnic, but then neither is going to war. I think somebody who has been in the army will be far better equipped to deal with teacher training than some spotty kid fresh out of a pointless 8-hour per week degree course.

Seems like a great idea to me. Obviously they would need some training but that is what the two years is for. I reckon kids would benefit hugely from having people with that kind of experience as their teachers, rather than the current crop of soft overly PC shirkers whose only life experience is getting pissed up at uni for a few years.

[Rincewind]

Sounds like a quick fix by the government to make up for the shortage in teachers...

And to prevent some from being unemployable and cut off from society due to being instutionlised.to army life.

 

Of course it will depend on what they teach and they would have to train first to earn the degrees.

My brother has taught bridge at night school yet he is not a qualified teacher just in the top 20 bbritish bridge players.

If it helps them rejoin civvy life then it's a good idea if done right.

[Guest MattP]

Why do i get the feeling this is designed to shift the demographic of teachers towards more "Tory" values.

Probably.

Can't blame them though, Labour employed the same tactics filling the public sector wity their supporters.

Good idea personally, certainly be good for discipline.

We're not talking university lecturers here, it's teaching.

[leicsmac]

Teacher training is no picnic, but then neither is going to war. I think somebody who has been in the army will be far better equipped to deal with teacher training than some spotty kid fresh out of a pointless 8-hour per week degree course.

Seems like a great idea to me. Obviously they would need some training but that is what the two years is for. I reckon kids would benefit hugely from having people with that kind of experience as their teachers, rather than the current crop of soft overly PC shirkers whose only life experience is getting pissed up at uni for a few years.

 

I think the idea in principle is good, but I also think that ex-squaddies should go through the same training regimen as everyone else. Teaching does share a fair amount of skillsets with soldiering, but at the same time there's a hell of a lot of academic material required for teaching that would take a long time for anyone (even a soldier) to get to grips with. 

 

Also, the psychological screening for this scheme would have to be top-notch. 

[Xen]

Teacher training is no picnic, but then neither is going to war. I think somebody who has been in the army will be far better equipped to deal with teacher training than some spotty kid fresh out of a pointless 8-hour per week degree course.

Seems like a great idea to me. Obviously they would need some training but that is what the two years is for. I reckon kids would benefit hugely from having people with that kind of experience as their teachers, rather than the current crop of soft overly PC shirkers whose only life experience is getting pissed up at uni for a few years.

 

The article is implying that it's going to be focused more on technology and sciences though, where degrees are quite often in excess of 20 hours a week. There's no way that someone can easily develop the required level of knowledge within 2 years, by only spending 1 day a week at university. 

 

I've had teachers in the past who have 2:2 class degrees who are still incompetent with the material, so how they expect people without a degree at all to teach is beyond me.

 

 

 

Primary school teaching I can understand, as that requires less subject-specific knowledge and more working-with-children experience; which this seems to provide. But for secondary teaching it all seems a bit hypocritical after we've been told that prospective teachers should be getting firsts and possibly even a masters degree.

 

 

 

One thing it will improve for sure though is discipline in schools, which can only be a good thing. The number of teachers I've had in the past who were simply unable to control a class was pitifully high..

[davieG]

I don't see why it's restricted to military, I'd have thought people with a background in business/industry would also be suitable provided they they met the same criteria. In fact I'd suggest someone going from school to university to teaching without any other experiences is not the best model.

[MooseBreath]

The article specifies that some ex military have "relevant experience" with science and technology. I assume they're talking about military technicians and engineers and such. There's far more to be learned from someone who has had real life experience of the practical application of science and tech than soneonr who has half arsed his way through an out of date text book. Nevertheless I imagine the selection process will be designed to ensure potential teachers are matched with appropriate subjects. That is quite fundamental.

[Guest BlueBrett]

 

 

I've had teachers in the past who have 2:2 class degrees who are still incompetent with the material, so how they expect people without a degree at all to teach is beyond me.

That's because if you get a 2.2 you are a complete dumbass.  They practically give 2.1s away.

