Time for clubs to kick categorisation into Row Z - FSF

[davieG]

The football ticket office is home to many a fan’s most frustrating moments and one of its most annoying policies is match “categorisation” - a subject raised at the FSF update events in Manchester and London earlier this year.

Clubs categorise matches A, B, and C based on the level of opposition - or the number of tickets they think they can sell - and prices are bumped up accordingly.

While categorisation often applies to both home and away fans, many of the former are season ticket holders who pay a set price and aren’t affected on a regular basis (although if you’re skint and pay match-by-match, you’ll know about it).

Away fans are far more likely to have something to say on categorisation, especially if they support a “big” side who are Category A wherever they visit. Fans of that club will pay a lot more to follow their side over the course of the season.

Categorisation was one of the big driving factors behind Manchester City fans’ protests when visiting the Emirates in January 2013. The game was Category A which meant individual match tickets cost up to £62.

Arsenal were vilified for that price and it was enough to kickstart the FSF’s Twenty’s Plenty for Away Tickets campaign. If Arsenal had only priced all away tickets as Category C prices (£25.50 in 2012/13) there would have been no such protest.

It’s not unknown to hear the counter-argument that Club X is loaded, so who cares if they pay through the nose for tickets? It’s a deeply flawed position for one very obvious reason, neatly summed up by FSF Chair Malcolm Clarke.

"This business of categorising matches is blatantly unfair. Just because Manchester City have a lot of money doesn't mean their supporters have, and the same is true of the other teams who get charged the highest prices every time they play," Malcolm told The Independent.

As Sunderland fan Paul Dobson, who emailed the FSF ahead of last season’s trip to Villa Park said, “Why should I pay more than, say, a Norwich fan to sit in the same seat at Villa Park, and why should a Man U fan pay more than me?”

Categorisation doesn’t just apply to top-flight clubs either, it’s not uncommon to hear from fans of Football League clubs unhappy with the prices they pay at away games. Huddersfield Town fans boycotted a game at Bramall Lane a few seasons ago after they were charged double what Bury fans paid.

What can I do?

Fans will also march on Premier League and Football League demanding “Affordable football for all!” on Thursday 14th August 2014. The FSF will lead fans from dozens of clubs demanding that ticket prices are reduced. Save the date!

Supporters will meet at a central London location at 1pm to hear from prominent voices in the fan movement before marching on the Premier League and Football League HQ at 30 Gloucester Place (W1U 8PL).

Join the FSF demonstration and make sure football hears your voice. Please notify us of your attendance so we can let the authorities know expected numbers. No personal details will be shared. Email: [email protected].

There’s plenty to get involved with, depending on what appeals to you. Every club is different so there’s no “one size fits all” model, but there’s a range of ideas here. If you’re a fan and have any other campaign ideas email [email protected].

What is Away Fans Matter?

Away Fans Matter is the umbrella term for the FSF’s campaign work that champions the cause of the away fan, and it takes on many different forms. Supporters who travel away from home know there’s a whole host of issues which can make or break their day, and categorisation falls under this.

As part of Away Fans Matter we’ve met with the Football League and spoke to all 72 clubs on the importance of welcoming away fans and improving service. The Away Fans Survey 2013-14 also made a splash, with more than 5,300 fans sharing their matchday experiences.

However, if there’s one issue that unites fans like no other it’s the cost of actually getting into the match. High prices are a blight on our game throughout the leagues and it’s not just top-flight fans who contact the FSF to remonstrate about pricing.

The weekend after Twenty’s Plenty was launched in 2013 we looked at on-the-gate prices for League Two - at five out of eight away ends you wouldn’t have got change from £20.

Clubs such as Barnsley and Derby County have implemented reciprocal ‘Twenty’s Plenty’ style deals along with Cardiff City, Hull City, Liverpool, Newcastle United, Norwich City, Swansea City, and West Bromwich Albion.

It was the strength of feeling about the importance of away fans that formed the background to the Premier League’s Away Fans’ Initiative. That’s £12m over three years to make games more affordable for away fans, equating to £200,000 per club, per season.

Clubs have spent their dosh on a range of initiatives and, from the feedback received, by far the most popular offers have been those which subsidise away tickets or travel. See this link for the full list of deals we know of from last year and let the FSF know what your club does throughout 2014/15.

