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FA threat to fans over anti-Semitic term in chants

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http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/football/24057423

 

 

The Football Association has warned that any fan caught chanting the word "Yid" could face criminal charges.

The anti-Semitic term has been aimed at Tottenham fans due to the area's large Jewish population and Spurs supporters sing "Yid Army" as a form of identity.

 

In a statement the FA said: "Use of the term 'Yid' is likely to be considered offensive by the reasonable observer.

"Use of the term in a public setting could amount to a criminal offence and leave fans liable to prosecution."

It added: "The FA would encourage fans to avoid using it in any situation."

 

“We recognise that this is a complex debate and consideration should be given to the appropriateness and suitability of its continued useâ€

Tottenham fans were twice subjected to racially-motivated attacks during their Europa League campaign last season, leading to questions as to whether their continued use of the terms were counter-productive.

In November, two Roma fans were banned from all sporting events for five years after Spurs fan Ashley Mills, 25, of Essex, was stabbed in the thigh.

 

And in February three men believed to be from a far-right group were arrested after an attack on Tottenham fans in a bar in Lyon in which a 51-year-old supporter from Derbyshire was one of three taken to hospital.

In addition, two West Ham fans were arrested and accepted a police caution for anti-Semitic gestures during their team's 3-1 defeat at White Hart Lane in November, one of whom was given a lifetime banning order by the east London club.

 

There have been previous attempts to ban the use of the term by football fans.

In April 2011, comedian, writer and Jewish Chelsea fan David Baddiel wrote a one-minute film entitled "Y-word" as part of the Kick It Out anti-racism campaign featuring then Tottenham captain Ledley King, as well as former Spurs striker Gary Lineker, England international Frank Lampard and Arsenal's Kieran Gibbs.

And in November last year the head of the Society of Black Lawyers, Peter Herbert, said he would complain formally to police if Spurs failed to take action to stop the chants.

In the wake of the FA's latest stance, a Tottenham statement said: "We are acutely aware of the sensitivity of this issue.

 

"Our fans historically adopted the chant as a defence mechanism in order to own the term and thereby deflect anti-Semitic abuse. They do not use the term with any deliberate intent to cause offence.

"We recognise that this is a complex debate and that, in the interests of encouraging a positive and safe environment for all supporters, consideration should be given to the appropriateness and suitability of its continued use.

"We are already in the process of engaging with our fans and shall be consulting more widely in due course."

 

 

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I hate it when people defend other people 'oh you shouldnt call them that', when the person doesn't mind being called that. If you get me. That does annoy me... I didn't think 'yid' was that bad. They had it on their old badge, didn't they? 

 

I've just seen on sky that they are consider warning Spurs fans who 'proudly' chant 'yid army'!?

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Has there ever been any public debate about the (to name one set of supporters) Forest chant "Town full of p*kis" before? Surely that's equally - if not more - hateful and offensive? I've heard it in various broadcasts and yet there never seems to be any follow-up, even in the form of a local editorial or something. 

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Has there ever been any public debate about the (to name one set of supporters) Forest chant "Town full of p*kis" before? Surely that's equally - if not more - hateful and offensive? I've heard it in various broadcasts and yet there never seems to be any follow-up, even in the form of a local editorial or something. 

 

If they do start banning all these 'offensive' chants, then in my opinion, you've got to start stopping songs like 'you fat bast**d' as well. Because that singles an individual(s) out from the rest...

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I see your point - like, that would be the next step logically, but I'm not sure racial abuse and calling someone a fatty are comparable. There's an FA incentive to 'Kick Racism Out of Football' and the chant I mentioned above is precisely the sort of thing the campaign was set up to combat surely?

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Of course they will eventually ban you fat bastard. That's what these people do, ban something then move onto something else and see how far they can get.

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They've been called that for decades.

 

The Spurs fans sing to Wenger...

 

"With a packet of sweets and a cheeky smile, Arsene Wenger is a Pedophile."

 

It's all beyond the realms of being PC or being in good taste but that is football.

The FA need to deal with drugs, gambling and the shit attitude of most footballers before they start getting all high and mighty over a few songs.