A degree is not a badge of competency, it just means you chose to follow a particular (and easy) path when you finished school.Going to uni for most people isn't really even a conscious decision.  You just sort of fall into it afer A Levels because 'it's what people do'. PLus there is so much variation in the value of the qualification you attain depending on your chosen subject and instiution that it is completely pointless to say 'you must have at least a 2.1' or whatever because the reality is that that is no real benchmark at all and can mean wildly different things in terms of the work that has gone in and the level of difficulty.

Teachers don't need to know everything about their subject. That's what textbooks are for.  They just need the skill to read and then communicate in an engaging way.  I'd imagine there would be plenty of people in the armed forces who could do that and, as Davie says, plenty of people in other industries as well.

[Charl91]

Two years? Seems a little short, in my opinion. Three seems more reasonable.

[Jon the Hat]

Hold on:

Teaching unions dissaprove?  YES.

 

Great plan.  Plenty of officer & NCO talent in the Army which could make the transition and be very effective.  You would think we were talking about taking squaddies with no GCSEs and putting them into schools ffs. 

[leicsmac]

Hold on:

Teaching unions dissaprove?  YES.

 

Great plan.  Plenty of officer & NCO talent in the Army which could make the transition and be very effective.  You would think we were talking about taking squaddies with no GCSEs and putting them into schools ffs. 

 

From what I can tell, the teaching unions do approve, as long as the scheme is implemented in a sensible fashion. 

 

Another point actually, that stems from what you said - why would officer and NCO class go into teaching anyway? Most often they have a job for a long time in the Army and a good pension when they come out, and if not there's a lot of different companies that would appreciate individuals like that. Why would they instead take a thankless job getting sniped at by all and sundry in exchange for a wage that's probably lower than what they had in the Service and definitely lower than what they could command elsewhere?

[Trav Le Bleu]

I wonder where the government got this idea from...

 

[Parafox]

From what I can tell, the teaching unions do approve, as long as the scheme is implemented in a sensible fashion. 

 

Another point actually, that stems from what you said - why would officer and NCO class go into teaching anyway? Most often they have a job for a long time in the Army and a good pension when they come out, and if not there's a lot of different companies that would appreciate individuals like that. Why would they instead take a thankless job getting sniped at by all and sundry in exchange for a wage that's probably lower than what they had in the Service and definitely lower than what they could command elsewhere?

 

 Was that deliberate?

[leicsmac]

 Was that deliberate?

 

 Only just noticed that. No, no pun intended.

[The Year Of The Fox]

A good idea if the right calibre of former soldiers are selected. I went to the AFC where we were trained by NCOs who were the cream of the crop. The same goes for those at places such as Sandhurst. They are teaching their profession at places like this, and in particular to AFC people who will be very close to the Year 11 in schools. If they can't obtain the respect of a classroom then few people can. They are used to speaking with authority, and for people to listen to what they're saying.  

 

Indeed my old section commander is now teaching plumbing at a college in Harrogate- No coincidence I'm sure.

 

And here I'm only talking about NCOs. There will be many an officer who is as easily as intelligent as a school teacher with all the right attributes.

[Parafox]

From what I can tell, the teaching unions do approve, as long as the scheme is implemented in a sensible fashion. 

 

Another point actually, that stems from what you said - why would officer and NCO class go into teaching anyway? Most often they have a job for a long time in the Army and a good pension when they come out, and if not there's a lot of different companies that would appreciate individuals like that. Why would they instead take a thankless job getting sniped at by all and sundry in exchange for a wage that's probably lower than what they had in the Service and definitely lower than what they could command elsewhere?

 

 

 Was that deliberate?

 

 

A good idea if the right calibre of former soldiers are selected. I went to the AFC where we were trained by NCOs who were the cream of the crop. The same goes for those at places such as Sandhurst. They are teaching their profession at places like this, and in particular to AFC people who will be very close to the Year 11 in schools. If they can't obtain the respect of a classroom then few people can.

 

It's happening again!!!

[The Year Of The Fox]

It's happening again!!!

I'm too used to spelling it this way

[Zingari]

I'm sure I'll have  loads of objections to this,  and when I think of them I'll list them using  bullet points. 

[Trav Le Bleu]

I've got loads of puns I could use for this thread, I'm just going to rifle through them.

[Zingari]

We should have a think tank to discuss if our infants are safe with infantry .

[Parafox]

Do you think they're out of step with the general feeling?