• Twenty’s Plenty has made a difference by securing cheaper tickets for 10,000s of away fans but there’s still a long way to go. If you’re a fan and have any other campaign ideas email [email protected].

- See more at: http://www.fsf.org.uk/blog/view/Time-for-clubs-to-kick-categorisation-into-Row-Z#sthash.JHkIn47K.dpuf

[Captain...]

Simple economics, supply and demand, it isn't that Man City as a club has more money, they have more fans so greater demand, hence higher prices.

[leicsmac]

Yup, football (particularly at the highest level) sold it's soul to the devil in the $$$ jacket long ago. Probably when the BSkyB deal was first put across and the First Division became the Prem.

 

No going back now, unless the whole system collapses somehow.

[Jon the Hat]

If they can sell tickets at those prices then there is clearly not a problem.

[leicsmac]

If they can sell tickets at those prices then there is clearly not a problem.

 

There is a problem in that many of the people who genuinely appreciate the game are being priced out, but economically? No, no problem.

[C-man]

If they can sell tickets at those prices then there is clearly not a problem.

 

Why does this post not surprise me in the slightest given your politics?

 

Football MUST remain affordable for all. Whether or not clubs can sell tickets at price £x is irrelevant. This blatant social cleansing of football has to stop as it is completely unfair and will certainly result in youngsters becoming disinterested in playing the game.

[Jon the Hat]

Why does this post not surprise me in the slightest given your politics?

 

Football MUST remain affordable for all. Whether or not clubs can sell tickets at price £x is irrelevant. This blatant social cleansing of football has to stop as it is completely unfair and will certainly result in youngsters becoming disinterested in playing the game.

 

Professional Football has never been afordable for all, and never will be.  This is nothing to do with social cleansing either.  You dont have a right to be able to see your football team.  If you want a community club then find or create one - it will no doubt save you a fortune.

[Captain...]

There are many factors that have lead to this situation, one of them being FFP rules, clubs are being forced to maximize their revenue, which means squeezing every penny out of the fans and higher prices and empty seats will be preferable to full stadia but lower revenue.

[Guest MattP]

Why does this post not surprise me in the slightest given your politics?

Football MUST remain affordable for all. Whether or not clubs can sell tickets at price £x is irrelevant. This blatant social cleansing of football has to stop as it is completely unfair and will certainly result in youngsters becoming disinterested in playing the game.

Why?

People don't have a right to watch football.

[C-man]

Professional Football has never been afordable for all, and never will be.  This is nothing to do with social cleansing either.  You dont have a right to be able to see your football team.  If you want a community club then find or create one - it will no doubt save you a fortune.

 

Maybe it hasn't but in my opinion you have to be pretty blinkered to think that the 1000% above inflation increase in ticket prices since Hillsborough is entirely down to the introduction of all-seater stadia and 'a better product'. The fact is football clubs have taken a decision to rid their grounds of common folk because the wealthy are less likely to be hooligans and more likely to buy a load of shite in the club shop.

 

Are you really saying that only rich people should be able to go and watch football?

[purpleronnie]

The really sad thing is most fans seem to worship their owners despite the high ticket prices,.

[Grandad.]

Someone compare the Premier League to the Bundesliga..

[Nalis]

As said above, its all about supply and demand. Why would the owners reduce tickets prices when they know they'll be sold at a higher price anyway. These guys are businessmen at the end of the day.

Their argument would also be backed up than with higher ticket prices come more expensive/better players and therefore more likelihood of more success on the pitch.

For that reason, and an unromantic as it sounds, twenty's plenty will never be effected by the clubs alone. unless the FA/Premier League enforced it.

[Bayfox]

I have no problem with Arsenal and Man City charging home fans what they think they can get away with.

For example if we go to Man City and are not a massive draw for pay on the day fans, fine reduce prices. If they know Man Ud are coming fine charge whatever you can get people to pay. But how many of those away fans are going to see Man City.

I think our owners pitched our season ticket prices about right. I don't mind paying the £415 to watch my team, however this is the problem with away pricing, I am going to Chelsea, to watch Leicester City not Chelsea. Yet £47 pound compared to just over £20 to watch my team play at home. Crazy.

I think we have be realistic, you are never going to get a flat £20 across the board for all clubs, I mean leeds have been charging £38 quid for a long while, but I would think, most premier league clubs could cap it at £30 for example.