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Sounds like someone's had a major common sense bypass...

 

Surely, the question is always: what was the person's intention when they used the word?

 

If a load of Spurs fans start shouting "Yid Army!" or whatever, presumably their intention is to say "we couldn't give a shit what you think, we're proud of who we are" (whether or not we happen to be Jewish). If someone runs into a synagogue shouting "I hate ****ing yids", then their intention is obviously very different.

 

Likewise, some black people call themselves "niggas" as a positive thing, out of bonding, defiance, solidarity or whatever. Some gay people, like the Outrage lot, deliberately call themselves "queers" for similar reasons....are they all to be arrested as racists or homophobes?!? Ridiculous.

 

Concentrate on the tiny minority who use such language with the intention of expressing hatred or causing fear or offence.

 

Even stuff like "where's your caravan?", "we can see you holding hands!" or "you fat bastard!" is just (very) mildly amusing silliness, really - unless it's addressed with hostile intent at someone who might be vulnerable (and I wouldn't include George Boyd, Craig Mackail-Smith, a couple of thousand Brighton fans or referees in the "vulnerable" category!)

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Is Yid that offensive anyway? I don't think I've ever heard anyone use the word against someone who isn't a Spurs supporter. It seems like making a fuss over something that just isn't a problem.

 

From wiki (believe it or not):

 

 

The word Yid (/ˈjd/Yiddishייִד)[clarification needed] is a slang Jewish ethnonym. Its usage may be controversial in modern English language. It is not usually considered offensive when pronounced /ˈjd/ (rhyming with deed), the way Yiddish speakers say it, though some may deem the word offensive nonetheless. When pronounced /ˈjɪd/ (rhyming with did), it can generally be perceived as a pejorative—and is used as a derogatory epithet by antisemites.[1]

Supporters of Tottenham Hotspur F.C. adopted the nickname "Yid" (or "Yiddo") and often identify as "Yid Army". Used as a badge of pride by the supporters of Tottenham Hotspur F.C. in support of the Jewish communities based near to the North London football club, such usage is not without controversy.

 

edit: there is a Spurs fan on here isn't there? Maybe he could enlighten us...

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My dog misbehaved the other day and I pointed at him and said in a stern voice, "NO. U NAUGHTY YID." He was appalled, my Mrs was appalled and yet strangely I felt no shame. Looking back though I was in the wrong, even though I meant no racism and just did it because I like to variety up the names I call him.

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I see your point - like, that would be the next step logically, but I'm not sure racial abuse and calling someone a fatty are comparable. There's an FA incentive to 'Kick Racism Out of Football' and the chant I mentioned above is precisely the sort of thing the campaign was set up to combat surely?

Maybe their next incentive could be 'kick fattism out of football!'

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If a load of Spurs fans start shouting "Yid Army!" or whatever, presumably their intention is to say "we couldn't give a shit what you think, we're proud of who we are" (whether or not we happen to be Jewish). If someone runs into a synagogue shouting "I hate ****ing yids", then their intention is obviously very different.

 

Likewise, some black people call themselves "niggas" as a positive thing, out of bonding, defiance, solidarity or whatever. Some gay people, like the Outrage lot, deliberately call themselves "queers" for similar reasons....are they all to be arrested as racists or homophobes?!? Ridiculous.

 

There's an argument for it to be used with care, even attempts to be using negative words positively can be painfully awkward, especially in situations like this where its a case where the majority of the people aren't the ones being referenced. To use your "nigga" analogy, if you've got a bunch of friends in a room who are mostly black guys who use that word, maybe they wouldn't be bothered if a friend who is white uses it in the conversation. If they then go out and start talking outside to someone they don't know, the white guy could quite easily offend people.

The David Baddiel piece that started all this off really made my skin crawl, though - it started off as "be more sensitive, not everyone treats it as a 'reclaimed' word" but quickly descended into being almost like using it as a root cause of problems he'd encountered. The parts where he ended up talking about the anti-semetism he'd seen watching Chelsea, it was like watching someone talking about how someone had "provoked" their abusive partner. It was properly uncomfortable viewing.

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