[Trav Le Bleu]

There are many factors that have lead to this situation, one of them being FFP rules, clubs are being forced to maximize their revenue, which means squeezing every penny out of the fans and higher prices and empty seats will be preferable to full stadia but lower revenue.

 

lower wages, less extravagant transfer fees?

[Narborough_fox]

As said above, its all about supply and demand. Why would the owners reduce tickets prices when they know they'll be sold at a higher price anyway. These guys are businessmen at the end of the day.

Their argument would also be backed up than with higher ticket prices come more expensive/better players and therefore more likelihood of more success on the pitch.

For that reason, and an unromantic as it sounds, twenty's plenty will never be effected by the clubs alone. unless the FA/Premier League enforced it.

 

I was trying not to get the Bundesliga involved, but...

 

 

I know there a lot of differences in the whole mindset in Germany and England but if Germany can charge reasonable prices then why can't England? 

[Grandad.]

And there we go.. 

 

God bless the Germans. 

[C-man]

Someone compare the Premier League to the Bundesliga..

 

I swear you are always first in with the Bundesliga comments Loft. haha

[Grandad.]

I swear you are always first in with the Bundesliga comments Loft. haha

 

Yeah because it is so obvious where these discussions are going to end up mate, every single time a thread about the money in the Premier League crops up, the Bundesliga is brought up. Pointless. 

[Jon the Hat]

I was trying not to get the Bundesliga involved, but...

 

 

I know there a lot of differences in the whole mindset in Germany and England but if Germany can charge reasonable prices then why can't England? 

 

Of course Uli wasnt paying his taxes, so that might explain his lassaiz-faire attitude to money.

[Jon the Hat]

Maybe it hasn't but in my opinion you have to be pretty blinkered to think that the 1000% above inflation increase in ticket prices since Hillsborough is entirely down to the introduction of all-seater stadia and 'a better product'. The fact is football clubs have taken a decision to rid their grounds of common folk because the wealthy are less likely to be hooligans and more likely to buy a load of shite in the club shop.

 

Are you really saying that only rich people should be able to go and watch football?

 

I am saying you should pay the going rate for the the things you want to do, and if you cant afford it, you should save until you can.  Football is no different to any other leisure activity in this regard.  There are I might add plenty of local teams who are crying out for support, so there are plenty of matches to see.

[leicsmac]

I am saying you should pay the going rate for the the things you want to do, and if you cant afford it, you should save until you can.  Football is no different to any other leisure activity in this regard.  There are I might add plenty of local teams who are crying out for support, so there are plenty of matches to see.

 

Money shouldn't be the sole reason for the entitlement to see a team you have followed all your life play. 

 

But I guess (at the high level) that's the way that it's gone. 

 

Presenting a guy who has been priced out after following a team all his life when they hit the big time with the illusion of choice regarding either 'pay your way or watch a different club' and the economic argument that 'it's good for the club' (which ostensibly it is, if you believe a club constantly looking for more money as a business model is a good thing), doesn't exactly fill him with gratitude and isn't exactly a nice way to repay the support he's given.

 

Football is a cultural phenomenon in this country, it isn't just another leisure activity. 

 

Oh, and given ticket prices haven't exactly risen in line with wages, how is one supposed to continue saving for such things when the prices are rising far faster than the equivalent mean wages?

[C-man]

I am saying you should pay the going rate for the the things you want to do, and if you cant afford it, you should save until you can.  Football is no different to any other leisure activity in this regard.  There are I might add plenty of local teams who are crying out for support, so there are plenty of matches to see.

 

Clearly there is a massive difference between, let's say, going swimming or playing golf and watching football. As leicsmac says, football fandom is a cultural phenomenon. Currently the market is taking advantage of this and its patrons' loyalty.

 

I don't know you or what you earn from Adam but if the current rate of increase continues there's a fairly good chance in 15 years you won't be able to afford to go and watch Leicester City - a team that I assume you have followed for your whole life - is that something you will just accept?

[Liam Boyall]

[Fox92]

I'm all for demonstrating and even attending meetings in Manchester, or whatever. It's ridiculous now, and I do not understand how clubs can justify what they charge. They cannot. Football in this Country is ridiculous, from the setup at the FA to the horrid Premier League (I will love it if we went back to divisions 1, 2, 3 and 4).